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RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended TechTree) [WIP]

 
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RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 2/5/2015 1:42:50 AM   
Bamilus


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Locarnus is a perfect example of why the United States is screwed in 50 years. My generation and those coming up are the most entitled ****s I have ever seen. "If I can't have it, no one will!"

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RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 2/5/2015 3:11:14 AM   
Unforeseen


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Yeah that mindset is a complete contradiction of the principles in which this nation was founded. Everyone is supposed to be helping each other, not short sightedly focusing on advancing themselves and trying to be better than everyone else. This is exactly why the economy can't even be fixed. Capitalism was not designed with the mindset that those with money would hoard it because that defies the American Idea. The point of Capitalism is to let everyone have an equal chance at success, if that aspect is taken away then Capitalism is no longer working. The aspect HAS been taken away, Corporations have all the money, they are hoarding it and thus making it practically impossible for the majority to advance causing poverty even in the middle class. Then to make matters worse, the rich have so much money that they are able to pay off the government to protect them and disallow any attempt to rectify the situation.

Sadly, there is simply nothing that can be done about it. Because the mindset of the rich is essentially the mindset of everyone else. And even if it wasn't, doing something to change things would cost a great deal of money. Something we don't have.

Unless your a sports athlete. For some reason they get paid millions, sometimes over a hundred million dollars over the course a few years. No idea how that happened.

< Message edited by Unforeseen -- 2/5/2015 4:13:19 AM >


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RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 2/5/2015 6:05:45 AM   
Zap


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You still have a chance at success, if your so inclined. What you describe, as I see it, is called greed. Its not a failure of Capitalism but a failure of man. Christianity or even simple ethics teaches to not allow greed to be one motivation. People are not hearing the message for whatever reason. Human nature can be corrupted easily if no foundation (chritain ethics inspired) is laid when we're young.

< Message edited by Zap -- 2/6/2015 3:12:22 AM >


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RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 2/5/2015 6:47:53 AM   
Unforeseen


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Assuming we are talking about someone just getting started that does not initially have enough money to make long term investments your success depends on two things. Availability, and Allowance. Availability refers to a position allowing more money to flow in. This occurs when someone dies, moves up higher up the chain, or loses that position. If this does not occur, there is no chance for success short of circumstances out of your power. Simply put, if a position is not available, it doesn't matter how hard you work. That isn't supposed to be the case, and this is partly an issue with the fact that the entire system was designed during a time period when their weren't as many people all vying for the same positions. There were plenty of opportunities, and the rich were not so greedy. The second thing, Allowance refers to the people who benefit from the companies bottom line. Such as CEO's. They make the decision to allow some of their potential income to be distributed to employees. If an employer wants to make a million dollars, and he makes 1 million, 100 thousand dollars and he has no other expenses and isn't inclined to skim from the top then he will allocate 100 thousand dollars to employee expenses. If this means some poor entry level employee has to be laid off, then that poor guy is SOL despite the fact that the employer had plenty of money to pay to keep that guy on. Yes the problem is greed, and greed is the reason why capitalism has failed and our economy is permanently crippled because ones success is no longer determined by hard work, and instead by other people.

EDIT: Religious morals are not a solution to the worlds problems. I believe that it caused them. It is a source of fear instilled by those who mean to force the masses into acting a certain way. Some of it is justified but the means does not justify the ends. Fear is not the answer. There is no God, of any religion to date. Even if there was, his/it's ethics are perhaps worse than anything any Human is capable of. The Christian God knows the future, created Humanity with the ability to make the mistakes he knows that they will make in advance and then punishes them for it with Eternal Damnation. That is pure evil. Religion has single handedly been the cause of hundreds of wars, the loss of millions of lives, religious terrorism, and hundreds of years of lost social and scientific development. This goes for pretty much every religion dating back to even greek mythology. The only religion that might have slight merit is that of Ancient Sumer, and even that is a stretch depending on how you interpret it. The only "God" is the one a person chooses to believe in despite the facts and consequently inhibits them from making informed intelligent decisions. Thus I strongly disagree that children should be taught about Religion. That child can simply give up that belief system and then they have no reason to fear retribution for acting unethically. Children should instead be taught by example to be good, and shown that being bad is not as rewarding as it might appear. Teach them to be good because it's the right thing to do, not because some ridiculous dude in the sky says they have to.


