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Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 2:37:48 PM   
Yakface


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Question for someone in-the-know. Units ot the RTA are in a restricted command which itself is part of the Southern (unrestricted) army. Are they approriate to use in Burma and/or Malaya or should they be considered a home guard army?

Thanks
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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 2:41:37 PM   
bstarr


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unless I'm sorely mistaken, historical use would be homeguard only.

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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 3:00:10 PM   
Andy Mac

 

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Yup

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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 3:02:06 PM   
Brady


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They did venture into the North, though briefly, so it could be argued that sending them into Burma is reasionable from that perspective.

Its not as if the Allies dont have scades of units that they can walk across the boarder either howeaver, in a PBEM game it is imo advisable to come to an agreament with your aponet concerning the movements of restricted units across frontears they would not of normaly crosed Historicaly, at least untill we can implement Boarders.



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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 3:11:45 PM   
Q-Ball


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When I start a PBEM, at this point the only HRs I foresee involve crossing of national borders.

Manchukuo and Collaborationist Chinese should never cross a border

Allied Chinese should only enter Burma, Vietnam, Manchukuo, or Mongolia. They should never be loaded on a ship (well, maybe to Hainan Island). Even moving Chinese units to India is ahistorical, unless they are cut off from China. Just getting Chaing to lend a couple divisions, equipped by the US, to clear the Burma road was like pulling teeth.

And RTA units should stay in Thailand, with the exception of maybe a minor move into Burma (the Shan states).

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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 3:22:04 PM   
Shark7


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From looking at it, only part of the units that ventured north are even in there.

Historically, the Phayap (Northern) Army did venture into the Shan states, engaging the Chinese (not the British or Burmese) all the way to Lwoi River near the Chinese border.

However, the Phayap Army OOB is very incomplete in game, as historically it consisted of 4 divisions and several independant Bns and Rgts.

Some quick info on the RTA in WWII: http://www.geocities.com/thailandwwii/oob.html

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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 3:56:32 PM   
Brady


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Prety cool link on Chinese Forces in Burma, and Burma in General:

http://homepages.force9.net/rothwell/burmaweb/ChineseXForce.htm



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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 4:32:41 PM   
Shark7


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brady


Prety cool link on Chinese Forces in Burma, and Burma in General:

http://homepages.force9.net/rothwell/burmaweb/ChineseXForce.htm




That's a usefull link, Thank you.

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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 5:41:41 PM   
sven6345789

 

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t hink paying the political points to attach the units to another HQ should be enough. The Thai units should be restricted, as are Manchukuo and Wang-Tsching Wais Tax collectors (just love that unit);
I doubt they are useful anywhere on the map except as garrisons

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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 6:05:06 PM   
Scott_USN

 

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They sent a full division 6th RTA to attack my 11th Chinese Army at Tougoo and were soundly spanked, tied, laughed at and sent back south. Now they have come back another spanking coming.

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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 6:12:01 PM   
Laxplayer

 

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In my GC game vs Allies, the 1st and 2nd RTA joined the IJA in steamrolling me at Pegu and Rangoon. Remains to be seen if they head north.

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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 6:52:01 PM   
Shark7


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Actually, the RTA incursion into the Shan States was very successfull. They stalemated at the Lwoi River.

And the RTA had combat experience from 1940 when they fought the Vichy French Indochina forces to a stalemate as well.

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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 6:55:44 PM   
Jim D Burns


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball
Even moving Chinese units to India is ahistorical, unless they are cut off from China.


Not true, two shattered Chinese divisions that had withdrawn from Burma were reformed into the New 38th and New 22nd divisions and a third Chinese division (30th) was formed from scratch. All were fleshed out, equipped and trained on Indian soil at Ramgarh in the Province of Bihar in India. The men needed for these units were air lifted to Ramgarh from China.

These units formed the core of the allied counter-attacks (commanded by Stilwell) in 1943 that lead to the liberation of northern Burma. It's sad that history has all but forgotten this part of China's involvement in the war, as they performed very well indeed.

http://cbi-theater-1.home.comcast.net/~cbi-theater-1/cai/cai.html

Jim


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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 6:59:55 PM   
EwingNJ

 

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Jim D beat me to the punch about Ramgarh and the airlift.

For the American perspective on CBI see: http://ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USA/USA-CBI-Mission/index.html

Chapter 6 discusses Ramgarh and the airlift.

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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 7:01:39 PM   
Scott_USN

 

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I read a book about Stilwell what a tough old bastard he was! He believed in the Chinese troops too just had no use for the warlords calling themselves generals.

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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 7:09:01 PM   
Jim D Burns


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Scott_USN

I read a book about Stilwell what a tough old bastard he was! He believed in the Chinese troops too just had no use for the warlords calling themselves generals.



I recommend you read the Stilwell papers. It's a collection of his diary entries during the war his wife released after his death, quite a good read. It's full of little nuggets of history that you'd never know otherwise, like the fact the Mexican army was helping US troops look for supposed hidden Japanese airfields in the California deserts in the weeks after Pearl.

LOL, the level of fear and paranoia in those first few weeks are quite telling when you read his comments. His command was even getting reports of Jap planes flying over S.F. and invasion fleets 100 miles off the coast.

Jim


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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 7:12:46 PM   
EwingNJ

 

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What did he write in reference to the great anti-aircraft battle of Los Angeles?

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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 7:15:23 PM   
Jim D Burns


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quote:

ORIGINAL: EwingNJ

What did he write in reference to the great anti-aircraft battle of Los Angeles?



Can't remember off hand as I read it several years ago, and I loaned the book to my nephew, so I can't look it up. My impression was he took the reports seriously for a few days to a week, and then grew extremely skeptical and angrier as time went on. He had very little patience for incompetence.

Jim

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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 7:42:14 PM   
jwilkerson


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball
When I start a PBEM, at this point the only HRs I foresee involve crossing of national borders.


We are actually working on implementing borders - but I doubt it will make patch 01 - hopefully patch 02. But until we can implement borders, I agree that house rules for borders are necessary, as they were in stock.



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RE: Royal Thai Army - 8/7/2009 8:13:22 PM   
Q-Ball


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson


quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball
When I start a PBEM, at this point the only HRs I foresee involve crossing of national borders.


We are actually working on implementing borders - but I doubt it will make patch 01 - hopefully patch 02. But until we can implement borders, I agree that house rules for borders are necessary, as they were in stock.




That's great! These kind of restrictions are pretty easy to HR though, because they are clear cut, and easy to see if there is a violation. There are probably more important things to fix in patch 1, like the AK-t conversions.

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