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Soviet Admin points - 5/31/2015 11:38:03 PM   
chaos45

 

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Okay I noticed in the patch notes Soviet Armies basically get small as time goes on. No problem with this as they function more or less as big corps in the historical war.

However, Soviet High Command gets no Admin Points to address these pretty significant OOB changes unlike when you get a new Army/Front.

Example in my current game due to support unit limits and such most of my armies were at 24 Points of units for command and control. The in September the new rule takes affect and all my units are now over a 2x division. So basically it sucks up an entire months Admin points just to downsize the armies so you dont eat a command and control penalty.

Plus since its an odd number you have to move out two divisions and move in a BDE this is a huge admin task.

Perhaps in the next patch the Soviets should get a bonus admin bump of 10-20 on those months when the armies downsize to move units to other commands/stand up new commands.

Dont think this is asking for to much and makes some sense really as you are looking at needing to move something like 20 admin points worth of units or more on those downsize months.
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RE: Soviet Admin points - 6/1/2015 1:39:34 AM   
M60A3TTS


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You just plan for 18 CP from the beginning. Forget it's higher at the start.

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RE: Soviet Admin points - 6/1/2015 4:36:11 AM   
chaos45

 

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You could, but why should u have to...also its very inefficient with your limited early forces to go with 18. You should just get an adjustment of AP like you do when new armies/fronts come in to re-arrange your forces makes the most logical sense...not ohh its a game constraint so fight inefficiently.

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RE: Soviet Admin points - 6/1/2015 6:25:15 AM   
charlie0311

 

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"Screwed up my aps, couldn't count hqbu, Pelton is crushing me, boo-hoo, boo-hoo, rewrite the rules"

I have exclusive rights to that song, so stop, or I will have to call my lawyer :).

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RE: Soviet Admin points - 6/1/2015 6:42:48 AM   
morvael


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I go with 21 CP per army from the start therefore the first drop is not a problem and then the second drop is less of an issue.

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RE: Soviet Admin points - 6/1/2015 6:57:50 AM   
loki100


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quote:

ORIGINAL: chaos45

You could, but why should u have to...also its very inefficient with your limited early forces to go with 18. You should just get an adjustment of AP like you do when new armies/fronts come in to re-arrange your forces makes the most logical sense...not ohh its a game constraint so fight inefficiently.


actually the 24 is never a good idea. Each Soviet army has too few support elements to properly support the equivalent of 12 rifle divisions, so your army is operating inefficiently if you fill out that early CP cap.

From a support point of view (ie the support level not the named Support Units like artillery etc), I reckon the ideal is nearer to 15 CP worth of combat units but you'll not get near this till late 1943 and there are other reasons why its not a good idea in its own right (mainly that you want to make the best use of your few excellent commanders).

Don't worry about meeting the 18 in the autumn of 1941, you'll still be losing enough units in pockets etc that armies will shift size all the time. I rarely find I have much of an admin pt load to deal with any that over the 18 CP limit.

btw it is pretty realistic. The Soviets did work out that too large an army was unwieldy, both from a command process concept and also that it ended up with multiple objectives. They worked on a unity of objective model so each army/front had a single goal. If circumstances meant it had more than 1, they often split it. Good eg of this was Koniev's 1 Ukrainian around Lvov in 1944. He was pushing into the Carpathians and into SE Poland so Stavka split his command and re-activated 4 Ukrainian (which had been dismantled after the end of the Crimean battles) to handle the Carpathian campaign.

< Message edited by loki100 -- 6/1/2015 8:39:41 AM >


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RE: Soviet Admin points - 6/1/2015 11:40:24 AM   
chaos45

 

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Oh I dont feel im being crushed, no yet anyway.

My point is that patches changed a basic rule the game started with and an admin boost, just a slight one is warranted and realistic for the Soviet side in the early game based on that.

I dont feel the Soviets deserve a ton of admin extra just enough to make up for the changes to their OOB in the same way a new Army/Front entering the game does.


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RE: Soviet Admin points - 6/1/2015 1:12:10 PM   
loki100


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From: Utlima Thule
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quote:

ORIGINAL: chaos45

...
My point is that patches changed a basic rule the game started with and an admin boost, just a slight one is warranted and realistic for the Soviet side in the early game based on that.

I dont feel the Soviets deserve a ton of admin extra just enough to make up for the changes to their OOB in the same way a new Army/Front entering the game does.




not true I'm afraid, well at least not for the recent patches. I first played WiTE under an early set of 1.07 patches (forget the exact number) and the 24/21/18 CP sequence was in the game at that stage. But as above, if you stack up an army to 24CP it will operate inefficiently as you'll be spreading your support units pretty thinly.

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RE: Soviet Admin points - 6/1/2015 1:18:02 PM   
morvael


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Yes, 24/21/18 is a very old feature, perhaps even from the 1.00 - 1.03 period.

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RE: Soviet Admin points - 6/1/2015 1:18:57 PM   
morvael


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You get a lot of AP when fronts arrive. You may keep some in reserve for division reallocation.

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RE: Soviet Admin points - 6/30/2015 9:43:03 PM   
wga8888


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Perhaps Chaos45 is only 'mostly crushed'; not the same thing as being crushed.

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