< Message edited by Unforeseen -- 2/5/2015 9:01:04 AM >


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RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 2/5/2015 3:59:54 PM   
Zap


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I won't make many comments here to not take this way off topic.

I disagree with many of your conclusions.

1. Capitalism is a neutral system. Simply a supply and demand through the free market. The failure is eclusively human weakness. poor and rich suffer from greed.
There could be an argument for a better system but one has not been created as of yet.
The failure of monarchies, of Marxist inspired societies are simply greed and power abuse by government.
Lets hope a new form will of governance will be fertile ground for individual rights to be respected.

2.Your view of religion is, well very different from mine. The fear you speak of is not my motivating factor. Its love for the Supreme Being who guides me. I'm taught to respect my neighbor, to avoid greed. These along with many other teachings on how to being a good human being(as you stated, we need the good example of people ) push me to give good example.

I think I will leave it at that, since I've already got into non permitted areas, politics and religion. I'm now a 2 time offender of the rule here on these boards

< Message edited by Zap -- 2/7/2015 3:54:29 PM >


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RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 2/5/2015 6:35:22 PM   
Bamilus


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Didn't meant to derail this thread and yea we should obey forum rules and probably stop discussing sensitive topics here (although they were very good posts).

To try and bring this back on track: currently all the research mods are dead, right? Anyone want to take up the torch? lol

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RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 2/5/2015 8:37:58 PM   
Osito


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The problem is that it's so difficult to get them running with other mods. That's a bit of a disincentive.

For example, if you do a mod for Icemania's AI improvement, you have to stay consistent with what Icemania did, or you lose the AI improvements. And if you want the mod to work with Icemania's AI 'extended' mod, you'll need a completely separate file.

And then if Icemania or Haree update their mods, you may need to update your own for consistency.

Having said that, I am myself working on a research mod specifically for the AI improvement mod. This is intended for my own use, and I am calling it 'Research UNBALANCED'. I may release it, if I enjoy playing it myself.

Osito

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RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 2/5/2015 11:33:27 PM   
Unforeseen


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My bad for breaking the rules, my hatred of religion demands that I respond with hostility to any mention of it and I generally don't think to check the guidelines which I should get better about. But anyways back on topic...there are only a couple people left in the community that I think would be willing to undertake such a task and they are all already busy with other mods. I'm not even prepared to do it.

I'm sure someone will eventually finish a nice big one at some point, perhaps Lurchi will come back and finish or something. But It doesn't look like we can expect one in the near future and we are all able to make little modifications of our own anyways. I like to change several of the weapons names, and change the tree a bit.

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RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 3/2/2015 4:51:59 PM   
Locarnus


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Unforeseen

I was curious about his accusation of fraud and such so I looked up universe and it's been there. The entire time. It was even on sale during the holidays.

Locarnus has a point regarding retailers and really every major corporation atm, but his hostility to matrix is misplaced. There simply seems to be a misunderstanding of priorities here.


You show me how someone who bought Vanilla+RotS+Legends+Shadows can upgrade to Universe without paying full price again, and I reconsider my accessment of matrixgames as being scammers.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Bamilus

Locarnus is a perfect example of why the United States is screwed in 50 years. My generation and those coming up are the most entitled ****s I have ever seen. "If I can't have it, no one will!"



Yeah, says the freeloader who thinks he is entitled to a mod he did not pay for and did not help with in any regard while insulting the mod author for having moral standards, which are the basis of every community.

Then continues on whining that there is no one left, willing to supply the free mods he feels entitled to...

You know, people like me might be a small example of why the US is failing at least since the 80s. Because people like me tend to leave when people like you get the upper hand. And people like you do not seem to be very productive except for providing even more incentives for people like me to leave...


