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Fall Grun 1938 - 10/1/2007 8:11:29 PM   
Karri

 

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A little change from the FitE games, I decided to play a shorter and smaller scale scenario and this is what my opponent suggested. It's a pretty good scenario and I recomment it.

Anyways, situation as following: Germans attacking Czechs. First 2 turns are ceasefire and thus free deployment. After looking at the situation I decide to block all advancing routes and concentrate my reserves that are most open. There are three such places:

Ostrava - here the enemy can attack along a width of 8 hexes. Enemy breakthrough would mean a disaster since it's pretty much open plains after this line. Plus I wouldn't have enough units to extend my line which would mean open route to the rear of of the units in Bratislava. Therefore I also deploy plenty of reinforcements here. Plenty as in those I can spare.

Bratislava-Wien area - this is a pretty wide area, and it sucked up a decent amount of my troops. Most of the reinforcements are placed in Bratislava in order to keep the city. Danger of breakthrough is not considerable despite the width of the frontline, since there are plenty of rivers, hills and forest here. Despite that there is still the danger of enemy getting through and hitting the Ostrava area in rear.

Praha, west - West of Praha is also a pretty open place. It does have hills and forest though which makes the area easier to defend. There are not many reinforcements here.

My initial tactic was to block enemy advance and delay him...however after taking a closer look on turn two I see that this is no possible without blocking of the smaller routes completely. Thus I decide to launch counter-attacks against these positions, and move some of the reserves...Praha is now completely out of reserves but that doesn't concern me since the frontlines are so close I can move units from there.



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RE: Fall Grun 1938 - 10/1/2007 8:22:16 PM   
Karri

 

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What happened then? Well the enemy punched forwards and I sent in reinforcements to block and delay him. Luckily I had decided to launch the counter-attacks, and due to the reserves at hand these gave me local superioty and allowed the counter-attacks to succeed.

First one happened at Liberec where an entire division was destroyed. Second one South-West of Praha, where the enemy was pushed back. Elsewhere I only took back a single hex or two or pulled back and tried to delay the enemy. The enemy had some pretty strong units, but with concentrated blows these were driven back and some even destroyed.

On turn 4 I decided to try my luck and push forwards from Bratislava towards Wien. To my surprise the attack was succesful. So succesful I got within 1 hex from Wien...and the enemy had apparently tied all his units to attack my frontline. I also made a few more succesful counter-attacks and drove off some of the enemy untis that had managed to break my line.

On top of that the enemy had left his frontline in Glatz unguarded and I decided to strike in there aswell.

Turn 5 was the decisive one, as I managed to capture Wien which was the win condition for me. In the meantime the attack towards Glatz was also proceeding(it would have either ended up in encirclement of enemy forces, or forcing him to move up units from his attacking forces in Ostrava).

I was also moving my tank reserves towards the open flank of enemy forces in west of Praha and I would have launched a counter-offensive there next turn.


(in reply to Karri)
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RE: Fall Grun 1938 - 10/1/2007 8:26:39 PM   
Karri

 

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Notes:
-Germans have too many and Czech too few units for delay to be succesful. Also the time limit of the scenario allows the germany to push forwards hex at a time. Thus counter-attacks seem to be the key to victory for Czechs.
-The german units are stronger than czech units, BUT there are several czech units that are above the normal strenght and on top of that the czechs have strong artillery. Key to victory seems to be the artillery, which needs to be concentrated together with the armored and stronger-than-average units. This then leads to succesful counter-offensives.
-These offensives need to be directed against weak enemy forces, objectives or at the flanks of the enemy offensives. As long as you can keep the mountain ranges you are in a pretty good position to defend yourself.

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RE: Fall Grun 1938 - 10/2/2007 12:31:14 AM   
1925frank

 

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Karri,

I've played this one as both the German and the Czechs.  I agree it was both interesting and challenging.  Congratulations on capturing Wien as the Czechs.  I never came close.






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RE: Fall Grun 1938 - 10/2/2007 9:12:16 AM   
B/snafu


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I was the brilliant german commander in this who lost WWII before it even had a chance to begin. Never had played it before but I am interested in the early war aspect for germany so wanted to give it a go. Karri's "human" intelligence and his counterattcks caught me completly unexpectedly and he really schooled me in this one.



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RE: Fall Grun 1938 - 10/2/2007 10:39:29 AM   
B/snafu


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From reading the briefing--the capture of Ostrava & Bratislava would seriously hamper the Czech supply and the taking of Praha (Prague) would most likely result in immediate german victory. Likewise the taking of vienna (Wien) & Linz by Czech's would result probably in immediate Czech victory--something I didn't even imagine as a possibility.


