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RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 5/1/2011 4:39:04 AM   
Mac Linehan

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lanconic

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lanconic

It depends on what kind of player you are:

Pugnacious? Then fight. I have played BOTH ways.
By 1943 I would say there is little difference except that the old CV will show up as New Essex
maybe if your lucky, some CA also.


The truth is that it is VERY easy for the Japs to over-stretch. Even the most cautious player does it.

Who cares if your fighting over Akyab or Dacca?

The point is that the Jap player will take MORE losses the more he expands.
You cant avoid it.

After losing 33% of the Imperial fleet, he pretty much is relegated to simply reacting.



Not in AE.


I am holding the printed manual:
Page 255


Which states:
quote:


Replacement ships are generated if the option is selected for the scenario...


And the stock scenarios do not have that option enabled. You can mod it in if you wish.


witpqs -

Read about this long ago, but had completely forgotten about the editor switch.

Am always learning (or relearning, in this case) something new or forgotten.

As a first time Allied Player (switching from the Dark Side), my thanks to you all.

Mac

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Post #: 61
RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 5/1/2011 7:21:15 PM   
Bullwinkle58


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mac Linehan


Read about this long ago, but had completely forgotten about the editor switch.



I'm playing a Scen 2 game with the switch on.

I'm about to perhaps lose USS Enterprise for the second time. It'll be a close call.

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Post #: 62
RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 5/1/2011 11:32:51 PM   
Big B

 

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I can only shake my head at the demeaning phrase "Sir Robin Defense" - with the obvious implication being out and out cowardice.

It may not be as 'fun' for the Japanese player - but the only drawback to a rapid strategic redeployment and concentration of force as the Allies in the game is that you cannot 'as an Allied player' leave the scorched earth and destruction of all strategic facilities behind you as you withdraw - as can and was done repeatedly throughout history.
As for the military principle of concentration of force (as opposed to isolated & piecemeal destruction) - concentration of force for the defensive or offensive is the most basic military tenet since Plataea, 479 BCE.


That being said - the most unusual early war Allied strategic policy I ever pulled off in a PBEM was actually in old WitP.
What we did in that game was a rapid concentration and resupply of of Bataan, Singapore, & Java.
This was an unusual game, in that everyone was free to move on Dec 7th - consequently the Japanese players assumed PH would be empty and therefore did not send the KB to pay a visit (big mistake...everything stayed there - and now was undamaged on Dec 8th - and then disappeared into the vast Pacific. The alternate Japanese sweep of the South China Sea payed little dividends).

We lost 40 some AK's resupplying Bataan and Singapore in January, and Bataan eventually fell - but Singapore held with the extra supply, troops, and a lot of gathered air power.

With the Japanese thus distracted, the entire Pacific Fleet and Royal Navy each combined, and then convoyed every available Division, AA unit, Arty unit, armored unit, base-force, engineer unit, and air unit first to Australia, and then on to Western Java by late March/April 1942 in a surprise reinforcement landing in strength (and an ensuing surprise Jutland-in-the-Pacific/Battle-of-Midway).

Needless to say, with over 10 reinforced Divisions, HQ's, support, & over 1,000 new combat aircraft (fighters and bombers) - Java did not fall - and Japan never got the D.E.I. resources flowing. That game didn't get past April '42.

Probably wouldn't have been feasible if PH was attacked as usual...


B



< Message edited by Big B -- 5/1/2011 11:34:50 PM >

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Post #: 63
RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 5/2/2011 12:45:41 AM   
USSAmerica


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quote:

I can only shake my head at the demeaning phrase "Sir Robin Defense" - with the obvious implication being out and out cowardice.


I have nothing bad to say about it and happen to be a big fan.

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Post #: 64
RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 5/2/2011 2:13:12 AM   
Mac Linehan

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: USS America

quote:

I can only shake my head at the demeaning phrase "Sir Robin Defense" - with the obvious implication being out and out cowardice.


I have nothing bad to say about it and happen to be a big fan.


