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A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 3:25:27 PM   
fbs

 

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We all paid for a product, and we expect the product to be mostly free of bugs. That's a reasonable expectation. So we hope and expect to get a few free patches for the most important known problems -- can't fix all bugs, that's impossible in any complex software, but we expect it to be reasonable stable and without obvious bugs.

Now, we didn't pay for improvements. We've been asking Matrix to provide free improvements in many areas of the game, and while they certainly can do that in order to make a better product, there is a limit up to where it makes business sense to provide free upgrades to a product that has been delivered already (my TV maker doesn't do that). To expect major free improvements is unrealistic.

But, when the current game is reasonably bug-free, we could work out an Upgrade, or Expansion Package for the game, with a selection of improvements from those we requested. Not a brand new game (that would take 5 years), but an upgrade of the existing one.

Sell that for something between $10 and $20, and schedule one such package say every 3-4 months. That's very little cost for us - between $3 and $6 per month, and gives a commercial incentive for Matrix to keep people working on the game. Otherwise, realistically, the stuff that we're asking for will be done only on WITP III and I'll probably be quite old by then

Thanks
fbs
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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 3:36:39 PM   
Templer_12


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quote:

ORIGINAL: fbs


We all paid for a product, and we expect the product to be mostly free of bugs. That's a reasonable expectation. So we hope and expect to get a few free patches for the most important known problems -- can't fix all bugs, that's impossible in any complex software, but we expect it to be reasonable stable and without obvious bugs.

Now, we didn't pay for improvements. We've been asking Matrix to provide free improvements in many areas of the game, and while they certainly can do that in order to make a better product, there is a limit up to where it makes business sense to provide free upgrades to a product that has been delivered already (my TV maker doesn't do that). To expect major free improvements is unrealistic.

But, when the current game is reasonably bug-free, we could work out an Upgrade, or Expansion Package for the game, with a selection of improvements from those we requested. Not a brand new game (that would take 5 years), but an upgrade of the existing one.

Sell that for something between $10 and $20, and schedule one such package say every 3-4 months
. That's very little cost for us - between $3 and $6 per month, and gives a commercial incentive for Matrix to keep people working on the game. Otherwise, realistically, the stuff that we're asking for will be done only on WITP III and I'll probably be quite old by then

Thanks
fbs


I agree. The game is worth any penny, and also, thats rarely I think, developers and company are.

First upgrade I recommend, my US subs joy further education by the Dönitz U-boat college.

< Message edited by Templer -- 8/18/2009 3:42:01 PM >


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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 3:37:39 PM   
jjax


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This seems to be the new thing for game developers. And if it extends the life of a great game, then why not?

I would buy additional high quality scenarios for WITP:AE.

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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 3:42:59 PM   
Bearcat2

 

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I thought I bought a game on the premise that if there problems that they would be addressed by the compnay that released the game; which BTW; IMHO, Matrix does better than any other company that I have bought games from. You would have to define "improvements" to better understand your point.  


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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 3:47:18 PM   
jjax


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I don't think he means bug fixes. I am sure he is talking about content; whatever that may be. Matrix games is not obligated to provide additional scenarios or mods. But they have an obligation to fix a reasonable amount of bugs.

However, that being said they have already said they would provide several scenarios in future patches for free.

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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 3:49:14 PM   
Mistmatz

 

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Tar and feather the heretic I say!

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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 3:50:46 PM   
Templer_12


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Hi Termite2,

I think you "reply" goes to fbs?

In my case. I am sure there is plenty of room in the hole "sub case". I. e. more specialized commands, more individual reports, a deeper "inside" and so on.

Well, I am a "sub freak"

< Message edited by Templer -- 8/18/2009 3:56:07 PM >


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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 4:07:10 PM   
fbs

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Termite2

I thought I bought a game on the premise that if there problems that they would be addressed by the compnay that released the game; which BTW; IMHO, Matrix does better than any other company that I have bought games from. You would have to define "improvements" to better understand your point.  




This is what I would call improvements/upgrades: options for different display resolutions; add refugee effects; add political events (like Kill Yamamoto); add TOAW-style events; add propaganda factors (like Doolittle Raid - improves overall morale); allow the player to create Corps and assign them; add realistic fog-of-war to submarine operations; add a casualty count to my services (that's the first thing we ask in real world -- how many were killed/wounded up so far); give medals to leaders/pilots; give battle stars to ships; give citations to units; improve realism; improve playability; improve AI; add TXT reports (like List All My Ships); export data in CSV format; let the player build roads & railroads (i.e., a static land unit that behaves like a road/railroad); add railyards to cities; add options to attack factories/shipyards/railyards in aerial attack; etc...

I kinda could go on forever.. hahaha... Of course, different people have different priorities and some (or most) of the stuff above is probably too complicated to implement, so it would take someone knowledgeable with "what the customers want" and "what's possible to do" to sort out the contents of an upgrade package. But if you work in small steps every few months, in a couple of years we'll have a lot of good stuff.

Cheers
fbs

< Message edited by fbs -- 8/18/2009 4:14:01 PM >

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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 4:15:42 PM   
Templer_12


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quote:

ORIGINAL: fbs

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termite2

I thought I bought a game on the premise that if there problems that they would be addressed by the compnay that released the game; which BTW; IMHO, Matrix does better than any other company that I have bought games from. You would have to define "improvements" to better understand your point.  




