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New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88

 
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New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/23/2016 11:54:37 PM   
MichaelJCuozzo

 

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Hi everybody.

I'm working on a new scenario and am presenting version 1.1 for beta testing. Convoy '88 places the player in the role of a convoy commander in the North Atlantic during a hypothetical NATO-Warsaw Pact conflict in Europe set in 1988. The scenario is 24 hours long and the goal is to give players a look at the issues that might have faced a convoy commander. This version is ASW heavy. However, in future variants, an air threat (Backfires) could be included.

This is an early beta version so scoring and such have not been put into the scenario yet.

Feedback is always welcomed.

Enjoy!

Mike

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/24/2016 12:03:13 AM   
SSN754planker


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right down my alley.....

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ST1/SS SSN 754

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/24/2016 4:51:34 PM   
MichaelJCuozzo

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SSN754planker

right down my alley.....


Great. Hope you enjoy it, Topeka! :)

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/24/2016 9:39:29 PM   
AlexGGGG

 

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Are you sure the timing is correct? I have reached about half of the plotted course at 12 kts (default speed), and ran out of time, having sunk 8 subs.

Also why not have Quick Turnaround enabled on helos from the start?

< Message edited by AlexGGGG -- 3/24/2016 10:38:01 PM >

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/25/2016 2:42:42 AM   
MichaelJCuozzo

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: AlexGGGG

Are you sure the timing is correct? I have reached about half of the plotted course at 12 kts (default speed), and ran out of time, having sunk 8 subs.

Also why not have Quick Turnaround enabled on helos from the start?


I'll check the timing. If you got half way through the plotted course at 12 kts, that shouldn't be right. But you sank 8 subs so good work :)

QT should have been enabled. I'm sorry if I left it out. I'll adjust it in the next version.

Thanks for the information. :)

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/25/2016 8:23:40 AM   
magi

 

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im gonna check his out... will add QT...

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/28/2016 2:35:28 AM   
apache85

 

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Great scenario; I really enjoyed it.

Here's expenditures and kills:

quote:


SIDE: Blue
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
21x AN/SSQ-62B DICASS
15x Mk46 NEARTIP Mod 5
21x AN/SSQ-53B DIFAR
6x RIM-67C SM-2ER Blk II
4x 76mm/62 Compact HE Burst [4 rnds]
3x RIM-66E SM-1MR Blk VI
4x 20mm/85 Mk15 Phalanx Blk 0 Burst [200 rnds]
4x RIM-7M Sea Sparrow
4x Mk182 SRBOC Chaff [Seduction]
2x RIM-67B SM-2ER Blk I



SIDE: Red
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
1x PLARK-670M Charlie II [Skat-M]
1x PLA-705K Alfa [Lira]
1x PLA-671RTM Victor III [Shchuka]
1x Tu-95RT Bear D
1x PLA-945 Sierra I [Barrakuda]
1x PLA-685 Mike [Plavnik]
1x PLARK-675K Echo II


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
12x Generic Acoustic Decoy
2x Generic Chaff Salvo [4x Cartridges]
8x SS-N-3a Shaddock [P-6, ASM]
2x Generic Acoustic Decoy



The Victor III was a tough customer; he got lucky with a few decoy and hit rolls. I think it took something like 6-7 torps to sink him (2 hits).

I like the setting and force composition; I'm familiar with the Perry and Spruance but not the Knox, Farragut, Adams or Leahy so I learned a bit about them.

Tactics wise I formed up the convoy with 4nm (based on practical range for Soviet WH torps vs keeping the formation together for protection) spacing between merchants in a box formation with the Leahy at the front of the merchant formation. I set a Spruance and Perry to screen ahead at the first convergence zone (33nm), while the Farragut took up the rear and the Adams sat in the centre of the formation. A Knox was allocated to the northern flank at about 15nm and the second Perry kept close to the Leahy. I didn't use the helo's to screen as the Spruance and Perry up front were doing an excellent job with sprint-drift and towed array. All helo's were used for manual prosecution of goblins detected by sonar (I noticed close-in visual detections by merchants were all false contacts, which adds nice flavour).