Gents -

Can only agree with you. Each individual implements the above in differing ways; as he or she sees fit.

I plan to fight where I can, intelligently (now there's a scary concept <grin>), and run where it is not feasible to stand. The goal is to extract the highest cost with the smallest loss in the process.

To the veteran (by whatever definition) posters on the forum - your advice, thoughts and tactics are priceless - even when very different from another's. While I am becoming technically competent - reading and studying the rules, with a growing understanding of the game mechanics, plus spending the time and thought in planning the next turn; it is the posts and AAR's on this forum that give me the guidance to formulate and solidify what to do next.

Well - that's it.

Mac





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Post #: 65
RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 5/2/2011 9:29:08 AM   
Smeulders

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: USS America

quote:

I can only shake my head at the demeaning phrase "Sir Robin Defense" - with the obvious implication being out and out cowardice.


I have nothing bad to say about it and happen to be a big fan.


Bravely bold Sir Robin
Sailed forth from his safe port.
He was not afraid to die,
Oh brave Sir Robin.
He was not at all afraid
To be killed in nasty ways.
Brave, brave, brave, brave Sir Robin.

He was not in the least bit scared
To be sunk by Yamato.
Or to have his cruisers torpedoed
And his destroyers sunk.
To have his merchants defenceless
And his carriers under the sea,
And then to see KB show up,
Brave Sir Robin.

His divisions crushed
And bombers shot down
And aces killed
And bases taken
And airfields holed
And forts burned down
And his pen--



Brave Sir Robin ran away.
("No!")
Bravely ran away away.
("I didn't!")
When danger reared it's ugly head,
He bravely turned his tail and fled.
("no!")
Yes, brave Sir Robin turned about
("I didn't!")
And gallantly he chickened out.

****Bravely**** taking ("I never did!") to his feet,
He beat a very brave retreat.
("all lies!")
Bravest of the braaaave, Sir Robin!
("I never!")

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Post #: 66
RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 5/2/2011 1:12:42 PM   
USSAmerica


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Post #: 67
RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 8/25/2012 9:49:39 PM   
BBfanboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mac Linehan


Read about this long ago, but had completely forgotten about the editor switch.



I'm playing a Scen 2 game with the switch on.

I'm about to perhaps lose USS Enterprise for the second time. It'll be a close call.

Cripes Bullwinkle - did you let Halsey command Enterprise again after he got her sunk the first time!

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RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/11/2013 8:29:16 PM   
Jim Stevens

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: topeverest

My 2 cents,

KB if intact is too dangerous to fight. I have never permanently held PI or Malaya, though I have had PI in May.

I would classify appropriate allied strategy in the earliest months as one of building hub bases while surface raiding, pulsing air combats, and opportunitist counterinvasions (when you know where the KB isnt!) Subs can bag 30+ cargos per month alone if you place them right. Do that from the beginning. One of the big early decisions is how many assets to consume in the defense of the DEI - and how. IMHO, the war is logisitics at its base. The longer you deny the DEI the better off the allies are in general.

A lot depends on the empire strategy. If they over-expand, life is generally much easyier for the allies by 43.


What or who is KB?

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Post #: 69
RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/11/2013 9:05:44 PM   
Dixie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim Stevens


quote:

ORIGINAL: topeverest

My 2 cents,

KB if intact is too dangerous to fight. I have never permanently held PI or Malaya, though I have had PI in May.

I would classify appropriate allied strategy in the earliest months as one of building hub bases while surface raiding, pulsing air combats, and opportunitist counterinvasions (when you know where the KB isnt!) Subs can bag 30+ cargos per month alone if you place them right. Do that from the beginning. One of the big early decisions is how many assets to consume in the defense of the DEI - and how. IMHO, the war is logisitics at its base. The longer you deny the DEI the better off the allies are in general.

A lot depends on the empire strategy. If they over-expand, life is generally much easyier for the allies by 43.


What or who is KB?



