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PCO - Two Phase System? - 4/23/2011 5:38:45 AM   
pad152

 

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Does PCO still use the two phase model, if so why, I never understood this?

I still think the fewer phases the better, the smoother game play.
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RE: PCO - Two Phase System? - 4/23/2011 5:48:55 AM   
junk2drive


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The original idea came from board game style of play where you have phases. It also was supposed to portray platoon command and orders. You have to think ahead and not be able to make adjustments at squad level like in real time games or Combat mission. The reaction phase is an opportunity to make some limited orders so that you are not waiting 80 seconds (like 60 seconds in CM) to order a withdraw or to target a new threat.

It didn't go over well with the CM crowd.

We made a lot of changes to the game that made it into a game that I actually like to play. Having become accustomed to the phase system, I cannot play the CM 60 second way. In fact I would like to see the next game have 30:30 phases.

Do I do something every time there is a reaction phase? No, in fact, mostly no. But when I see something that needs my input, I am glad that I can intervene.

It's an acquired taste I think.

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RE: PCO - Two Phase System? - 4/23/2011 6:46:30 AM   
rickier65

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: pad152

Does PCO still use the two phase model, if so why, I never understood this?

I still think the fewer phases the better, the smoother game play.


I'm like junk2drive. even though its possible now to play PCO with just the one phase, I dont care for it. The orders phase allows me set the general orders for units, and I know that I'll have a chance during the reaction phase to stop and target enemy units that come into sight, or even to fall back if I get over extended.

But the option is there in PCO now.

Thanks
rick

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RE: PCO - Two Phase System? - 4/23/2011 9:59:32 AM   
JMass


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I tried the single phase options but I also prefer to play two phases. During the order phase I hold my breath, then I review it, when it is the case I modify orders i.e. I withdraw a tank from a hidden AT or I change a target from a light to a medium enemy tank, then I hold my breath again, better to hold breath two times for 40' that I only time for 60' without do nothing. And don't say me anything about RT, I'll never play a game with it.

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RE: PCO - Two Phase System? - 4/23/2011 2:29:31 PM   
Mad Russian


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I'm the guy that you can thank for pushing hard to get a 60 turn phase. When I played the two 40 second turn phases I HATED not being in control at each new phase.

So, the different turn sequences were coded into the game. I played around with them but found that I had already been playing an 80 second turn. I get to give orders with the two 40 second phases with a break to allow me to get myself out of trouble if I need to. To countermand a bad offensive order and to try to break contact.

In essence an 80 second turn. I rarely make any targeting changes at the 40 second mark but rarely I will. So, after LOT's of game play I've stayed with the two 40 second turn impulses just because it gives me 80 seconds with a chance to retreat if I have to.

Those that play against me will tell you that I may well be the most aggressive player you'll ever play against. So, sometimes, I need to back up a bit. The two phase turn sequence allows that.

Good Hunting.

MR




< Message edited by Mad Russian -- 4/23/2011 2:30:13 PM >


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RE: PCO - Two Phase System? - 4/23/2011 3:48:28 PM   
Mobius


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The two phases in PC is the way Koios interpreted phases in my miniature rules. They were there to regulate time by units to fire and move before or after other units a simultaneous turn.
They are not really needed in a continuous time computer game. But as things turned out a two phase game turn does have certain advantages for a WEGO style game.

1) It allows the player to abort the movement of his units or adjust their targets if need be. The important word is “need be”. If you don’t need to change your orders just hit the next phase button and proceed to the next orders phase.

2) WEGO games are somewhat unrealistic in that both sides are giving orders to all their units at once. And then the orders are put into action at the exact same instant. So actions have an unusual cadence. Every 60 seconds troops get their orders and move like they are in a chorus line. What breaks this cadence up a bit is the mid turn break where units can stop, pivot, change targets or withdraw.

< Message edited by Mobius -- 4/23/2011 3:58:33 PM >

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RE: PCO - Two Phase System? - 4/23/2011 4:05:03 PM   
Mad Russian


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They wouldn't all have their orders executed at the exact same instant with a delay order, which I hope to get included in PC4.

Good Hunting.

MR


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Panzer Command Ostfront Development Team.
Flashpoint Campaigns: Red Storm Development Team.

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RE: PCO - Two Phase System? - 4/23/2011 8:32:50 PM   
HintJ


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I don't mind the phase system, but I wish the structure was 30 seconds order, 30 seconds reaction. That would make for even 1 minute turns.

Edit*
Yeah I see J2D asks for the same thing. Also, please consider a 40 second order, 20 second reaction. Still a full minute, but w/a little more time in the first part.

< Message edited by HintJ -- 4/23/2011 10:20:34 PM >


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RE: PCO - Two Phase System? - 4/24/2011 5:15:16 AM   
pad152

 

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The issue I have with the two phase system is the inability to do things (like move) in the second phase, it feels too artificial, I won't mind if you could do the same things (move & shoot) in each phase, movement should be part of reacting. I really dislike the Squad Battle games where there are just way too many phases where the player has little or no input, I like to play a game and not just watch one.




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RE: PCO - Two Phase System? - 4/24/2011 5:20:23 AM   
junk2drive


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IF you could do the same things in the reaction phase that you do in the orders phase there wouldn't be a need for 2 phases. So we put in the option to have a 60 second turn without the reaction phase just for you.

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RE: PCO - Two Phase System? - 4/24/2011 6:47:33 AM   
Mobius


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I would like 84 second turns. That way the phase would be 42 seconds long.

42.

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RE: PCO - Two Phase System? - 4/24/2011 11:47:16 AM   
CheerfullyInsane

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: junk2drive

IF you could do the same things in the reaction phase that you do in the orders phase there wouldn't be a need for 2 phases. So we put in the option to have a 60 second turn without the reaction phase just for you.


I rather think that was his point, that there isn't a need for two phases.
I'm with pad152 on this one, there's something arbitrary about not being able to do some things at some junctions, and all things at others. One of the things that turned me completely off PCK.
However, with the new system where you can pretty much pick'n'mix how your turns are to be played, it's merely a matter of finding an opponent with the same taste.


< Message edited by CheerfullyInsane -- 4/24/2011 11:48:57 AM >


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RE: PCO - Two Phase System? - 4/24/2011 3:07:03 PM   
Mad Russian


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The good news is that there are multiple sequence choices available to play. I've made scenarios for all the sequence options once they start getting played we'll see which becomes the most popular.

Good Hunting.

MR


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Founder of HSG scenario design group for Combat Mission.
Panzer Command Ostfront Development Team.
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RE: PCO - Two Phase System? - 4/24/2011 4:57:00 PM   
pad152

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: junk2drive

IF you could do the same things in the reaction phase that you do in the orders phase there wouldn't be a need for 2 phases. So we put in the option to have a 60 second turn without the reaction phase just for you.


Sounds good!

(in reply to junk2drive)
Post #: 14
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