It was a game with great potential, unfortunately dev, publisher and community were not, when it mattered. So the first is "rich", the second as well and the community is dead/virtually non-existant. I wonder who made the wrong choices...


It is always fun to come back here and see what happens, when short-sighted greed gets the upper hand. Very few get the money and do not care while the consuming masses are irrelevant, and are still defending the ideology which got them into this situation. A little like watching news about the US, from a safe distance .

I guess I have to amend to what I stated above, you are productive.
Thank you for the entertainment you provide.

< Message edited by Locarnus -- 3/2/2015 5:55:37 PM >


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RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 3/3/2015 8:12:45 PM   
mnjiman

 

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I think it is Locarnus's right whether or not he wants to continue working on his Mod. That is up to him, whether we like his reasoning or not. What does attacking his fundamentals do for the community besides continue to bolster our ego's? Well, I guess the majority of people here might be upset that a decent mod maker decided to stop working. That doesn't mean there are not other modders out there willing to make mods like this one. It isn't hard to do just takes time.

I mean the entire purpose of Distant Worlds Universe was to introduce a easier ability to make modifications to the game, and to share them to one another. We should be grateful to anyone who considers making these huge mods for us to further enjoy the game. Some of these mods would not even be possible without the Universe addition.

I agree though, Matrix Games have become such scammers. If you went ahead and purchased every single expansion you should have every right to the this new expansion, providing further support for a 5 year old game for free. Forcing players to pay what, 20-25 dollars after reducing the price of it. I mean, how dare they force players to pay for their hard work...

Really I hope you can tell my sarcasm at this point. The level or irony of you complaining that people are mooching off your free work as your complaining about Matrix Games not providing their work for free... wow. Its hard to imagine someone attempting to defend their position with type of argument. You are complaining about people mooching off of you... as you are complaining about that Matrix games not providing their continue support for free? That is their choice, as its your own choice to stop working on this modification that you created. People are annoyed not that you are stopping. People are not bothered that you are moving on with your life.

People are just starting to have severe aneurysms over your reasoning's and the way your attempt to communicate your thoughts to explain your choices. I stick to my very first statement. It is your right to stop your mod. That is up to you. However if you are going to go ahead and make nonsensical posts and then get pissed off at people not understanding your positioning, the only person here to blame is yourself and your fundamentals for your reasoning simply collapses.

I would not even call you a modder at this point. I would not call this mess anything relating to programming or the community. You are just a troll.


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RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 3/4/2015 1:34:40 AM   
Locarnus


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnjiman

I think it is Locarnus's right whether or not he wants to continue working on his Mod. That is up to him, whether we like his reasoning or not. What does attacking his fundamentals do for the community besides continue to bolster our ego's? Well, I guess the majority of people here might be upset that a decent mod maker decided to stop working. That doesn't mean there are not other modders out there willing to make mods like this one. It isn't hard to do just takes time.

I mean the entire purpose of Distant Worlds Universe was to introduce a easier ability to make modifications to the game, and to share them to one another. We should be grateful to anyone who considers making these huge mods for us to further enjoy the game. Some of these mods would not even be possible without the Universe addition.

I agree though, Matrix Games have become such scammers. If you went ahead and purchased every single expansion you should have every right to the this new expansion, providing further support for a 5 year old game for free. Forcing players to pay what, 20-25 dollars after reducing the price of it. I mean, how dare they force players to pay for their hard work...

Really I hope you can tell my sarcasm at this point. The level or irony of you complaining that people are mooching off your free work as your complaining about Matrix Games not providing their work for free... wow. Its hard to imagine someone attempting to defend their position with type of argument. You are complaining about people mooching off of you... as you are complaining about that Matrix games not providing their continue support for free? That is their choice, as its your own choice to stop working on this modification that you created. People are annoyed not that you are stopping. People are not bothered that you are moving on with your life.

People are just starting to have severe aneurysms over your reasoning's and the way your attempt to communicate your thoughts to explain your choices. I stick to my very first statement. It is your right to stop your mod. That is up to you. However if you are going to go ahead and make nonsensical posts and then get pissed off at people not understanding your positioning, the only person here to blame is yourself and your fundamentals for your reasoning simply collapses.