The KB is the Kido Butai (striking force? iirc), which in game terms is used to describe the IJN carrier fleet. In the early days this will just be the Pearl Harbor attackers. An additional 'Mini KB' is sometimes formed by grouping the IJN CVLs and CVEs together. The KB can be added to as additional ships become available or split to form two (or more) slightly smaller KBs.

As the Allied player, your main task at sea is to not be where the KB is. The huge numbers of airframes crewed by high exp crews will destroy most things that get in their way. This is especially true given the relative inferiority of the Allied carrier fighters.

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RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/11/2013 9:10:16 PM   
Sardaukar


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim Stevens


quote:

ORIGINAL: topeverest

My 2 cents,

KB if intact is too dangerous to fight. I have never permanently held PI or Malaya, though I have had PI in May.

I would classify appropriate allied strategy in the earliest months as one of building hub bases while surface raiding, pulsing air combats, and opportunitist counterinvasions (when you know where the KB isnt!) Subs can bag 30+ cargos per month alone if you place them right. Do that from the beginning. One of the big early decisions is how many assets to consume in the defense of the DEI - and how. IMHO, the war is logisitics at its base. The longer you deny the DEI the better off the allies are in general.

A lot depends on the empire strategy. If they over-expand, life is generally much easyier for the allies by 43.


What or who is KB?



Kido Butai = Mobile Strike Force aka IJN main CV fleet (basically Akagi, Kaga, Hiryu, Soryu, Shokaku and Zuikaku).


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RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/12/2013 6:13:40 PM   
Jim Stevens

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress

I remember playing WITP and just having some Betty's and Nell's stationed in strategic parts of the DEI meant doom for Allied merchies. You could rake up a good kill rate over time with enough Betty's and Nell's in the game. Are they still as deadly as before? I mean, literally you couldn't move anything around the DEI when they were within about 8 hexes of Jap bombers armed with torps. Has that changed any?


What is DEI?

Never mind, I figured it out...

< Message edited by Jim Stevens -- 4/12/2013 6:19:24 PM >

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RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/12/2013 6:17:04 PM   
Dixie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim Stevens


quote:

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress

I remember playing WITP and just having some Betty's and Nell's stationed in strategic parts of the DEI meant doom for Allied merchies. You could rake up a good kill rate over time with enough Betty's and Nell's in the game. Are they still as deadly as before? I mean, literally you couldn't move anything around the DEI when they were within about 8 hexes of Jap bombers armed with torps. Has that changed any?


What is DEI?


Dutch East Indies. The Java, Sumatra, Celebes and Borneo areas of the map where most of the resources for Japanese industry will come from.

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RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/13/2013 1:30:40 PM   
uncivil_servant


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Trying to read and decipher as discussion rnge from current game, which I have just started, and previous game are not options severely limited? All the discussions around what the allies can do when the KB is not around seem to imply that:
Stong CV TF's are a wee bit more indestructible than in real life. (Also read one cannot duplicate the batle of coral sea correctly when that batle had more "odd/quirky" events which saved the IJN side of the battle as both sides misidentified "carrier forces" but only one side had a storm front come in to protect and hide a carier, and that the Lex was easily going to live to fight the next day except it met mr. sub - and b) a really stupid mistake someone made regarding leaving a generator running in an area with air fuel vapors)

It also seems that people speak of defending certain areas excpt when the IJ side advances quickly in those areas - this leads to the above - are land based bombers so castrated that opposing fleets can sail without care near non-torpedo bomber bases? Men who knew more than any of us do kept their prescious ships away from such bases. They didn't sail by singapore into the indian ocean, they didn't stick around pearl for hour much less another day or three, the B-17s and other Midway bombers scared the opposing admiral so (when bomb strikes on carriers were so close that the spray from the bombs closely striking would completely obscure from view the entire carrier) that the land-based bombers were considered more than worthy of a second strike to try and remove their threat as they considered themselve extremely lucky to not have had hits from all the bombs striking water at a closer than comfortable range.

In the game it seems Mr. KB player could just ignore Midway and any bombers as they'd have no chance to begin with and radically change strategies of the war so each war is the same.. run.. hide from KB.. wait and build up...

