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OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/16/2013 8:36:44 PM   
Lokasenna


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At least I think this is at Ponape, as our in-game map refers to it, near as I can tell. File this one under things I learned on the internet today.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nan_Madol#Archaeology_and_tourism

quote:


Carbon dating indicates that the construction of Nan Madol began around 1200 CE, while excavations show that the area may have been occupied as early as 200 BCE. Some probable quarry sites around the island have been identified, but the exact origin of the stones of Nan Madol is yet undetermined. None of the proposed quarry sites exist in Madolenihmw, meaning that the stones must have been transported to their current location. It has been suggested that they might have been floated via raft from the quarry, and a short dive between the island and the quarries shows a trail of dropped stones. However, no one has successfully demonstrated or explained the process. Some modern Pohnpeians believe the stones were flown to the island by use of black magic.


Emphasis mine. Basically, there's this "city" built in the water there and nobody knows how or why. I find it fascinating. Every time I look at that area of the map now, I'll be thinking of weird stones. And who knows, maybe the black magic is why your recent invasion of the place failed.

Do a Google image search, the aerial photos are pretty neat.

< Message edited by Lokasenna -- 10/16/2013 8:38:14 PM >
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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/16/2013 9:10:48 PM   
JocMeister

 

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Cool!

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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/16/2013 10:12:03 PM   
jcjordan

 

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What size port/airbase woudl that make it?

It's amazing how much "civilization" is buried under the jungles of SAmerica & the Pacific Rim areas

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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/17/2013 2:02:34 AM   
geofflambert


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Nothing should be surprising about this. This was the location of the first gorn invasion (which ultimately failed). We invited some of the natives to a Thanksgiving dinner. What we failed to realize was that we were to be the main course.

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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/17/2013 7:52:21 AM   
Jorge_Stanbury


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Maybe they have finally found the fabled "golden monkey" ?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vo9bXpWxg8k

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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/17/2013 2:35:23 PM   
mike scholl 1

 

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I do get tired of all these "Our ancestors were to backward and stupid to have done this" theories. Lost Continents and Space Aliens and all this other drivel. My own theory is the "First Practical Joke" notion. Like several thousand years ago, a bunch of guys were sitting around one afternoon in Britany and one of them said, "You know..., if we stood a bunch of these big rocks up in long ordered rows, in 10,000 moons folks will go absolutely crazy trying to find out why we did it!"

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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/17/2013 3:10:45 PM   
obvert


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Very cool place. It always amazes me when something is given all kinds of different fantastic origin stories, and yet we have so many examples of amazing structures and cities built much earlier by other groups with the same level of primitive tools and hoist and pulley systems. Stonehenge, the Pyramids of the Americas and of Egypt, Ziggurats, Machu Pichu. Big stones? No problem.

Pacific cultures were some of the most advanced in the world during this period if you take into account their navigational understanding as well as their constructions, such as Easter Island statues.

No Gorns needed.

< Message edited by obvert -- 10/17/2013 3:11:20 PM >


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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/17/2013 3:44:26 PM   
Lokasenna


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What's really mind-boggling about how it could have been made is that some of the stones weigh 50 tons. Scientists have tried to replicate that but the rocks kept sinking the rafts, because you know - 50 tons is a lot.

They had to have done it somehow, though.

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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/17/2013 10:49:24 PM   
Itdepends

 

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Sea turtles, mate

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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/17/2013 11:03:57 PM   
Schanilec

 

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Swallows.

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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/18/2013 12:33:12 AM   
Feltan


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

What's really mind-boggling about how it could have been made is that some of the stones weigh 50 tons. Scientists have tried to replicate that but the rocks kept sinking the rafts, because you know - 50 tons is a lot.

They had to have done it somehow, though.



xAKL's

Regards,
Feltan

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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/18/2013 12:47:35 AM   
Ron Saueracker


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Ever read the short stort "Killdozer?" Made into a movie in the sixties I think. Ooooohhhh.....

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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/18/2013 4:04:44 AM   
Lokasenna


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Schanilec

Swallows.


African swallows, maybe?

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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/18/2013 2:01:37 PM   
Schanilec

 

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European?

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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/18/2013 4:12:43 PM   
1EyedJacks


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

What's really mind-boggling about how it could have been made is that some of the stones weigh 50 tons. Scientists have tried to replicate that but the rocks kept sinking the rafts, because you know - 50 tons is a lot.

They had to have done it somehow, though.


Bladders of air tied to a harness. They got the idea from seeing fish bladders.

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TTFN,

Mike

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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/18/2013 4:15:19 PM   
Symon


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna
What's really mind-boggling about how it could have been made is that some of the stones weigh 50 tons. Scientists have tried to replicate that but the rocks kept sinking the rafts, because you know - 50 tons is a lot.

They had to have done it somehow, though.

50 tons of granite is about 602 cubic feet (8.44’ x 8.44’ x 8.44’, mighty big block); limestone's a skoosh less dense, basalt's a skoosh more. If ya dangle it ‘under’ a raft, it displaces 19 tons of water, so it only ‘weighs’ 31 tons. Still a bunch, but a lot less than 50. Archimedes did the hydrostatic math in ~250 BCE. Maybe the scientists should have consulted some sailors.

The Britons were moving the 50 ton sarsen stones overland from Marlborough Downs to Salisbury in ~1700 BCE.

[ed] just ran the numbers for breaking strength of natural fiber rope (abaca fibers, i.e., manila hemp). A 1" rope has a 4 ton breaking strength. You would only need 8-10 loops to secure a 31 ton object.

< Message edited by Symon -- 10/18/2013 4:29:32 PM >


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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/18/2013 8:38:01 PM   
Lokasenna


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Symon

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna
What's really mind-boggling about how it could have been made is that some of the stones weigh 50 tons. Scientists have tried to replicate that but the rocks kept sinking the rafts, because you know - 50 tons is a lot.

They had to have done it somehow, though.

50 tons of granite is about 602 cubic feet (8.44’ x 8.44’ x 8.44’, mighty big block); limestone's a skoosh less dense, basalt's a skoosh more. If ya dangle it ‘under’ a raft, it displaces 19 tons of water, so it only ‘weighs’ 31 tons. Still a bunch, but a lot less than 50. Archimedes did the hydrostatic math in ~250 BCE. Maybe the scientists should have consulted some sailors.

The Britons were moving the 50 ton sarsen stones overland from Marlborough Downs to Salisbury in ~1700 BCE.

[ed] just ran the numbers for breaking strength of natural fiber rope (abaca fibers, i.e., manila hemp). A 1" rope has a 4 ton breaking strength. You would only need 8-10 loops to secure a 31 ton object.


I hadn't thought of doing them underwater. That's ingenious and seems obvious after the fact. They really wouldn't have needed to do the math, if they were OK with trial and error...

50 tons over land is a lot different than over water. Didn't the megalithic Brits use logs and roll them, basically? Or am I remember some other ancient stone construction?

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RE: OT: Mystery on Ponape - 10/19/2013 9:20:32 AM   
Yaab


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So, if you park a US sub in the Ponape hex, than damage to the sub's hull is a given.

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