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AI Do-Over? (Bug?)

 
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AI Do-Over? (Bug?) - 7/5/2010 12:25:39 AM   
Thayne

 

Posts: 740
Joined: 6/14/2004
Status: offline
Before I continue with my AAR, I think I would like to know if I can give the AI a do-over on the last turn.

I don't think the AI really meant to do this.:


Naval Gun Fire at Singapore - Coastal Guns Fire Back!

718 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.

Japanese Ships
xAK Yamamiya Maru, Shell hits 13, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Zinzan Maru, Shell hits 6, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Zyuyo Maru, Shell hits 27, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Yosida Maru #1, Shell hits 26, Mine hits 2, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Yahiko Maru, Shell hits 14, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Yamakisan Maru, Shell hits 7, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Yosida Maru #3, Shell hits 6, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Tatuha Maru, Shell hits 8, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Taigen Maru, Shell hits 3, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Shoho Maru, Shell hits 5, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Shikano Maru, Shell hits 4, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Sanura Maru, Shell hits 11, Mine hits 2, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Ryotaku Maru, Shell hits 29, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Ryuyo Maru, Shell hits 37, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Nittei Maru, Shell hits 4, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Nissho Maru, Shell hits 22, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Nichibi Maru, Shell hits 11, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Nansin Maru, Shell hits 11, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Misaku Maru, Shell hits 21, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Meisho Maru, Shell hits 15, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Madras Maru, Shell hits 12, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Kuroshio Maru, Shell hits 8, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Kuretake Maru, Shell hits 3, Mine hits 2, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Kiyozumi Maru, Shell hits 17, Mine hits 2, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Kisogawa Maru, Shell hits 12, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Kiso Maru, Shell hits 3, Mine hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
xAK Kisaragi Maru, Shell hits 4, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Josho Maru, Shell hits 2, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Iwaki Maru, Shell hits 4, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Hokuriku Maru, Shell hits 8, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Azuchi Maru, Shell hits 33, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Anzan Maru #2, Shell hits 6, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAKL Meiko Maru, Shell hits 15, heavy fires, heavy damage



Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Yamamiya Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Zinzan Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Zyuyo Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Yosida Maru #1
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Yahiko Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Yamakisan Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Yosida Maru #3
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Tatuha Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Taigen Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Shoho Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Shikano Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Sanura Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Ryotaku Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Ryuyo Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Nittei Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Nissho Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Nichibi Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Nansin Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Misaku Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Meisho Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Madras Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Kuroshio Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Kuretake Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Kiyozumi Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Kisogawa Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Kiso Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Kisaragi Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Josho Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Iwaki Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Hokuriku Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Azuchi Maru
Singapore Fortress firing at xAK Anzan Maru #2
Singapore Fortress firing at xAKL Meiko Maru


(Oh, and, in addition:

TF 818 encounters mine field at Singapore (50,84)

Japanese Ships
xAK Yamamiya Maru, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Zinzan Maru, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Zyuyo Maru, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Yosida Maru #1, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Yahiko Maru, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Yamakisan Maru, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Yosida Maru #3, Mine hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
)


Now, one curious fact is that none of these ships actually sunk. There are no sinkings reported either here or on the sunk ship list.

Furthermore, it seems that the Japanese were able to use these ships to land an entire Division intact.

Ground combat at Singapore (50,84)

Japanese Shock attack

Attacking force 14032 troops, 166 guns, 172 vehicles, Assault Value = 542

Defending force 28688 troops, 371 guns, 220 vehicles, Assault Value = 625

Japanese adjusted assault: 375

Allied adjusted defense: 737

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 2 (fort level 3)

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), forts(+), op mode(-), preparation(-)
experience(-)
Attacker: shock(+), disruption(-), supply(-)

Japanese ground losses:
448 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 25 disabled
Non Combat: 21 destroyed, 10 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Vehicles lost 38 (15 destroyed, 23 disabled)


Allied ground losses:
1499 casualties reported
Squads: 61 destroyed, 29 disabled
Non Combat: 30 destroyed, 83 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Vehicles lost 22 (2 destroyed, 20 disabled)


Assaulting units:
1st Tank Regiment
5th Division

Defending units:


So . . . . what is going on, and what are my options at this point?

Thayne
Post #: 1
RE: AI Do-Over? (Bug?) - 7/5/2010 12:33:47 AM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 14464
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline
If you send me the turn before this one I will fix it and send it back to you.

The AI sometimes does this kind of thing

a.mcphie@btinternet.com

Andy

(in reply to Thayne)
Post #: 2
RE: AI Do-Over? (Bug?) - 7/5/2010 12:34:59 AM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 14464
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline
The AI sometimes gets its logic congused no matter what we do the Ai finds a loophole to cide on the guns at Singers

We have fixed 99.9% of the occurences but on occasion a new one crops up

Send me a save and i will take a loook

(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 3
RE: AI Do-Over? (Bug?) - 7/5/2010 12:37:00 AM   
Sredni

 

Posts: 705
Joined: 9/30/2004
From: Canada
Status: offline
I had the AI sail a group like that into singapores teeth and get chewed up. It also sailed a CV through the hex that proceeded to hit a mine. I just shrugged and figured the ai was just the ai. You'd have to go back months and still not be sure of avoiding that landing. I think the ai's pretty linear.