That and I'm looking for the "editor switch" regarding replacing ships as Bullwinkle and Mac Linehan discuss but I cannot find. :(


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RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/13/2013 2:14:58 PM   
GreyJoy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: uncivil_servant

Trying to read and decipher as discussion rnge from current game, which I have just started, and previous game are not options severely limited? All the discussions around what the allies can do when the KB is not around seem to imply that:
Stong CV TF's are a wee bit more indestructible than in real life. (Also read one cannot duplicate the batle of coral sea correctly when that batle had more "odd/quirky" events which saved the IJN side of the battle as both sides misidentified "carrier forces" but only one side had a storm front come in to protect and hide a carier, and that the Lex was easily going to live to fight the next day except it met mr. sub - and b) a really stupid mistake someone made regarding leaving a generator running in an area with air fuel vapors)

It also seems that people speak of defending certain areas excpt when the IJ side advances quickly in those areas - this leads to the above - are land based bombers so castrated that opposing fleets can sail without care near non-torpedo bomber bases? Men who knew more than any of us do kept their prescious ships away from such bases. They didn't sail by singapore into the indian ocean, they didn't stick around pearl for hour much less another day or three, the B-17s and other Midway bombers scared the opposing admiral so (when bomb strikes on carriers were so close that the spray from the bombs closely striking would completely obscure from view the entire carrier) that the land-based bombers were considered more than worthy of a second strike to try and remove their threat as they considered themselve extremely lucky to not have had hits from all the bombs striking water at a closer than comfortable range.

In the game it seems Mr. KB player could just ignore Midway and any bombers as they'd have no chance to begin with and radically change strategies of the war so each war is the same.. run.. hide from KB.. wait and build up...

That and I'm looking for the "editor switch" regarding replacing ships as Bullwinkle and Mac Linehan discuss but I cannot find. :(





No, it's not like that mate. Even the mighty KB in 1942 is voulnerable. I just had the KB CAP screen (190 zero strong!) penetrated by a single flight of 8 (EIGHT) B25s flying at 100 ft... my crappy japanese radars didn't detect them untill it was too late (8 minutes) and none of my fighters managed to get on them before they could release their bombs... one of my CVs got hit by 3 500lb bombs and took serious damage.

CV battles are subjected to a lot of variables, just like in RL. You can be lucky or unlucky...weather has a HUGE part in those battles... and you cannot control it.

Now that i've played the evil side, i can tell you that the next time i'll play as the allies i'll be much much more aggressive against the enemy's KB. It's a paper tiger...strong, yes, but made of paper.

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RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/13/2013 7:53:05 PM   
crsutton


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I don't like the term Sir Robin as everybody has a different idea as to what it exactly is. Obviously the Allies are going to get "pimp slapped" in early 1942 if they try to man up on the Japanese. Some discretion is advised. There are some basic rules to adhere to, and most are stated in this thread. Basically you have to read your opponent and play on the "edge" of their ability. Be wary and avoid mistakes and take any opening that they give to you. It is a hell of a lot easier for the Japanese player to screw up in the early going that the Allied. However, a "crack" Japanese player is going to push you hard and use a big fist. You had better be thinking about avoiding that fist.

It has pretty much been my mantra from day one. If the Allied player does not f**k up and lose his carriers in 1942 then it is going to be pretty hard for him/her to lose the game. So there you have it, don't lose your carriers.

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RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/13/2013 8:30:53 PM   
Zigurat666


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim Stevens


quote:

ORIGINAL: topeverest

My 2 cents,

KB if intact is too dangerous to fight. I have never permanently held PI or Malaya, though I have had PI in May.

I would classify appropriate allied strategy in the earliest months as one of building hub bases while surface raiding, pulsing air combats, and opportunitist counterinvasions (when you know where the KB isnt!) Subs can bag 30+ cargos per month alone if you place them right. Do that from the beginning. One of the big early decisions is how many assets to consume in the defense of the DEI - and how. IMHO, the war is logisitics at its base. The longer you deny the DEI the better off the allies are in general.