I would not even call you a modder at this point. I would not call this mess anything relating to programming or the community. You are just a troll.





Then show me how people who own the previous addons can upgrade to Universe for 20-25$.

Oh, you cant? So your whole "argument" is based on your fantasy?

That is not even trolling, that is just nothing based on nothing.

Have fun with the vibrant community you helped to create.

< Message edited by Locarnus -- 3/4/2015 2:40:01 AM >


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RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 3/6/2015 11:03:34 PM   
Icemania


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As recent posts have become quite personal, I would request those involved to take this back a notch. Cheers.

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RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 3/20/2015 7:46:18 AM   
dogamus

 

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Can we please have this topic removed or locked? It's a complete waste of time.

EDIT: I was seriously hopeful that the mod had finally been updated. I've been playing this game since release and I just now made an account on here to ask that this thread be removed. There's no point in keeping it, as the mod developer has made their decision and it is apparent that they will never change it. This thread only serves to upset the community and has no effect on the 'devs' or the 'publishers' whatsoever.

This thread should be put in the ground where it belongs.

< Message edited by dogamus -- 3/20/2015 8:58:27 AM >

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RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 3/20/2015 9:03:25 AM   
Icemania


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Welcome dogamus!

I would have said something earlier about the recent posts but was only made a Moderator here recently. After my request to calm down there have been no further posts so at the moment there is no reason for any further action.

I was actually expecting after my previous response this thread would probably just fade into obscurity ... !

I would encourage you to participate in other constructive topics.

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Post #: 224
RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 3/21/2015 9:25:11 AM   
Unforeseen


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I hadn't realized Locarnus even responded :P

Alright so to start the game is here http://www.matrixgames.com/store/?k=distant+worlds&m=&g=&p=&v=&t=&d=&a=3&pt=1&searchSubmit=Begin+Search, it's been there the whole time. You made it sound as though it wasn't which is why I responded the way I did.

I believe I understand why your concerned. Universe costs more than any of the expansions because it is the expansion PLUS the original game and all previous expansions, and there appears to be no way to just get the Universe expansion. Your concern makes sense, I'm not sure that it could be considered a scam though.

For customers who haven't previously bought Distant Worlds products it's a fantastic deal at 59.99. You get the original game valued at 29.99, ROTS at 19.99, Legends and Shadows both valued 24.99 and Universe. The total for the previous titles combined before Universe is 99.96 before tax. If you buy Universe you get all of that for 59.99. I believe the cost for Universe upgrade promotion was 9.99. So we'll assume that is what they consider it's value to be. That places the total value of all titles at 109.95.

What that means is that every time a new customer purchases Distant Worlds: Universe they actually lose 49.96.

A 49.96 loss per purchase can turn into some substantial numbers especially if your seeing a lot of them. I believe this is the very reason why the upgrade is no longer available to customers who have already purchased the game. They DO technically gain 10.03 per consumer purchasing the game as a returning buyer assuming it is a 1:1 ratio. However you can assume that it's likely not the case, since the promotion allowed for a 9.99 upgrade. Many returning buyers likely upgraded during that time.

You should also consider that Universe may have been worth more than what they placed it's value at. With all these things in mind, and not knowing how many copies were sold to new customers it's entirely possible that they LOST money by selling the game this way. It's unfortunate for returning buyers like ourselves, but it benefits new customers. ALOT.

Hope that helps!


< Message edited by Unforeseen -- 3/21/2015 10:29:04 AM >


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RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 3/21/2015 10:10:50 AM   
Icemania


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For upgrade pricing there is already some discussion with Erik in this thread.

The last page or so has been completely off-topic. The topic for this thread should be this Mod. And if the Mod is cancelled ...


< Message edited by Icemania -- 3/21/2015 11:28:02 AM >

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Post #: 226
RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 3/21/2015 11:11:13 PM   
Locarnus


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@Unforeseen:

The problem is, that the versions before Distant Worlds Universe were and are sold to customers with the explicit and implicit promise that they can upgrade to the latest version.