I didn't suffer any losses, although a surprise SS-N-3 strike by the Echo SSGN gave the crew on the forward Perry a real fright, the final missile in the volley being taken out by CIWS.

The Red air and satellite recon feels balanced in that I know I'm being watched, but there's exploitable gaps and countermeasures that can be taken (EMCON in particular).

As noted above the scenario ended about 1/2 way, peeking in the editor there's another three subs present ahead of the convoy.

Suggestions:
The helos are a huge advantage for the USN; restricting them somehow might make the scenario more challenging. This could be done by setting some to maintenance, removing 'quick turnaround' for some units (maybe the newer seahawks need a bit more care before getting back in the air?), changing some units from 'surge' to 'sustained' op tempo, or limiting torps carried in magazines.

All of the SSNs I came across were charging at the convoy at full speed; if they could be limited to slower speeds they would be much more dangerous--provided they can get in position.

Not sure if it fits actual wartime doctrine, but diesel boats might be a solution to the above.

Adding friendly subs might make the scenario a bit more challenging and force the player to be more cautious; as it stands my doctrine is if it moves over 4kts it dies. Having to ID a sub would make things a bit more tense.

Some weather variance; I can help you script this with lua if you like.

Randomised biologics and false contacts, again I can help you script this with lua if you like.



All in all a great scen, I really enjoyed my playthrough and I'm sure it'll be very popular. Great work!

(in reply to magi)
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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/28/2016 4:59:05 AM   
magi

 

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^^^perty much what apache says... my formation was set up a little different than his... the sprunce ahead on the PIM sprint and drift.. the perry's back a little on its flanks... the knox's rear guard trailing the convoy... i had the three leading units on a decent asw spread... everthing ncom b... so when the missiles came at the nicholas they were pretty close when everybody light up... it defeated or destroyed all but one... and took a hit... lost its hull sonar and damaged it flight facilities... but no fire/no flooding...

the oh perry's were such s fine useful ship for their times... and they served us well... a shame we dont have a able frigate to take their place...

my group generally cruised at 12 kts... after any event wherein my group was located... i made some course change... only one red sub was close on my pim... the rest ran down on me from the north....

i did have an ASW patrol/screen... mostly to pounce on a contact quickly.... the sprunce sensor suite was a marvel and made the majority of the contacts... very sweat asset....

here is my butchers bill:
SIDE: Blue
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
34x AN/SSQ-62B DICASS
53x AN/SSQ-53B DIFAR
17x Mk46 NEARTIP Mod 5
5x RIM-67C SM-2ER Blk II
1x 20mm/85 Mk15 Phalanx Blk 0 Burst [200 rnds]
8x 76mm/62 Compact HE Burst [4 rnds]
3x RIM-66E SM-1MR Blk VI
8x Mk182 SRBOC Chaff [Seduction]
2x RIM-67B SM-2ER Blk I



SIDE: Red
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
1x PLARK-670M Charlie II [Skat-M]
1x PLA-705K Alfa [Lira]
1x PLA-671RTM Victor III [Shchuka]
1x Tu-95RT Bear D
1x PLA-685 Mike [Plavnik]
1x PLARK-675K Echo II
1x PLA-945 Sierra I [Barrakuda]


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
10x Generic Acoustic Decoy
1x Generic Chaff Salvo [4x Cartridges]
8x SS-N-3a Shaddock [P-6, ASM]
6x Generic Acoustic Decoy

i really enjoyed this but wished there was a little more to do.... maybe a red air strike would be fun.... yup yup...

you should have some of the red units start random so its more fun to play multiple times... and some of their patrol areas should be in front of the pim so they may not come screaming in....


i wonder if some could be set up in pairs/groups at different depths.... that could be interesting....

< Message edited by magi -- 3/28/2016 5:23:51 AM >

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/28/2016 3:39:39 PM   
MichaelJCuozzo

 

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Apache and Magi, I really appreciate the in-depth feedback. Looks like 1.1 was a cakewalk. Neither one of you incurred any losses on the merchies or escorts. It seems like we think along the same lines, guys. A lot of the suggestions that you made were also floating around in my head and I've started on the revisions already. Expect to see some of the suggestions come to life. :)

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/28/2016 8:25:05 PM   
magi

 

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If there was more of an air threat.... It would change the tactical management of the formation... It would force the ASW screen to pull back some... reducing its coverage area.... and possible creating the need for an AAW picket to the north.... Which would be vernable....

