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Convoy system completley unusable

 
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Convoy system completley unusable - 8/1/2015 1:41:15 PM   
Platon

 

Posts: 135
Joined: 5/16/2014
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v.1.4.5:

This complete **** how the production and convoysystem is still bugged makes me explode. Evey time the production windows opens this dammed ****ed Malayan resources are needlessly convoyed through the South China Sea instead of directly through the Bay of Bengal which is the shortest and obvious route to the UK ruining the complete resource line it took me two hours to build up.
Also what one plans in the Prod. Plan Preliminary is completely useless because in the Prod. Plan Final nothing is the same anymore albeit no changes to convoylines or any other have happened. Sent oil resources from Burma to China when the Burma Road is cut don't even appear in the resource lists of the CW or China anymore, even as idle, and have completely vanished mysteriously. Instead some randomly chosen other CW oil resource somewhere else in the world is set to idle without any information in the lists why, obviously marked as sent resource for China (of course most of the time the one in Port of Spain on the other side of the world, for what reason ever), devestatingly ruining the the planned convoy routes again.

This unbelievable heap of bugs more than two years after I made the grave error to buy this product is going to ruin my nervous system.
I am done with MWIF for good.

without kind regards

PS: I go with a former UK prime minister. I want my money back!
Post #: 1
RE: Convoy system completley unusable - 8/1/2015 3:26:40 PM   
paulderynck


Posts: 7993
Joined: 3/24/2007
From: Canada
Status: offline
If you follow this process you can get the production system to work quite adequately:

Set up Override routes for absolutely everything, even the ones that look good and you want to keep. Then hit Recompute when all are done. Then one by one, change each Override setting to the exact same Default and one-by-one hit Recompute. You may even be able to just hit Recompute the one time at the end of that second step, but I'm describing what worked for me. May seem like a lot of effort but puts you in entire control of where things are going for the rest of the game.

From then on if things need to change due to developing game conditions, you can choose between a one turn Override or using the process above - selectively - to establish new defaults.


_____________________________

Paul

(in reply to Platon)
Post #: 2
RE: Convoy system completley unusable - 8/1/2015 5:18:34 PM   
rkr1958


Posts: 20307
Joined: 5/21/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: paulderynck

If you follow this process you can get the production system to work quite adequately:

Set up Override routes for absolutely everything, even the ones that look good and you want to keep. Then hit Recompute when all are done. Then one by one, change each Override setting to the exact same Default and one-by-one hit Recompute. You may even be able to just hit Recompute the one time at the end of that second step, but I'm describing what worked for me. May seem like a lot of effort but puts you in entire control of where things are going for the rest of the game.

From then on if things need to change due to developing game conditions, you can choose between a one turn Override or using the process above - selectively - to establish new defaults.

This is essentially what I do. It takes a bit of work up front to get the routes set and fixed as you want but once you do that things seem to work well for me from then on.


_____________________________

Ronnie

(in reply to paulderynck)
Post #: 3
RE: Convoy system completley unusable - 8/4/2015 4:53:42 PM   
gw15


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Joined: 3/21/2010
Status: offline
Convoy system works great for me. Could it be easier to use, probably, but it does work.

(in reply to rkr1958)
Post #: 4
RE: Convoy system completley unusable - 8/4/2015 5:29:40 PM   
palne


Posts: 73
Joined: 9/18/2007
Status: offline
I can't figure out how to EXACTLY perform the "override" function. I also can't give the Burma Oil to China, or Philippines RES to China....(because of my ignorance of the convoy system--not because of other reasons like no US convoys ((2 needed)) from PI to West side of Burma Road. UK is sending an oil from canada to China (or trying)....


(in reply to gw15)
Post #: 5
RE: Convoy system completley unusable - 8/4/2015 7:14:06 PM   
gravyhair

 

Posts: 160
Joined: 3/15/2003
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It's easily the worst part of the design. Hard to believe someone thinks it's a good idea. :-/

_____________________________

Wise Men Still Seek Him

(in reply to palne)
Post #: 6
RE: Convoy system completley unusable - 8/4/2015 9:06:24 PM   
palne


Posts: 73
Joined: 9/18/2007
Status: offline
I've made my share of video games....and I can tell you with certainty, the current convoy system is neither as-designed nor as-wanted. But, I agree it was better to release the game, than stall the game's release.

But, what we as players can do, is help ourselves make the gaming experience better by passing useful information around. For example, the step-by-step to deal with the clunky convoy system. Here's a contribution from me:

Rules changes:

1. eliminate unlimited corp breakdown into divs. It opens a whole can of worms tactically. 3 divs ALWAYS takes an unoccupied hex. UK can use cruisers to go invade all kinds of places and automatically take hexes. Re-inforce the balkans? no problem; send 6 divs on cruisers from UK near the end of the turn. land them. At the end of the turn reform into corps (or not). I've invaded sardinia, corsica, and Sicily in june '41. What Japan and Italy can do is even worse to contemplate....

2. Is sicily home-country for Italy? If so, Palermo should be a home-country primary supply source. An italian nav in Syracuse was unable to reorganize during end of turn activities--I think because of the presence of UK ships in the Italian Coast (tracing supply across the straights of Messina while in the presence of the enemy). However, the ships shouldn't matter when tracing to Palermo, right?

3. USSR declared war on Japan and went and sank the USA-JPN conv chain--causing JPN to break the trade and giving USA 2-chits per turn! Either JPN should start with a few more conv's at game-start. Or, not have this rule in effect while JPN and USSR are at war. Fixing the USSR/JPN war/peace situation would be nice. My house-rule is this:

New Deplomatic Action for USSR: USSR demands cessation of Manchurian resource exploitation by JPN.