(in reply to Thayne)
Post #: 4
RE: AI Do-Over? (Bug?) - 7/5/2010 1:17:29 AM   
Don Bowen


Posts: 8162
Joined: 7/13/2000
From: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Status: offline

The problem is the map around Singapore. If a "enemy" TF wants to pass Singapore and move up/down the Malacca Strait it has little option but to pass through a hex containing a base. If the TF were to sail through the Sunda Strait, for example, it increases the distance and my come into comflict with the Tf's endurance. So a TF may decide it has to go that way and blindly does it. Every occurence is different, each needs it's own Dutch Boy's finger.

(in reply to Sredni)
Post #: 5
RE: AI Do-Over? (Bug?) - 7/5/2010 1:19:00 AM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 14464
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
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it was a TF neeeding fuel so it was heading to Johore Don it was just passing through to Johore I reset its home base hopefully that will fic it

(in reply to Don Bowen)
Post #: 6
RE: AI Do-Over? (Bug?) - 7/5/2010 1:26:59 AM   
Misconduct


Posts: 1864
Joined: 2/18/2009
From: Cape Canaveral, Florida
Status: offline
Doesn't beat the AI sending every warship it has to Pearl to be blown out of oblivion by the shore batteries if not aircraft first.




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(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 7
RE: AI Do-Over? (Bug?) - 7/5/2010 1:57:36 AM   
Thayne

 

Posts: 740
Joined: 6/14/2004
Status: offline
Thank you, Andy.

The problem seems to have been fixed.

As go the fortunes of war, some other differences this turn are...

I failed this time to catch a Japanese surface force near Baker Island and put 1000 lb bombs into 1 CA, 2 CL, and a DD.
Nor did I manage to find and sink a troop laden AK near Indochina.
Nor did my cargo ship manage to escape the Japanese destroyer near Midway without being seen (this time, was sunk instead).

For your efforts, I am most grateful.

The war (and the AAR) shall go on.

Thayne




(in reply to Misconduct)
Post #: 8
RE: AI Do-Over? (Bug?) - 7/5/2010 2:31:27 AM   
Rainer

 

Posts: 1210
Joined: 11/21/2000
From: Neuching, Bavaria, Germany
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Ever played AI?

_____________________________

WitP/AE
1.7.11.26b
Data base changes by Andy Mac October 16, 2012
Scen #1 Allied vs AI Level Hard Daily Turns
Art Mods by TomLabel and Reg
Topo Map by chemkid

WitW / Torch
1.01.37 - 1.01.44 beta

(in reply to Misconduct)
Post #: 9
RE: AI Do-Over? (Bug?) - 7/5/2010 2:50:30 AM   
Thayne

 

Posts: 740
Joined: 6/14/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sredni

I had the AI sail a group like that into singapores teeth and get chewed up. It also sailed a CV through the hex that proceeded to hit a mine. I just shrugged and figured the ai was just the ai. You'd have to go back months and still not be sure of avoiding that landing. I think the ai's pretty linear.


For most things, I will take this result. But I am not interested in beating the AI. I prefer an interesting game to winning. I am grateful that Andy fixed this - even with the other costs - since it will help to keep the game interesting.

If you read my AAR, you will see that I would have a very difficult time writing an article about such an event.

I think I know what I did to cause this event. It's all of the submarines that I have near Singapore, and the task force attempting to sail around them. (They are near Singapore because I was trying to get them fueled while Singapore still exists.) So, if I want to avoid wild and eratic paths for enemy merchant task forces, I should be careful how I place my submarines.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rainer

Ever played AI?


Of course, I AM playing against the AI. Did you mean to ask, did I ever play PBEM?

The way I play, I don't think a PBEM game would work well. A PBEM opponent would walk all over me, because I make moves based on political motivation more than because they make sense in the context of the game.

I can't abandon Burma.

I take foolish risks with my carriers for no reason other than the American people demand it.

I used all sorts of house rules at the start of the game that substantially had the allies doing almost nothing through most of December.

Make those types of moves against a Japanese PBEM opponent and he'll be celebrating Christmas in Denver.

(in reply to Sredni)
Post #: 10
RE: AI Do-Over? (Bug?) - 7/5/2010 2:52:42 AM   
Rainer

 

Posts: 1210
Joined: 11/21/2000
From: Neuching, Bavaria, Germany
Status: offline
My post was for Misconduct.

_____________________________

WitP/AE
1.7.11.26b
Data base changes by Andy Mac October 16, 2012
Scen #1 Allied vs AI Level Hard Daily Turns
Art Mods by TomLabel and Reg
Topo Map by chemkid

WitW / Torch
1.01.37 - 1.01.44 beta

(in reply to Thayne)
Post #: 11
RE: AI Do-Over? (Bug?) - 7/5/2010 2:57:05 AM   
Misconduct


Posts: 1864
Joined: 2/18/2009
From: Cape Canaveral, Florida
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rainer

My post was for Misconduct.


Yeah, what about AI games?

_____________________________

ASUS Maximus IV Extreme-Z Intel Core I7 2800k Corsair Hydro Heatsink Corsair Vengeance DD3 24GB EVGA GTX 580 Western Digital 1.5TB Raid 0 Windows 7

(in reply to Rainer)
Post #: 12
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