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/29/2016 12:26:10 AM   
MichaelJCuozzo

 

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I promise, I haven't forgotten about the Backfires. LOL I wanted to start the scenario with an ASW foundation and then add on the other pieces from there. The Kola airfields and Keflavik are on there for a reason. :) I'll post the next revised version tomorrow or Wed. morning

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/29/2016 4:06:37 PM   
Patmanaut


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(Please, those who haven´t played this scenario, don´t read this. Some spoiler inside.)

Hi

I´ve played this scenario last weekend.
Everything went easy in the beginning, as the subs attacking piecemeal, without coordination.
After having sunk 5 of them, a Mike class SSN showed up and chaos ensued.
This SSN just limited itself to go to 700 mts deep and chased the convoy at 25kts, firing all its USET-80 torps from that depth.
I believed that was impossible, but the DB states 700mts as its launch limit. Good thing it could only sink 3 transports.
The convoy and escort fled in dissarray, even after having fired 8 x Mk 46 from helos and probably 10 from ASROC automatically in self defense.
Since the Mk-46s couldn´t reach the Mike´s depth, they only worked as a temporary threat, making the SSN to run away, but it resumed pursuit after the ASW torps worn off their batteries.
You could leave the scenario as it is, it´s good to lure the player into a false security of an apparent easy transit, and then, Mike´s nasty surprise.
I´ll be waiting for the Naval Aviation attack to see how the convoy cope with an air threat.
I´ve enjoyed it despite it´s still work in progress.

Thank you.


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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/30/2016 2:23:31 AM   
MichaelJCuozzo

 

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Okay guys, here's the first revision to the scenario. Convoy '88 Version 1.2 I've started making changes and additions. I haven't included everything just yet, but this is a step in the right direction.

Changes included in Version 1.2 are as follows......

Game time has been changed from 24 hours to 36 hours

Convoy helo detachments have been altered. Some helicopters are now down for maintenance and are unavailable for the duration of the scenario.

Red sub positions and doctrines have been updated.

Red Tu-95 patrol sectors have been altered.

An air threat has been included. Now the convoy commander will have to contend with a two dimensional threat.


Enjoy and as always, feedback is welcomed! :)

Attachment (1)

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/30/2016 2:25:22 AM   
MichaelJCuozzo

 

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Patman, I was hoping that the Mike would cause an issue like that. And you're right about the false sense of security. The threats can pop up at a moment's notice and provides a challenge for the player.

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/30/2016 5:45:35 AM   
magi

 

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oh... thank you... just played it again today... double do it now...

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/30/2016 6:00:02 AM   
magi

 

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your group formation is schizophrenic.....

im zulu 11:03... much more challanging... really enjoying it... just had a great fight with Alpha....


< Message edited by magi -- 3/30/2016 8:22:59 AM >

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/30/2016 9:39:23 PM   
magi

 

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at zulu 17:19:... aprox i counted 18 backfire b's.... come in... they light up... got under 200nm of my group... hung around for a while... turned around and went home... they were supported by a bear d... they should have had a decent enough solution to launch.... ..???

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/31/2016 4:02:44 AM   
magi

 

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ok.... i looked at the mission 'backfire raid from the red side... the patrol area and the prosecution area were the same and my group was out side of it.... so the flight bingoed and went home.... i have made a separate prosecution area for the mission and gonna play some more...

this is going to be fun....

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/31/2016 4:31:13 AM   
magi

 

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wow.... that was cool.....

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 3/31/2016 5:50:36 PM   
MichaelJCuozzo

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: magi

wow.... that was cool.....


The air threat makes it all the more interesting, eh? LOL

I see what you're talking about with the Backfire raid. If the convoy doesn't enter the patrol box by the time the Backfires show up nothing happens. I think I either have to emphasize speed for the convoy commander (In reality it would be a 20kt convoy) or fiddle with the Backfire raid a bit more. Chances are I'll fiddle.

