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Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wargame - 8/19/2008 9:41:37 PM   
invernomuto


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Hi guys,
in your opinion, what is the best tactical WW2 wargame ever created?

In my (short) wargamer life I tried:
1) Combat mission series (BO, BtB and AK). Masterpieces, but a little too complicated for me. I usually get lost expecially in great battles. Many units and 3D graphics are a knock out combination for me :) . However, I'll surely try the WW2 module for CM:SF engine.
2) Panzer Command Series: a good and promising series with a solid gameplay. The next charpter could easily be a masterpiece.
3) Close Combat: COI: I've bought this title recently, after reading the some entusiastic review on the net (expecially wargamer one, very well done!). I totally missed the Close combat series in the 90' (ok, my shame!). What can I say of COI? Another masterpiece. Before COI, I never thought I could really like an RTS. I was wrong.
4) JT:Campaign Series: good game, but even if the scale is tactical (250 mt x hex) you have a lots of units to control in medium-big scenarios. It's quite an operational IMHO.

Others games that I cannot miss?

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 8/19/2008 10:27:33 PM   
Titanwarrior89


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You won't get people around here to agree on every game so.................It's not developed yet.  However there is some very good ones.  The ones you mentioned and Steel panthers world at war.

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 8/20/2008 1:00:04 AM   
Sarge


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CMBB tops my all time list


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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 8/20/2008 1:11:51 AM   
GJK


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Boardgame: ASL, no doubt
PC: I'm with Sarge, CMBB

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 8/20/2008 7:07:53 PM   
V22 Osprey


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Tactical:
SPWAW
Combat Mission ENTIRE SERIES

Campaign Series



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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 8/20/2008 8:07:06 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

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If you haven't tried SPWAW (or any kind of SP) then you definitely should.

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 8/22/2008 8:41:27 AM   
Blind Sniper


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quote:

what is the best tactical WW2 wargame ever created?


Do you want a playable game (not so hard) or a monster game?

If your answer is the second one, as far as I know Advanced Squad Leader is the best choice, I bought the starter kit a short time ago, because anyone that play it speaks in the same way as GJK.
ASL is a great game but you pay attention because it's very tough in the beginning.

It's a bordgame (Face to Face) but you can play online or PBeM (VASSAL program) as well.

Non ha paragoni, ciao!


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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 8/23/2008 1:01:11 AM   
Veldor


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Blind Sniper

quote:

what is the best tactical WW2 wargame ever created?


Do you want a playable game (not so hard) or a monster game?

If your answer is the second one, as far as I know Advanced Squad Leader is the best choice, I bought the starter kit a short time ago, because anyone that play it speaks in the same way as GJK.
ASL is a great game but you pay attention because it's very tough in the beginning.

It's a bordgame (Face to Face) but you can play online or PBeM (VASSAL program) as well.

Non ha paragoni, ciao!





Ditto on this. I've wasted at least a decade if not 2 waiting and/or trying to find a replacement for ASL before I finally asked myself why?

The Starter Kits eliminate the only real objection anyone could have... the complexity. Now its super simple to get started.

Vassal has evolved enough to make itself more than usable as a PC way to play ASL.

And honestly, I've always prefered understanding how the game mechanics worked anyway. Which, of course, is the one extra thing you have to do with ASL..since it is the player enforcing them, not the computer (Though VASL seems to have added quite a few tools to assist).

ASL Starter Kit #1 only has 10 pages of rules (Thats not a typo) and thats with many illustrations including at least one whole page example of play.

They also give it away online. Mine was something like $18.00 brand new so you have to give MMP some credit for making it about as approachable now as anyone could wish for.

+3 for ASL

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 8/23/2008 11:07:44 AM   
Krasny

 

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For a boardgame I'd go with Combat Commander from GMT. It's a simple fun game.

PC, CMBB. No brainer really, nothing can touch it. Not ever MC Hammer.

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 8/23/2008 4:17:12 PM   
Prince of Eckmühl


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MP campaign in Close Combat 2. You can take your pick of Arnhem, Eindhoven or Nijmegen (or the whole enchilada). Best computer gaming experience that I've ever had. Nothing else like it, anywhere, including the other CC games. Wonderful, wonderful, wonderful.

PoE (aka ivanmoe)


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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 8/25/2008 12:38:08 PM   
Blind Sniper


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quote:

The Starter Kits eliminate the only real objection anyone could have... the complexity. Now its super simple to get started.


I don't think "super simple" but surely it's approachable now

quote:

Mine was something like $18.00 brand new


In Italy about € 30 (around) but it is definitely a deal!

OT: Veldor, Are you playing it yet?

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 8/31/2008 5:31:53 PM   
rich12545

 

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I played cmbo and now play cmak.  Never bought cmbb.  Just wondering why everyone thinks it's so much better than cmak.  Is it just the theater or is there something about the gameplay that makes it better?

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 8/31/2008 6:39:44 PM   
GJK


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The theater and TO&E's is all. The gameplay is the same.

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 8/31/2008 8:06:30 PM   
KG Erwin


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I may be somewhat biased, but to me, SPWAW is THE WWII-era tactical game. Nevermind my meager contributions to the Screaming Eagles Mega Campaign and the USMC OOB, OK?

Honestly, though, the expansiveness of the whole package makes it a true classic. When programmer Michael Wood came back to assist in the development of the Enhanced version, it got even better.

The twists and turns this game has taken over the years is a fascinating story in of itself, and I'm proud to have been a participant in some of it.