A lot depends on the empire strategy. If they over-expand, life is generally much easyier for the allies by 43.


What or who is KB?




This is the KB from 1941 until mid 1943
















Attachment (1)

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RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/13/2013 8:31:44 PM   
Zigurat666


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and this is the KB from 43 on....






Attachment (1)

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RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/13/2013 11:04:17 PM   
uncivil_servant


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That is good to know. Stories of KB circling Australia w/ouy a care in the world make me scratch my head as to what strategies I could try that are even possible if naval forces get so restricted and that there are no "safe" seas.

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RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/15/2013 11:44:32 PM   
Nemo121


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A true "Sir Robin" is basically about taking whatever you can move and running away faster than the Japanese can logistically support their advance. Basically, "run faster than the hunter can hunt". Many adopt it fully, some adopt it in part and both groups tend to call it the same thing which adds to confusion immeasurably.

I'll deal with those who basically run without fighting whenever possible.... IMO ( and it is an opinion not gospel ) that's a choice taken by poor players who aren't interested in improving their play. Pulling back until the Japanese logistical culmination point requires almost no skill whatsoever and doesn't promote the development of any skill beyond the estimation of where that logistical culmination point will be. It doesn't promote the use of subterfuge, the art of assessing enemy capabilities and predicting their courses of action, of misleading them, of mounting spoiling attacks of phasing into and out of areas of operation in order to spoil strategic dispositions, of using small, relatively lesser skilled, less mobile forces operating along external lines ( the Allies ) to take the initiative away from larger, more skilled, mobile forces operating along internal lines (the Japanese ) and force those larger, more skilled, more mobile forces along internal lines to react rather than imposing their will etc etc etc.

There are many AARs where reasonably good players have stung the Japanese in the early months of the war. There are AARs ( jrcar's chief amongst them ) in which the Allies have used excellent judgement and strategic nous to stalemate the Japanese far earlier and more conclusively than was achieved. Lastly there are other AARs where the Allies have mounted large strategically important offensives by mid-42 although those games are due to confluences which are probably rather rarer.

The key point is that the Allies can and have stung the Japanese, stopped the Japanese and even turned them back well within the timescale of the Sir Robin. So, those who argue that the Sir Robin is the only or even best option are flying in the face of the objective reality of what has been achieved within AE. Each of the situations within which the Japanese have been stung or halted has featured players who have focused on strategic goals, players who have not been diverted by the ephemera of tactical gains at strategic cost, players who have subordinated the tactical to the strategic at all times, players who have identified points crucial to the Japanese plans and concentrated forces at those points and who have recognised that to maintain a threat does not require the maintaining of a presence.

Of course those skills and those ways of thinking are difficult to develop... they take time.... they take effort .... they require the losing of games in the learning, games which could have been won with the tactics of Sir Robin. The question really is whether or not you want to be a much, much better strategic thinker in 3 years time or whether you want to win this current game. If you want to win the current game then use Sir Robin but don't expect to be a better player next game. If you are willing to lose the current game in order to be better next year ( choosing to subordinate the tactical to the strategic in your own life ) then turn from the Sir Robin and find the best player you can to deliver the most comprehensive victory possible.

Sir Robin works but it lacks ambition and the potential for honing oneself.


As to KB.... The key really is two-fold.
1. To take KB on with one's unsinkable carriers. Or, rather, to have KB choose to tackle your unsinkable carriers as people will perservere longer on a suicidal path if they think they're in control.
2. To realise that the Japanese carriers are meaningless. Only their planes ( and really their elite pilots ) matter. THOSE are your target. I don't care if the Japanese player has 10 CVs with 600 planes if they are all 30 Exp rookies. That's just 120 Allied Aces waiting to be made and 10 CVs waiting to be turned into reefs.