Which they can't, which fulfills the definition of a scam.
And in the link that Icemania posted, they put forth bogus reasons to just keep that injustice going, which fills their pockets.

Not only that, they did not even stop the selling of non-Universe versions, or put a disclaimer on them, warning about the non-upgradability.


As Icemania wrote, this has gone on for long enough in this thread, no new information, no changes.
So I will no longer respond to this topic in this thread.


On Icemania's request, I changed the title of the thread to cancelled.

I would prefer it if the thread just fades away to the later pages without getting locked, just in case something on topic comes up (you never know).





< Message edited by Locarnus -- 3/22/2015 12:12:10 AM >


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http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3624576

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Post #: 227
RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 3/22/2015 1:28:33 AM   
Osito


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[Deleted]


< Message edited by Osito -- 3/22/2015 2:42:06 AM >

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Post #: 228
RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 9/21/2015 5:36:46 AM   
Bamilus


Posts: 477
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From: The Old Northwest
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Locarnus

quote:

ORIGINAL: Unforeseen

I was curious about his accusation of fraud and such so I looked up universe and it's been there. The entire time. It was even on sale during the holidays.

Locarnus has a point regarding retailers and really every major corporation atm, but his hostility to matrix is misplaced. There simply seems to be a misunderstanding of priorities here.


You show me how someone who bought Vanilla+RotS+Legends+Shadows can upgrade to Universe without paying full price again, and I reconsider my accessment of matrixgames as being scammers.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Bamilus

Locarnus is a perfect example of why the United States is screwed in 50 years. My generation and those coming up are the most entitled ****s I have ever seen. "If I can't have it, no one will!"



Yeah, says the freeloader who thinks he is entitled to a mod he did not pay for and did not help with in any regard while insulting the mod author for having moral standards, which are the basis of every community.

Then continues on whining that there is no one left, willing to supply the free mods he feels entitled to...

You know, people like me might be a small example of why the US is failing at least since the 80s. Because people like me tend to leave when people like you get the upper hand. And people like you do not seem to be very productive except for providing even more incentives for people like me to leave...


It was a game with great potential, unfortunately dev, publisher and community were not, when it mattered. So the first is "rich", the second as well and the community is dead/virtually non-existant. I wonder who made the wrong choices...


It is always fun to come back here and see what happens, when short-sighted greed gets the upper hand. Very few get the money and do not care while the consuming masses are irrelevant, and are still defending the ideology which got them into this situation. A little like watching news about the US, from a safe distance .

I guess I have to amend to what I stated above, you are productive.
Thank you for the entertainment you provide.


*yawns*

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Post #: 229
RE: [DWU] Balance Mod v0.9 - 171 new projects (extended... - 9/23/2015 9:56:32 AM   
Icemania


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bamilus
*yawns*

Bamilus, let's please NOT start the off-topic banter again.

(in reply to Bamilus)
Post #: 230
RE: [DWU] Balance Mod (extended TechTree) [WIP] - 5/17/2016 4:15:24 PM   
Hattori Hanzo


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all very good indeed, I like it.. !!!

< Message edited by Hattori Hanzo -- 5/17/2016 5:58:37 PM >

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Post #: 231
RE: [DWU] Balance Mod (extended TechTree) [WIP] - 6/15/2016 6:29:41 PM   
Damiac

 

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Hmm... any chance of someone picking this up? It'd be great to have more good mods for this game.

Locarnus, I totally get your point of view, if you found the business practices so objectionable, it makes perfect sense you wouldn't want to release a mod that helps them. You have a right to your principals, and you certainly have a right not to do free work for anyone!

But of course, we'd all be thrilled if you'd release what you have so the community could work on it. I totally understand if you don't want to, but it can't hurt to ask, right?

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Post #: 232
RE: [DWU] Balance Mod (extended TechTree) [WIP] - 6/15/2016 6:41:45 PM   
Retreat1970


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Dead. For an extended research tree check out starfall, unleashed extended, research unleashed, or other mods.

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Post #: 233
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