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Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide)

 
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Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/15/2007 9:20:18 PM   
wneumann


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My PBEM is now in mid-March '42. I'm starting to look ahead at ships due to upgrade in 4/42 - when these upgrades begin, I would like to do ship upgrades with an organized approach if this is possible.

While I'm specifically looking for answers from the Allied side (for my own use), my intent is for this string to be public and available as a general reference on ship upgrades for either side.

My initial questions are:

1) Factors affecting the speed that a ship upgrade is completed (I imagine these factors would for the most part be the same as those impacting ship repair) including

a) Size of port and shipyard capacity where upgrades are being done
b) Presence of AR or AS in a port where ships are being upgraded
c) The number of ships in a port that are being updated or repaired at the same time
d) Any other applicable factors

2) Is there any advantage to upgrading ships in separate ports - i.e. separating ships being repaired from ships for which only upgrades are being done?

3) Upgrading of individual ships be controlled manually rather than just have the game system automatically kick this off immediately when a ship becomes eligible for upgrading. Best method(s) for doing this if there are any? This would include such things as...

a) Turning on (or off) upgrading for individual ships.
b) Best method of selecting which types of ships and which individual ships eligible for upgrading are done first.
c) Port and shipyard selection where to upgrade an individual ship.
d) Determining when you would want to upgrade a particular ship.
e) What ships you would want to upgrade first. Which ships you wouldn't even bother upgrading.
f) Anything else that may be applicable.

4) Some time estimates or way of estimating how long a ship will take to upgrade (assuming the ship has no damage when it begins its upgrade)

5) Did I leave something out....

Just want to get an idea of what works and what doesn't, how people are approaching and doing this. I turn the floor over to you...
Post #: 1
RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/15/2007 9:34:00 PM   
Mike Solli


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There are basically 2 phases to ship upgrade.  Phase 1 is the "upgrade".  It must be in a port with a repair yard.  When the upgrade occurrs, the ship upgrades to it new components and gains sys damage.  Phase 2 is simply the repair of the damage (should you elect to do that).  That occurrs just like repairing any damage that is caused in combat or just sailing around.

As the Japanese player, I upgrade ships as soon as possible.  The better AA/ASW can only help.

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RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/15/2007 9:41:26 PM   
Terminus


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There's only a couple of ships out there where you should consider delaying or abandoning an upgrade. Otherwise, go for it...

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RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/15/2007 9:43:34 PM   
KDonovan


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i would becareful of planning offensives when ship upgrades are available. Nothing worse, when you are all ready to go, and all your CV's suddenly upgrade, and now have 12 system damage on all your CV's on the eve of your offensive

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RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/15/2007 9:57:57 PM   
MarcA


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quote:

ORIGINAL: wneumann
My initial questions are:

1) Factors affecting the speed that a ship upgrade is completed (I imagine these factors would for the most part be the same as those impacting ship repair) including


This is the same as for repair. Bigger ports are better for bigger ships or can do lots of small ones. You have so many upgrades in April best just to start stuffing them in and let them get on with it. On the WC I found it was best to send the transport stuff returning over water to San Diego, the smaller of the ports, and leave the big three ports clear to deal with combat ships.

quote:


2) Is there any advantage to upgrading ships in separate ports - i.e. separating ships being repaired from ships for which only upgrades are being done?


Other than all the ships present will have a chance of using the shipyard points then no. I do think the number of ships in a port might affect repair rates, but this is just based on my experience. So I tend to clear a yard port of unimportant stuff, sending them to the nearest high port value bases.

quote:


3) Upgrading of individual ships be controlled manually rather than just have the game system automatically kick this off immediately when a ship becomes eligible for upgrading. Best method(s) for doing this if there are any? This would include such things as...


Obviously don't upgrade the Argonaut. But other than that, if a ship is going to be sat in a port, my philosophy is that it might as well be allowed to upgrade and repair some of the damage

quote:


4) Some time estimates or way of estimating how long a ship will take to upgrade (assuming the ship has no damage when it begins its upgrade)


BB's will gain about 4 sys for an upgrade but may take a month to clear it all. DD's will gain about 12 to 15 but will usually clear it in a few weeks. Note, your larger ships are still usable with this much damage but you really want to let the smaller ones repair before sending them back out.

Most of your subs upgrade as well. April is a minor upgrade, change of AA guns. But they all get a major upgrade in October, addition of radar. You have many many subs so start rotating your subs through the ports for upgrading so that they are all ready for the next upgrade in October. I usually upgrade them when they have to come in for some reason, but don't bring them in especially. You want to have them all kitted out with radar by January 43.

quote:


5) Did I leave something out....


Only that some of the larger ships need to be down to as low as 3 sys damage before they will upgrade so factor this into your plan if you have a well worn bombardment force coming in.



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RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/15/2007 11:08:04 PM   
MarcA


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P.s. I would also make upgrading my US aircombat TF's a priority as it will effectively double the AA value of the TF. It won't save you if you meet KB but you will take plenty of his top pilots with you.

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RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/15/2007 11:28:05 PM   
Feinder


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FWIW, I don't upgrade subs until after I've finishined doing all my sub troop hauling (which usually takes until about June).

The first upgrade swaps the 50-cals for 20mms, but it usually removes a torp reload (I have no idea why), which in turn, decreses your cargo capacity by about 20%.