< Message edited by Nemo121 -- 4/15/2013 11:45:31 PM >


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RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/16/2013 2:00:43 AM   
spence

 

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The 'mini-KB' could be a good target for the US CV's early on. It seems to be able to hold its own against Allied LBA but to my mind is over-matched if it runs into a pair or more of US CVs. With their smaller air groups, sometimes with obsolescent A5Ms and no dive bombers the mini-KB is fit mostly for attacking poorly defended targets.

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RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/16/2013 10:05:11 AM   
Barb


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I had just managed to kick Japanese advance to take Singapore. Slipped real reinforcements to Singapore just under the Mini KB nose - complete 18th UK Div plus 44th and 45th Indian brigades.
While 44th and 45th took some loses in defending at Johore Bahru together with both Australian Brigades and 11th plus 9th Indian Divisions (rebuilt), 18th Div rested in Singapore. When Japanese started to overwhelm Johore Bahru defences, I had retreated to Singers. With few days of rest, city terrain and fort level 3 the allied forces really bloodied 4 assaulting Japanese Divisions (5th, 18th, 4th and 21st).

I will lose those units, including 18th UK, but it will take Japanese some time to burn my supplies as well as time to rebuild badly mauled units, and tie up 200 bombers and 100 fighters subject to Flak and ops losses for considerable time as well as 4 Jap Divisions tied up for considerable time.

From my point of view it is really necessary to fight the Japs and to force losses on them - each pilot killed counts, each Oscar shot down counts, each pilot from IJ carrier counts.... You just need create conditions to position yourself in the advantageous position. Do not stay entirely on defensive, you know sweep is more effective than CAP, use altitude advantage, numbers advantage, speed advantage of your planes over Jap ones ... You will find that even medicore pilots in Hurricanes, P-40s or even Buffalos can kill if they had advantageous position... (and you don't even need to create so called "CAP traps" of hundreds of planes to overwhelm the enemy)

< Message edited by Barb -- 4/16/2013 10:06:07 AM >


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RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/16/2013 12:29:44 PM   
topeverest


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As the allied player early on, taking potions of the fleet and setting counterpulse ambushes with say 1 or 2 CL and 4-6 DD can be devastating. Getting a few small wins is good, but making the empire cover each advance with more forces than desired will reap rewards in the speed and location of the eventual allied turn. This also can be done with american CV's. Also agree that initial batch of empire pilots are a key target for the allies. Setting air traps to bag as many pilots is far more important than counting airframes destroyed.

Remember that the empire has to go after the booty, and most will go for Darwin. there are a limited number of opening empire moves. Burn some assets to make her pay as she advances.

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Post #: 83
RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/16/2013 11:10:24 PM   
AW1Steve


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Someone in the German Army once said, "The English will fight to the VERY LAST Australian and Canadian". Well, to some degree that's what I do. I consider almost every Dutch,Austrailain,New Zealand,and any other ally I have at the begining of the game to be expendable. Very few of them get much of an upgrade, so "use 'em or lose 'em". It's cold, but I'd rather give up those ships then my USN CV's , CL's DD's and to a lesser degree CA's and BB's. All of them will be refitted and be more usefull later in the war then they are in the begining. CV's are priceless.

Another point in the Sir Robin defense is that the more land the JFB owns, the more he has to protect and supply. So he wastes troops garrisoning that land. I encourage him to "eat till he explodes". Your lines of communication shorten and his grows.

I don't subscribe to a true "Sir Robin", in that in my case he Morphs into "Vampire Chicken", AKA "Sir Robin grows fangs". In other words, save your strenght, let him over extend, resist where you can, raid,raid,raid, and always look for a good place to place an ambush. Mines and PT boats are very good to delay him. Your major job for the 1st 8 months or so is to try and be a complete nuisance , till you are strong enough to go back on the offensive. The more ships you save, and the more pilots you train, the faster till you can advance.

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Post #: 84
RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/17/2013 6:30:33 AM   
wdolson

 

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This is a resurrection of an old thread...

I think of the two strategies as the Sir Robin Light and Full Sir Robin. The Sir Robin Light is to some degree historical. The USN conducted carrier raids to get the crews used to war without exposing them to serious danger. It preserved the low stock of carrier airframes and got the fleet ready for a new type of war. Ultimately it worked. The USN was still on the learning curve when the serious battle started, but they were further along the curve.

