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Resource mining speeds? - 3/18/2011 7:23:03 PM   
gnosis

 

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Ok, mining components have "Resource Extraction:X" but no time period is specified at all. how fast is resource extraction 5? when will I have 100 of a resource?

Also, does the resources deposited affect the rate for components? does the % also affect the rate of extraction for components?

I also got the same question about colonies: A planet has say 200k depositis with 10%. How long till I get 100 resources without any mining stations on the place? Does the development affect this?

What if I also have mining components on the spaceport (can I?)? Does that work? Do I double mine the place?

There are multiple reasons for asking this. There are low value planets that have resources you need to mine. Is it better to do it with a mining base or colonize it? Most of the time you really don't care, but what if the place is the only source for the stuff? What method will produce the most resources?

Thanks!
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RE: Resource mining speeds? - 3/18/2011 8:05:20 PM   
Data


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They work pretty fast so if you test you'll see just when you get the 100.
Yes, the % affects the rate of extraction....there is a forumula in a thread somewhere; lots of threads were done on this.
The same applies to colonies yes, only that once you've got the colony you cannot build mining stations. Development does not affect this.
You can have mining components on SP, yes, but I don't think they'll speed up extraction..should be tested to confirm.
Only the three big ones (zentabia, loros and korabian) have few sources and even them have more than one, for the rest you'll find plenty of sources.

And welcome to the community, gnosis.

_____________________________

...Igniting stellar cores....Recharging reactors...Recalibrating hyperdrives....

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RE: Resource mining speeds? - 3/18/2011 8:12:58 PM   
gnosis

 

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thanks!

So how do mining bases compare to building colonies on the place then?

Consider colonies with borderline quality into the negative: i.e. you don't care about the living space, you care about the extraction rate.

(in reply to Data)
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RE: Resource mining speeds? - 3/18/2011 8:18:15 PM   
gnosis

 

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quote:

Yes, the % affects the rate of extraction....there is a forumula in a thread somewhere; lots of threads were done on this.


Any links? Didn't find anything...

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RE: Resource mining speeds? - 3/18/2011 9:16:49 PM   
Merker

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: gnosis

thanks!

So how do mining bases compare to building colonies on the place then?

Consider colonies with borderline quality into the negative: i.e. you don't care about the living space, you care about the extraction rate.

quote:


What if I also have mining components on the spaceport (can I?)? Does that work? Do I double mine the place?

There are multiple reasons for asking this. There are low value planets that have resources you need to mine. Is it better to do it with a mining base or colonize it? Most of the time you really don't care, but what if the place is the only source for the stuff? What method will produce the most resources?


Well, it depends, when there are extremely rare resources involved, I prefer to colonize the planet even if at 10% quality. Several reasons:
1) Orbital bases can get destroyed, and it takes more time to build them, time that can be used by your enemies, pirates or whatever to launch an attack, or send a Colony ship.

2) The colony has infinite cargo space, whereas the space station has a very limited amount which might not bode well for really rare resources, where you get lots of requests, or the demand is very high around.

3) Having a colony there gives you ownership of the system. If you only have a station someone can place a colony in the system and claim that you are "trespassing" and even attack unprovoked.

4) A colony is easily retaken if it falls into enemy hands. A station takes money and time again before it's built and takes a while for the economy to kick back into action for that resource.

A station can be useful in situations where you need a fast placement of ownership on that planet, and you have multiple sources for that resource and want to get as many as possible without bothering with colonies. Colonies are a complication, no matter how you put it. They mean new demand for already strained resources, a risk of rebellion if at war, a reorganization of your trade routes and assignation of valuable freighters to move stuff into that possibly perilous area of space.

Cheers

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RE: Resource mining speeds? - 3/18/2011 10:09:57 PM   
gnosis

 

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quote:

Well, it depends, when there are extremely rare resources involved, I prefer to colonize the planet even if at 10% quality. Several reasons:
1) Orbital bases can get destroyed, and it takes more time to build them, time that can be used by your enemies, pirates or whatever to launch an attack, or send a Colony ship.

2) The colony has infinite cargo space, whereas the space station has a very limited amount which might not bode well for really rare resources, where you get lots of requests, or the demand is very high around.