Japan Accepts: Must immediately idle 2 resources until JPN and USSR are at war. If JPN does not idle 2 resources, JPN must declare war on USSR next impulse.

Japan Declines: USSR immediately declares war on JPN.


These rules were created within the confines of current game coding and therefore are stated as they are. Without these rules, USSR goes to war with JPN if for no other reason than to get "land actions" and will likely save China during 1940's tough year. Add the USA conv chain as well as some heavy bombing runs in Japan, and boy...it can be tough on Japan in 1940. Incidentally, to get the heavy bombers back to East Front, the USSR player removes the pilots of the bombers in cities (Vladivostok) and next unit placement they show up in the Crimea.


< Message edited by palne -- 8/5/2015 5:59:38 AM >

(in reply to gravyhair)
Post #: 7
RE: Convoy system completley unusable - 8/4/2015 9:22:15 PM   
rkr1958


Posts: 20307
Joined: 5/21/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: palne

I've made my share of video games....and I can tell you with certainty, the current convoy system is neither as-designed nor as-wanted. But, I agree it was better to release the game, than stall the game's release.

But, what we as players can do, is help ourselves make the gaming experience better by passing useful information around. For example, the step-by-step to deal with the clunky convoy system. Here's a contribution from me:

Rules changes:

1. eliminate unlimited corp breakdown into divs. It opens a whole can of worms tactically. 3 divs ALWAYS takes an unoccupied hex. UK can use cruisers to go invade all kinds of places and automatically take hexes. Re-inforce the balkans? no problem; send 6 divs on cruisers from UK near the end of the turn. land them. At the end of the turn reform into corps (or not). I've invaded sardinia, corsica, and Sicily in june '41. What Japan and Italy can do is even worse to contemplate....

Unlimited corps breakdown is an optional rule. I don't like unlimited breakdown either, so I play without it. So I don't see the problem, or am I missing something?

_____________________________

Ronnie

(in reply to palne)
Post #: 8
RE: Convoy system completley unusable - 8/4/2015 9:38:55 PM   
palne


Posts: 73
Joined: 9/18/2007
Status: offline
No. Other than I don't think this should be an option. So much bad can happen vs. the good. My text was to bring to light what can happen when this is selected--instead of putting hours into a game before the play-balance effects become apparent....And, if one player knows about this "exploit" and the other doesn't....well it can be down right unchivalrous....(Hey...do you care if we play with unlimited div breakdown? ...Uhm..no I guess not.....((insert evil laugh))).

Dnieppe comes to mind when isolated units attempt random invasions at the 1-3 division size....

< Message edited by palne -- 8/4/2015 11:12:01 PM >

(in reply to rkr1958)
Post #: 9
RE: Convoy system completley unusable - 8/5/2015 12:18:51 AM   
paulderynck


Posts: 7993
Joined: 3/24/2007
From: Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: palne

I've made my share of video games....and I can tell you with certainty, the current convoy system is neither as-designed nor as-wanted. But, I agree it was better to release the game, than stall the game's release.

But, what we as players can do, is help ourselves make the gaming experience better by passing useful information around. For example, the step-by-step to deal with the clunky convoy system. Here's a contribution from me:

Rules changes:

1. eliminate unlimited corp breakdown into divs. It opens a whole can of worms tactically. 3 divs ALWAYS takes an unoccupied hex. UK can use cruisers to go invade all kinds of places and automatically take hexes. Re-inforce the balkans? no problem; send 6 divs on cruisers from UK near the end of the turn. land them. At the end of the turn reform into corps (or not). I've invaded sardinia, corsica, and Sicily in june '41. What Japan and Italy can do is even worse to contemplate....

2. Is sicily home-country for Italy? If so, Palermo should be a home-country primary supply source. An italian nav in Syracuse was unable to reorganize during end of turn activities--I think because of the presence of UK ships in the Italian Coast. However, the ships shouldn't matter when tracing to Palermo, right?

3. USSR declared war on Japan and went and sank the USA-JPN conv chain--causing JPN to break the trade and giving USA 2-chits per turn! Either JPN should start with a few more conv's at game-start. Or, not have this rule in effect while JPN and USSR are at war. Fixing the USSR/JPN war/peace situation would be nice. My house-rule is this:

New Deplomatic Action for USSR: USSR demands cessation of Manchurian resource exploitation by JPN.

Japan Accepts: Must immediately idle 2 resources until JPN and USSR are at war. If JPN does not idle 2 resources, JPN must declare war on USSR next impulse.

Japan Declines: USSR immediately declares war on JPN.


These rules were created within the confines of current game coding and therefore are stated as they are. Without these rules, USSR goes to war with JPN if for no other reason than to get "land actions" and will likely save China during 1940's tough year. Add the USA conv chain as well as some heavy bombing runs in Japan, and boy...it can be tough on Japan in 1940. Incidentally, to get the heavy bombers back to East Front, the USSR player removes the pilots of the bombers in cities (Vladivostok) and next unit placement they show up in the Crimea.


2. Probably playing oil and can't trace to any across the straits due to playing both Options 11 and 12. Don't use option 12.

3. This has always been an available ploy in the game. There are consequences for Russia too. And Japan should be aware of the possibility and guard against it by keeping a CP reserve.

_____________________________

Paul

(in reply to palne)
Post #: 10
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