Also, a early strong Czech defense could have germany withdrawl units due to likely (out of scenario) british & french intervention---so my plan was to hit him hard and fast. I planned on trying to take Ostrava & Bratislava to ham-string him supply-wise then take Praha. I assumed from the blinders of my limited knowledge of the early WWII period that this scenario would give the czech player a chance (if played right) in only forcing a draw or marginal victory at best--that it would be an excersize of delaying & defense & the possibility of a czech offensive was minimal (I failed to remember that in fact it wasn't overwhelming #s & strenght but tactics that gave the germans many of their early successes--something I was lacking) Thus, I attacked on a broad front & kept no reserves--I even commited my Fj's division on the opening attack.

The original grand plan was to have my motorized & pznr' div's in the south cross the river at Straznice & cut off reinforcements to Bratislava while my infantry div's assaulted that city. In the north I used a strong force of motorized & pznr forces to try & take Ostrava-then attempt to race west towards Praha. Instead of concentrating my forces for a eastward push on Praha--I opted to for a three prong attack on Praha from Usti in the north, Karlovy in the due west & Klatovy from the southwest while at the same time hoping that the german forces in the southern central area around Budejovice would break through, push up the main road in the center & threaten him from that direction. I even revealed early to the world germany's Fj division by dropping them in the area between Usti & Praha on the first combat turn to harrass his arty & to blow bridges to keep the czechs from rushing reinforcements to that area. All of those areas I attacked from had nightmarish terrain.

I know something had gone horribly wrong when I saw the results of Karri's first counterattcks & he about surrounded & evaped an entire division around Liberic. Also at Straznice, I had crossed over a good part of my motorized & pznr div's & had moved my HQ's & arty units up to the front line to assist in (hopefully) a breakthrough in the following turn. After his counterattacks they were mostly all in reorg. Following turns- the ones across the river evapped instead of retreating back across to bordering units. When Karri actually crossed the river around Bratislava & threatned Wien--by then I couldn't pull back the divisions I had on the front line around Budejovice in time even if I wanted to. In the north --I made some headway at Usti and had some strong units there but the terrain kept me from really accomplishing anything. And I had to use all my reinforcement divisions in the north to plug the line around Liberic & Hirchberg to keep him from possibly pushing on & taking my unprotected supply sources. I was able to make somewhat of a strong push from Karlovy towards Praha & if I broke through in the next turn or so--like Karri said there wern't too many reserves there to keep me from taking it--but I ran out of time by then. I guess I was assuming just a defensive stance on the czech part and am too use to playing the Po in strategy games. Looking back on what I could have done-- I should of just made sure Wien & linz were well protected, kept a mobile reserve, and maybe just set up some defense at the map choke points to the outside lane where my supply points were (although I think that part of it is probably a little gamey). I should of just concentrated my forces for a push on Praha & forgot about trying to take Ostrava & Bratislava.

Karri is a very good player & he gave me a sound beating. I don't know if there is any shock bonuses in this scenario but I do know that the actual player controlling the germans was suffering from 100% shock during the three or four combat rounds that occurred.

< Message edited by B/snafu -- 10/2/2007 11:26:07 AM >


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RE: Fall Grun 1938 - 10/2/2007 5:10:24 PM   
1925frank

 

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I played against the AI.  Is that the same thing as playing against the PO?  (What does PO stand for?) 

When I played as the Germans, I believe I took Bratislava early, and the game ended on the next turn.  If I remember correctly, when that happened, France and Great Britain made it clear they would not intervene, and the Czechs capitulated.  I don't think I was even half-way through the turns.  I was surprised at how quickly the game ended.

When I played as the Czechs, I essentially played delay (which Karri recommended against), and the Germans pushed me around almost at will.  Rather than counterattack, I repeatedly consolidated as best I could.  My western troops got separated from my eastern troops.  However, I didn't lose Praha, Bratislava, or Ostrava.  At some point I got news messages that France and Great Britain had joined on my side and that the Germans were withdrawing various divisions to meet that threat.  When the game ended, if I remember correctly, I believe I won (because the result surprised me), and I assumed it was because I had hung on long enough to encourage France and Great Britain to enter on my side and because I didn't lose the main supply hexes (Bratislava and Ostrava) or Praha.  From the military standpoint, I felt like I'd gotten kicked around, but from the strategic standpoint, I apparently had accomplished precisely what was expected of me.

(in reply to B/snafu)
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RE: Fall Grun 1938 - 10/2/2007 8:23:48 PM   
B/snafu


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Sorrry,---Po=programmed opponent-same as AI also referred to as Elmer by some inTOAW.

I have never played the scenario VS AI but assumed that the czech play would resemble how you described your match vs the AI. I could bet that trying it 20 times-you would not see the AI counterattack---that's the great thing with the "human" factor introduced into the game.

Also, in the scenario-heavy losses among German pznr forces, Fj's, and such cause severe VP point losses for the german player also contributing to a Czech "strategic" win. I basically loss my whole Fj division in my game.

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