3) Having a colony there gives you ownership of the system. If you only have a station someone can place a colony in the system and claim that you are "trespassing" and even attack unprovoked.

4) A colony is easily retaken if it falls into enemy hands. A station takes money and time again before it's built and takes a while for the economy to kick back into action for that resource.

A station can be useful in situations where you need a fast placement of ownership on that planet, and you have multiple sources for that resource and want to get as many as possible without bothering with colonies. Colonies are a complication, no matter how you put it. They mean new demand for already strained resources, a risk of rebellion if at war, a reorganization of your trade routes and assignation of valuable freighters to move stuff into that possibly perilous area of space.

Cheers


Thank you for your reply,

Your insight is welcome, although you didn't address the extraction rate issue. Which one is faster? colony or base?

1. Defense is another issue altogether. You can park a fleet, build defense bases, and in general do stuff to fortify the spot. you won't find another extremely rare resource.

2. The question isn't about your run of the mill resources. It's about the ones that exist on 1 or 2 planets only. When you trade that resource to the entire galaxy and there are 100s of colonies and 100s of freighters, cargo space isn't an issue, resource extraction is. And its even more important in the early game where tech is low.

3. you can always build up the rest of the system just to be sure. Also there is always a chance that other planets exist in the system as well. A nice design is a minimum mining base that doesn't cost upkeep and you just drop it to claim stuff.

4. Defend it, if it's very important.

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RE: Resource mining speeds? - 3/18/2011 10:54:58 PM   
Data


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quote:

Your insight is welcome, although you didn't address the extraction rate issue. Which one is faster? colony or base?


Base is always faster than colony, even for the mear fact that you can put as many extractors as you'd like on it. But you have to consider the pros and cons in each situation, I tend to build colonies: they have unlimited cargo, if you put an SP than traffic is increased, bases can be attacked and destroyed while colonies need to be conquered, etc etc.

_____________________________

...Igniting stellar cores....Recharging reactors...Recalibrating hyperdrives....

(in reply to gnosis)
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RE: Resource mining speeds? - 3/18/2011 10:59:13 PM   
Merker

 

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The base is definitely faster, if you add many resource extractors. But you have  a very limited cargo space. I'll try to explain my way of understanding the extraction rate vs cargo space issue.

Once a resource is mined, it's reserved to some customer of your empire or your empire. Once reserved, the resource is basically already paid for until a freighter comes to pick it up. That freighter might take a while to get there, but it doesn't matter for you since you already have the money.
A resource can be reserved multiple times as it gets mined. So an empire can reserve 5000 then 2500 then another 5000, depending greatly on its freighters getting there. At least that's what I've seen.
On a station, only tiny amounts of the resource are reserved, because I think cargo space is taken into account and each customer gets a % of the cargo space reserved, depending on demand.
On a planet, since there is limitless cargo space, each empire gets as much as it wants, as the resource gets mined.
The extraction rate is slower with a colony. BUT until freighters start pouring in, it's basically a reservation game. You get money from storing the resource there for your customers. On a base you have limited space, and so you can only reserve like let's say 10000. On a planet, even if the first freighter takes a year to get there, you'll already have mined 1 000 000 units of that resource, and most of it reserved already. In my opinion that is much better for profits. I might be wrong, but it worked out much better for me, after my SUPER DUPER MEGA ULTRA HIGH TECH CUSTOM MADE MINING STARBASE got whacked by a pirate out of nowhere even before construction. By the time the trade routes were forming I already had plenty of contracts and reserved resource batches lying around, and money was pouring in.

At least that's what I've noticed in my AAR game for the zentabia fluid. I've hardly seen any freighters coming, but there are batches of 2000 or so units of fluid for every empire already there. The colony is in a remote place so that might contribute to the slow distribution. However I have billions coming in already, as you can see from the latest chapter.

3) If the system is already yours the AI will be reluctant to just pop in a Colony out of the blue. Minimum mining bases get blown up by pirates, clog up your warning screen and are a fuss to build for the busy construction ships.