As far as land forces went, there wasn't much to spare anyway. The British freed up some ground troops and air units from the Med they were able to feed into the fight, but the US was not prepared for anything more than a defensive posture until August 42. The US troops that were deployed were used to strengthen the line well back from the current Japanese line of advance. Holding Noumea and the South Pacific islands were a key strategic plan to keep the life line to Australia open.

ABDA was sort of doomed from the start. If the countries involved had worked a bit better together they may have been able to slow the Japanese a bit more, but ultimately it was a lost cause. The DEI was almost literally at the farthest reaches of the supply chain from the US and the UK. Getting anything there from the US in the early going is a major ordeal.

Bill

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Post #: 85
RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/17/2013 4:16:06 PM   
Wirraway_Ace


Posts: 1166
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From: Austin / Brisbane
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

Someone in the German Army once said, "The English will fight to the VERY LAST Australian and Canadian". Well, to some degree that's what I do. I consider almost every Dutch,Austrailain,New Zealand,and any other ally I have at the begining of the game to be expendable. Very few of them get much of an upgrade, so "use 'em or lose 'em". It's cold, but I'd rather give up those ships then my USN CV's , CL's DD's and to a lesser degree CA's and BB's. All of them will be refitted and be more usefull later in the war then they are in the begining. CV's are priceless.


I find it too easy to stall and defeat the Japanese, even skilled players, without playing with some constraints as the Allies. At the beginning of each game, I roll 1 ten-sided die three times on the following table and use the results to shape my game strategy based on these political "realities". These die rolls are almost as exciting as the turn 1 replay...

1. P38s are assessed as too flawed to be committed into combat until the issue with the inability to recover from a dive is resolved. [P38Es may only be used for stateside training]
2. Best captains get the best boats [the US Navy did not know the fleet boats were carrying less effective torpedoes than the old pig boats; assign the highest naval skill and most aggressive captains to the fleet boats]
3. The United States has no interest in helping Britain regain its colonies [No US divisions, Aircraft carriers and landing craft can be committed to the Southwest Asia until landings have been made in the Philippines; this exclusion includes supporting operations in the major Dutch colonies of Sumatra, Java and British/Dutch Borneo]
4. PM Curtin demands the US meet its commitment to send both the 32nd and 41st Divisions directly to Australia.
5. PM Curtin demands that the 6th and 7th Australian Divisions be returned directly to Australia.
6. PM Churchill directs that Force Z deal with the Japanese landings on the coast of Malaya [order Force Z to intercept Japanese landings at Kota Bharu and/or Singora during the first turn
7. PM Churchill directs that Singapore be held. [Historical reinforcements go to Singapore and turn replacements on for 9th and 11th Indian Divisions.]
8. President Roosevelt puts pressure on ADM King for the Pacific Fleet to strike back at the Japanese [before June 42, conduct a carrier raid against the Home Islands, the Marshals or Rabaul.]
9. The role of the British Pacific Fleet is to protect British interests [no British capital ships can operate in the Pacific prior to 1943. Warspite, after finishing her refit, must transit to join the British fleet in the IO]
10. PM Curtin demands the 2 Brigades of the 8th Australia Division be evacuated from Malaya to Australia

mike

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Post #: 86
RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/17/2013 4:18:22 PM   
Wirraway_Ace


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I obviously don't let the Japanese play know what constraints are in play...