This is what I would call improvements/upgrades: options for different display resolutions; add refugee effects; add political events (like Kill Yamamoto); add TOAW-style events; add propaganda factors (like Doolittle Raid - improves overall morale); allow the player to create Corps and assign them; add realistic fog-of-war to submarine operations; add a casualty count to my services (that's the first thing we ask in real world -- how many were killed/wounded up so far); give medals to leaders/pilots; give battle stars to ships; give citations to units; improve realism; improve playability; improve AI; add TXT reports (like List All My Ships); export data in CSV format; let the player build roads & railroads (i.e., a static land unit that behaves like a road/railroad); add railyards to cities; add options to attack factories/shipyards/railyards in aerial attack; etc...

I kinda could go on forever.. hahaha...

Cheers
fbs


Decoration to heroes. Thats what I love to see. Would makes any campain lot more personally!

More ingame music would also be fine. Especially japanese music. Or jap. music if you play the jap. side and so allied music for the allied side. It should be mostly historical.

And I love Tokyo rose so much. More of it!!!!!

< Message edited by Templer -- 8/18/2009 4:21:09 PM >


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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 4:18:10 PM   
fbs

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Templer

Decoration to heroes. Thats what I love to see. Would makes any campain lot more personally!



Oh, did I list "ALLOW THE PLAYER TO ADD NOTES/REMINDERS".... that would be priceless (at least for me, I keep forgetting what I wanted to do some 500 ships back... hahahaha

fbs

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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 4:31:21 PM   
Templer_12


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I think sound and music is also very important. Have you watched a thrilling movie and turned the sound off. Atmosphere?/thrill - ah ...gone!

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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 4:41:02 PM   
Kumppi


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I usually listen my own music when playing so for me thats not important.

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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 4:44:28 PM   
V22 Osprey


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An expansion with a few more smaller scenarios and hypothetical experimental units would be cool.

It would be awesome to see how these would perform:


The F6F-6 Hellcat.It's beatiful, too bad it was never really used.If all my beloved Hellcats had that engine, I would be untouchable.This unit would make a great experimental/bonus unit for an expansion.

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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 6:03:50 PM   
jwilkerson


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The thinking in this thread is actually part of how this whole AE project got started in the first place. Originally we called AE the EP (Enhancement Pack) it was going to be a "few improvements" and some "new scenarios". Three years later, it is AE.


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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 6:07:48 PM   
Iridium


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

The thinking in this thread is actually part of how this whole AE project got started in the first place. Originally we called AE the EP (Enhancement Pack) it was going to be a "few improvements" and some "new scenarios". Three years later, it is AE.



I recall the first discussion I had with you guys went far beyond the initial laid down plans and were thrown out due to time constraints etc. After that it seemed to have developed into much more of an enterprise, for the better I might add.

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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 6:21:46 PM   
Templer_12


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

The thinking in this thread is actually part of how this whole AE project got started in the first place. Originally we called AE the EP (Enhancement Pack) it was going to be a "few improvements" and some "new scenarios". Three years later, it is AE.



Maybe fbs want to say: OK - outstanding job - but now stop your vacation and start the next three!

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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 6:30:50 PM   
PaulWRoberts

 

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I think the off-map areas are a good compromise, but I would love to see the map expanded to include them in a more organic manner. If that requires expanding the game to include the Atlantic naval campaigns and the land war in Europe and the Middle East, so be it.


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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 6:43:43 PM   
Terminus


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Sure, go right ahead... We'll see you in three years...

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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 6:45:31 PM   
fbs

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Templer


quote:

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

The thinking in this thread is actually part of how this whole AE project got started in the first place. Originally we called AE the EP (Enhancement Pack) it was going to be a "few improvements" and some "new scenarios". Three years later, it is AE.



Maybe fbs want to say: OK - outstanding job - but now stop your vacation and start the next three!



Yeah! Who let the 1st USMC Programming Platoon to change the mission to Rest? The Barbarians (i.e., the customers) are at the gates!


Cheers
fbs

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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 7:02:24 PM   
Terminus


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Yeah, that's what we're doing... "Resting"... Sure...

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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 7:28:02 PM   
Templer_12


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quote:

ORIGINAL: fbs


quote:

ORIGINAL: Templer


quote:

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

The thinking in this thread is actually part of how this whole AE project got started in the first place. Originally we called AE the EP (Enhancement Pack) it was going to be a "few improvements" and some "new scenarios". Three years later, it is AE.



Maybe fbs want to say: OK - outstanding job - but now stop your vacation and start the next three!



Yeah! Who let the 1st USMC Programming Platoon to change the mission to Rest? The Barbarians (i.e., the customers) are at the gates!


Cheers
fbs


From the halls of Matrixgames to the shores of WitP:AE...

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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 7:42:58 PM   
fbs

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Yeah, that's what we're doing... "Resting"... Sure...



Ops.. that was just a little joke. My apologies. I'm throughly impressed with the dedication of all involved with the project

fbs

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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 7:54:58 PM   
Andy Mac

 

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Smaller scenarios are having to take a back seat to patch 1 at present

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RE: A proposal for paid upgrades/expansion - 8/18/2009 8:33:36 PM   
V22 Osprey


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I think 2 by 3 should make a ''War in the Atlantic" game.Sure the atlantic theatre wasn't really that interesting, but there were quite a few good battles.A full Hypothetical Campaign that makes the atlantic more interesting would be fun.Britian would have to find ways to escort the supply ships from US.The Panama Canal could be included as an off map area to get reinforcements from the Pacific to the Atlantic.It would also include a "Battle for Britian" scenario focusing on the WitP's Air Combat engine.

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