4) You can't always defend a station properly. If the enemy just pops in and focuses on the station, it has a high chance of getting blown up before the enemy fleet is dealt with. And if you're in a war you might not notice among all those battles that a fleet has just attacked that zentabia moon.Also you can't upgrade private mining bases, and starbase class stations don't always work well for trade, also if you build a starbase the planet is not considered owned. I've seen the AI pop a mining base on a planet I already had a starbase on and stealing my mining. That starbase never got visitors as well, so the mining station designation is EXTREMELY important. A colony spaceport can ALWAYS be upgraded.
Besides, resources stay on a planet, while on a base they get blown up with the station. You can always reclaim your planet and the old trade routes. Much less of a fuss.

Of course, I tend to do mixed, depending on my mood and roleplay I have going with the race I'm playing. I'm a base building maniac so I might just be inclined to build a SUPER DUPER MINING SPACEPORT OF DOOM there to speed things up. A colony takes a bit longer to get into the trade circuit.

Cheers

Hope that helps.

(in reply to gnosis)
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RE: Resource mining speeds? - 3/19/2011 10:03:50 AM   
Sithuk

 

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1) Are there any mining enhancements that can be built on a colony to close the gap to what a mining base can achieve in extraction rates?

2) Does the AI prioritise the capture of colonies with the rare resources. Does it "know" the massive value they represent and target accordingly?

(in reply to Merker)
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RE: Resource mining speeds? - 3/19/2011 10:24:17 AM   
Merker

 

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1) Well I don't have ROTS so I don't know, but from what I've read it doesn't seem so.

2) In my games so far the AI is very fast to claim the rare resource sites. In my AAR game, the quameno and the republic were fighting it out for the zentabia moon just as soon as it was discovered, even though each had plenty of wars to take care of. They kept destroying the previous mining base and building their own. Eventually I came along and took it for myself, but that seemed like they do prioritize the rare resources. I've also noticed the AI troop transports going for my resource rich colonies before any core colonies or forward bases.

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RE: Resource mining speeds? - 3/19/2011 6:22:22 PM   
Mofouler

 

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I think Colonies are better in the long run as for one u get taxing income along with the infinite amount of the resourse and space.

Someone also made a great point. We have facilities that can be built on colonies. Most of these are only geared to defending a colony or making better or quicker troops. Another tab for facilities that actually alter the growth of the colony would be great. I think we should remove or maybe reduce the effects on medical facilities and other stuch from space ports and put them on the planetary building tab.

We could add things such as Hospitals to increase growth but take less income. Mining facilities to maybe lower growth abit but increase resource output. Maybe even housing operations to increase Growth exponentially and increase living space. This would allow you to choose which type of colonies you want. It would also give more interactivity to colonies aswell. I feel as though once you colonies and put a station on a colony you don't really have to do anything with it anymore.

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RE: Resource mining speeds? - 3/19/2011 6:55:31 PM   
Data


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quote:

1) Are there any mining enhancements that can be built on a colony to close the gap to what a mining base can achieve in extraction rates?


No, in the vanilla you could not build any planetary buildings at colonies. Since one of the latest patches in ROTS you can build several buildings but none for this.

< Message edited by Data -- 3/19/2011 6:56:29 PM >


_____________________________

...Igniting stellar cores....Recharging reactors...Recalibrating hyperdrives....

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RE: Resource mining speeds? - 3/19/2011 7:59:36 PM   
Merker

 

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Have patience, young Padawan, in 6 months time DW will be a beast with all the additions. just look how it evolved from last year. I think it will soon be a year old, if I'm not mistaken?

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RE: Resource mining speeds? - 3/19/2011 8:20:40 PM   
Data


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afaik, it's already a year and some days old....wans't it launched on the 13th of March last year?

_____________________________

...Igniting stellar cores....Recharging reactors...Recalibrating hyperdrives....

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RE: Resource mining speeds? - 3/19/2011 8:22:47 PM   
Merker

 

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Ah, a lucky day for a launch. And we should have celebrated, who forgot to remind us of that?!?!?! They must be punished with a destruction of their homeworld by a WD. I can't wait for the 2nd add-on which should come this april or may I think.

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RE: Resource mining speeds? - 3/19/2011 8:26:16 PM   
ggf31416

 

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I think the period is 1/2 day, so with 5 you should have 100 in 10 days (at 100%).

< Message edited by ggf31416 -- 3/19/2011 9:36:23 PM >

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