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Post #: 87
RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/17/2013 4:50:17 PM   
Canoerebel


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I do something like Wirraway Ace since I find it annoying and troublesome that the Japanese can compete on any terms whatsoever. I roll one twenty-sided dice three times, take the largest number divisible by three, square it, and divide by itself. The resulting number is then implemented from this table:

1. Japanese player realizes he is in over his head on turn one and agrees to surrender.
2. Play John III and he agrees that no Japanese ship had a captain capable enough to take her out of the Sea of Japan.
3. Play Miller and he agrees to pose in his BVDs with Lady Gaga.
4. Play Chez Da Jes, implement Fortress Palembang, and he agrees that Japan cannot use ships to transport any fuel from any port more than three hexes from Tokyo.
5. Play Q-Ball and lull him into an acute state of boredom by withdrawing all ships, aircraft and ground units to Capetown until June 15, 1944. Accept his withdrawal from the game by January 1, 1943.
6. Play Panzerjaeger Hortlund, pretend that I am Nemo, and invade Hokkaido with the entire Australian OOB on February 28, 1942.
7. Play Poultry Lad and pretend that I am left-leaning in my politics.
8. Play Bullwinkle and pretend that I am right-leaning in my politics.
9. Play Cap Mandrake under agreement that he cannot say anything about women and their alluring, lusty, promiscuous tendencies.
10. Play Cribtop on condition that no lawyer terms shall be used.

(in reply to Wirraway_Ace)
Post #: 88
RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/17/2013 4:58:29 PM   
Lokasenna


Posts: 9158
Joined: 3/3/2012
From: Iowan in MD/DC
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I do something like Wirraway Ace since I find it annoying and troublesome that the Japanese can compete on any terms whatsoever. I roll one twenty-sided dice three times, take the largest number divisible by three, square it, and divide by itself. The resulting number is then implemented from this table:

1. Japanese player realizes he is in over his head on turn one and agrees to surrender.
2. Play John III and he agrees that no Japanese ship had a captain capable enough to take her out of the Sea of Japan.
3. Play Miller and he agrees to pose in his BVDs with Lady Gaga.
4. Play Chez Da Jes, implement Fortress Palembang, and he agrees that Japan cannot use ships to transport any fuel from any port more than three hexes from Tokyo.
5. Play Q-Ball and lull him into an acute state of boredom by withdrawing all ships, aircraft and ground units to Capetown until June 15, 1944. Accept his withdrawal from the game by January 1, 1943.
6. Play Panzerjaeger Hortlund, pretend that I am Nemo, and invade Hokkaido with the entire Australian OOB on February 28, 1942.
7. Play Poultry Lad and pretend that I am left-leaning in my politics.
8. Play Bullwinkle and pretend that I am right-leaning in my politics.
9. Play Cap Mandrake under agreement that he cannot say anything about women and their alluring, lusty, promiscuous tendencies.
10. Play Cribtop on condition that no lawyer terms shall be used.



So...you always do one of the bolded options? Seems a shame to limit yourself with so many other great ones on that table!

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 89
RE: Early war strategy for Allies - 4/17/2013 4:58:47 PM   
AW1Steve


Posts: 14492
Joined: 3/10/2007
From: Mordor Illlinois
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I do something like Wirraway Ace since I find it annoying and troublesome that the Japanese can compete on any terms whatsoever. I roll one twenty-sided dice three times, take the largest number divisible by three, square it, and divide by itself. The resulting number is then implemented from this table:

1. Japanese player realizes he is in over his head on turn one and agrees to surrender.
2. Play John III and he agrees that no Japanese ship had a captain capable enough to take her out of the Sea of Japan.
3. Play Miller and he agrees to pose in his BVDs with Lady Gaga.
4. Play Chez Da Jes, implement Fortress Palembang, and he agrees that Japan cannot use ships to transport any fuel from any port more than three hexes from Tokyo.
5. Play Q-Ball and lull him into an acute state of boredom by withdrawing all ships, aircraft and ground units to Capetown until June 15, 1944. Accept his withdrawal from the game by January 1, 1943.
6. Play Panzerjaeger Hortlund, pretend that I am Nemo, and invade Hokkaido with the entire Australian OOB on February 28, 1942.
7. Play Poultry Lad and pretend that I am left-leaning in my politics.
8. Play Bullwinkle and pretend that I am right-leaning in my politics.
9. Play Cap Mandrake under agreement that he cannot say anything about women and their alluring, lusty, promiscuous tendencies.
10. Play Cribtop on condition that no lawyer terms shall be used.



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