The group formation does go schizo to an extent. They maneuver to evade attacks and then regroup. Sometimes it can take a little while and the player has to make sure they build speed back up once regrouped.

Kind of exciting when you're focused on prosecuting a sub and the Backfires show up, isn't it?

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 4/1/2016 4:00:00 AM   
magi

 

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the air threat makes it far more tactically challenging... and more fun...

i only lost a knox... but it was a very close run deal... a dozen missiles flu by the ddg kidd on the northern flank of the group and went for the convoy.. which was very interesting that targeting was decrimnite.... the kidd used all its missiles .... and the leahy.. which performed very well had only 13 sm-2er's left... by shifting units around they could possibly survive another strike... but not without considerable losses...

when i played i did swap out the farragut for a kidd class which is a little more able... because they have always been one of my favorites in this period....

to make the strike work.. i simply made a large prosecution area around the patrol area extending more to the west and checked the box to investagate contacts....

the cruising for the some of the large commercial vessels in the group is 12 knots.... the slowest vessel will dictate cruise speed... and so will tatics... id rather not cruise above 15-18 knots as it puts the group at great risk.... my fight with alfa was evolved and protracted till i got it... in the process it fired a spread of torpedoes that caused everyone to scatter... the event really slowed the party down....

i personally do not believe an overly conservative game time should supersede reasonable doctrine/tactics... if you really want to challenge the group more... a second strike.. even if it was smaller would certainly would cause casualties...

< Message edited by magi -- 4/1/2016 4:26:54 AM >

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 4/1/2016 4:24:31 AM   
magi

 

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no.... your group formation is chaotic... you need to run til everybody's pointing i the same direction.... then place the units where you want them with the editor...

i would turn... merge range-symbols.. on...

< Message edited by magi -- 4/1/2016 4:29:54 AM >

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 4/1/2016 5:10:14 AM   
magi

 

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here is an example of how i arranged the formation.... and the prosecution zone for the strike...

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by magi -- 4/1/2016 5:17:22 AM >

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 4/1/2016 2:27:59 PM   
Skjold

 

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Won the mission with zero casulties, if Backfires ever were meant to show up they didn't. 6 Soviet submarinesa and 2 Bears down.

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 4/1/2016 4:33:11 PM   
MichaelJCuozzo

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: magi

here is an example of how i arranged the formation.... and the prosecution zone for the strike...


Nice set up. :)

Thanks for the suggestions and observations. We definitely think along the same lines. I'll post another revised version Sunday night. Hope you enjoy it

(in reply to magi)
Post #: 25
RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 4/1/2016 4:33:51 PM   
MichaelJCuozzo

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Skjold

Won the mission with zero casulties, if Backfires ever were meant to show up they didn't. 6 Soviet submarinesa and 2 Bears down.


Yeah, I'll work on the Backfire issue. When they show up, they can change the dynamic of the whole game.

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 4/2/2016 5:32:14 AM   
magi

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mikewritesfic


quote:

ORIGINAL: magi

here is an example of how i arranged the formation.... and the prosecution zone for the strike...


Nice set up. :)

Thanks for the suggestions and observations. We definitely think along the same lines. I'll post another revised version Sunday night. Hope you enjoy it


Okidokie

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 4/2/2016 6:05:57 PM   
Gizzmoe


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Thanks for your scenario, Mike! One of the things I liked is that you put in a lot of marine life/false target into the mission.

May I suggest that you limit the Attack Throttle in the Convoy Attack mission? The subs cavitate like hell once they detect the convoy.

< Message edited by Gizzmoe -- 4/2/2016 6:08:44 PM >

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 4/2/2016 6:06:59 PM   
Gizzmoe


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<deleted>


< Message edited by Gizzmoe -- 4/2/2016 6:07:56 PM >

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RE: New Scenario For Testing: Convoy '88 - 4/4/2016 7:39:40 AM   
magi

 

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i played this a second tine... and the backfire raid was more effective.... one of the commercial was sunk another was hit and i was going to have to cut it loose... all the missiles were used on my leahy and my kidd ntu.... i will have to rearrange my group... the perry's and the admans will have to do the aaw work now... and i will have to bring everybody in closer...




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