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 9/2/2008 5:29:09 PM   
Kuokkanen

 

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My vote for SPWAW. It's the best tactical level combat sim of WW2 era I've played (still haven't tried WinSPWW2). Try it, only cost is time and bandwidth to download it
http://www.steelpanthersonline.com

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 9/2/2008 5:43:55 PM   
Zakhal


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SPWAW megacampaigns are the best propably allthough the graphics look like pixelated mess nowadays. After that combat mission. 

< Message edited by Zakhal -- 9/2/2008 5:44:00 PM >


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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 9/2/2008 10:54:59 PM   
Lützow


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It's a shame one can't combine mega campaigns with WinSPWW2. At 1600x1200 resolution this game looks better than SPWAW and JTCS.

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 9/3/2008 2:18:20 AM   
Mad Cow


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winSPWW2

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 9/3/2008 2:19:00 AM   
Mad Cow


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Oh and CMBB is the best tactical ww2 game I've ever played. And I don't think its all that complicated. 

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 9/3/2008 2:20:45 AM   
Mad Cow


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quote:

ORIGINAL: rich12545

I played cmbo and now play cmak.  Never bought cmbb.  Just wondering why everyone thinks it's so much better than cmak.  Is it just the theater or is there something about the gameplay that makes it better?



In CMBB there is a greater timeframe (41-45), and a big variation in equipment. Plus it's the theater where the decisive battles of the European Theater were fought.

And it has T-34/85's! :D

edit: now that I think about it, I'm not sure what the CMAK timeframe was.

< Message edited by Mad Cow -- 9/3/2008 2:21:24 AM >


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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 9/3/2008 6:17:34 AM   
ANZAC_Tack


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Im been a close combat junkie since 96, having a break with CoD4 for a short interlude, CoI was good(i tested it), try CCMT maybe for modern feel, but its 1 day battles ONLY!

try ur older CCV invasion normandy, a bit old now($10 aud bargin bins by SSI), but go to sites like CloseCombatOnline, it has FREE mods and maps made by gamers,changes everything, russian front, pacific theatre, even now kokoda trail,israel 1967, dozens of war periods. soon CCIV is getting a rebuild,not sure of release. 64 interconnecting maps,most new,some new units and all XP/vista issues sorted.called WaR.released by matrix at a guess december 17th????? all i dont know,just guessing.

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 9/3/2008 2:19:55 PM   
Neilster


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mad Cow

quote:

ORIGINAL: rich12545

I played cmbo and now play cmak. Never bought cmbb. Just wondering why everyone thinks it's so much better than cmak. Is it just the theater or is there something about the gameplay that makes it better?



In CMBB there is a greater timeframe (41-45), and a big variation in equipment. Plus it's the theater where the decisive battles of the European Theater were fought.

And it has T-34/85's! :D

edit: now that I think about it, I'm not sure what the CMAK timeframe was.

40-45, if you include all the theatres. And as for CMBB, what about the JS-2? :)

I once made a cool meeting-engagement scenario with a several Sturmmörsers (Sturmmörseren?) in convoy and moving towards a village, protected by some other armour, armoured cars and troops in trucks against a mixed Soviet force with a couple of JS-2s. Look out if one of those huge rockets lands anywhere near you!

As for CMBB vs CMAK...they are very similar but CMAK is technically slightly better. A lot of people just like the Eastern Front aspect of CMBB.

Cheers, Neilster






Attachment (2)

< Message edited by Neilster -- 9/3/2008 2:25:17 PM >

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 9/3/2008 3:11:57 PM   
Kuokkanen

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mad Cow

quote:

ORIGINAL: rich12545

I played cmbo and now play cmak.  Never bought cmbb.  Just wondering why everyone thinks it's so much better than cmak.  Is it just the theater or is there something about the gameplay that makes it better?



In CMBB there is a greater timeframe (41-45), and a big variation in equipment. Plus it's the theater where the decisive battles of the European Theater were fought.

And it has T-34/85's! :D

And it misses T-35 becouse of game engine limitations.

To me, game killer is crappy camera controls. Many RTS games (and Ground Control in particular) have better camera controls than CM serie

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 9/5/2008 4:51:44 AM   
Mad Cow


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Matti Kuokkanen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mad Cow

quote:

ORIGINAL: rich12545

I played cmbo and now play cmak.  Never bought cmbb.  Just wondering why everyone thinks it's so much better than cmak.  Is it just the theater or is there something about the gameplay that makes it better?



In CMBB there is a greater timeframe (41-45), and a big variation in equipment. Plus it's the theater where the decisive battles of the European Theater were fought.

And it has T-34/85's! :D

And it misses T-35 becouse of game engine limitations.

To me, game killer is crappy camera controls. Many RTS games (and Ground Control in particular) have better camera controls than CM serie


It's not the best camera, that is for sure, but it didn't detract from the game very much.

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 9/10/2008 2:38:29 AM   
madgamer2

 

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give up now before it is to late. There is no such thing as the perfect game. I used to believe this and have a whole closet full of games that I thought were it...they were not.

Madgamer

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RE: Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wa... - 9/10/2008 8:57:54 AM   
Shaun Wallace


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quote:

Looking for the "perfect" tactical WW2 wargame

 
Hmm, if the operative word in the post was tactical then the CC series is in the lead and then some, far from perfect, but when its being used by several branches of the military to train with, you have to ask if its something out of the ordinary! In terms of tactical and reactive AI, theres nothing even close ;)

Of course thats just MHO lol!

Sulla

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