-F-

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RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/15/2007 11:44:47 PM   
Hoplosternum


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It's worse than that Feinder. That first US sub upgrade (April ?) that swaps the MGs for 20mm actually decreases the AA value May as well wait for the late '42 one that adds the radar. Should just be repairing when the torpedos get slightly more reliable in '43.

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Post #: 8
RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/16/2007 2:47:24 PM   
USSAmerica


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mantill


quote:


3) Upgrading of individual ships be controlled manually rather than just have the game system automatically kick this off immediately when a ship becomes eligible for upgrading. Best method(s) for doing this if there are any? This would include such things as...


Obviously don't upgrade the Argonaut. But other than that, if a ship is going to be sat in a port, my philosophy is that it might as well be allowed to upgrade and repair some of the damage





Good stuff in this thread! This one caught my eye. I'm a total noob, so it's probably obvious but why not upgrade the Argonaut? Is her ML capability reduced?

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RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/16/2007 2:59:05 PM   
Terminus


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Yeah, to nil...

She was converted to a transport boat in 2/42, losing her ability to lay mines completely...

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RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/16/2007 3:01:27 PM   
wild_Willie2


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quote:

ORIGINAL: USS america


Good stuff in this thread! This one caught my eye. I'm a total noob, so it's probably obvious but why not upgrade the Argonaut? Is her ML capability reduced?



It's mine capacity gets REMOVED.....

DAMN YOU TERMINUS, you beat me once again........

< Message edited by wild_Willie2 -- 2/16/2007 3:21:01 PM >


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RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/16/2007 3:03:58 PM   
goodboyladdie


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That was bloody quick, even for T!

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RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/16/2007 3:08:06 PM   
Terminus


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2FAST4U

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Post #: 13
RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/16/2007 3:11:50 PM   
goodboyladdie


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2FAT2?

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Post #: 14
RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/16/2007 3:12:54 PM   
wild_Willie2


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quote:

ORIGINAL: goodboyladdie

2FAT2?



HEEEE I am NOT fat, just big boned.........

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Post #: 15
RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/16/2007 3:55:50 PM   
MarcA


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hoplosternum
It's worse than that Feinder. That first US sub upgrade (April ?) that swaps the MGs for 20mm actually decreases the AA value May as well wait for the late '42 one that adds the radar. Should just be repairing when the torpedos get slightly more reliable in '43.


Hoplosternum is correct, for the most common US sub, the Gato class, the AA drops from 20 to 15.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Feinder

The first upgrade swaps the 50-cals for 20mms, but it usually removes a torp reload (I have no idea why), which in turn, decreses your cargo capacity by about 20%.



For Gato's Feinder is mostly correct. The capacity drops from 60 to 42 but the total torps carried increases from 22 to 24, maybe where the extra cargo space went. The pre 4/42 configuration is

Front x6 tubes with x3 reloads
Rear x4 tubes with x1 reload
Total = 22 Torpedoes


For the post 4/42 configuration it is
Front x6 tubes with x2 reloads
Rear x4 tubes with x3 reload
Total = 24 Torpedoes

So you get one less reload at the front but 3 more at the back.

I haven't checked the figure for the Perch, Tambor or Salmon classes.


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RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/16/2007 10:25:27 PM   
FAdmiral


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[/quote]
configuration is
Front x6 tubes with x3 reloads
Rear x4 tubes with x1 reload
Total = 22 Torpedoes

For the post 4/42 configuration it is
Front x6 tubes with x2 reloads
Rear x4 tubes with x3 reload
Total = 24 Torpedoes
[/quote]

It's now 3/26/42 in my game playing Allies vs. Jap AI. All my Gato's are configured
this way:

Front x6 tubes with x3 reloads
Rear x4 tubes with x3 reload
Total = 30 Torpedoes

I am using the latest 1804 patch with NO mods....

JIM

BTW, my subs are really doing a number on the AI transports with hardly any
damage taken from the ASW AI ships. If it wasn't for the darn duds, I could claim
about 33% more ships sunk. Only had 2 subs sunk to this point....



< Message edited by FAdmiral -- 2/16/2007 10:43:06 PM >

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RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/16/2007 10:53:40 PM   
MarcA


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quote:

ORIGINAL: FAdmiral
It's now 3/26/42 in my game playing Allies vs. Jap AI. All my Gato's are configured
this way:

Front x6 tubes with x3 reloads
Rear x4 tubes with x3 reload
Total = 30 Torpedoes

I am using the latest 1804 patch with NO mods....

JIM

B



Your right Jim. Wouldn't you know I would choose a boat which didn't have a full compliment of torpedoes onboard for the comparison.

Fienders original statement that Gato's loose a reload is completely correct

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RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/18/2007 6:11:03 PM   
Dino


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Some upgrades are better skipped, especially when you consider that there is no cummulative effect. In other words, if you upgrade Gato class in 4/42, they get 13-14 SYS damage for nothing and then another 13-14 SYS in 10/42 when they get a radar. If you skip the first upgrade, there won't be any cummulative SYS damage in the second one.

Another problematic type is Bangor class MSW.

SYS damage is all this (quite numerous) class gets for its one and only 1/43 "upgrade".

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RE: Ship Upgrades (a do it yourself guide) - 2/18/2007 6:48:59 PM   
Miller


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But did the Gato class (or any sub for that matter) ever carry 30 torpedoes? I thought 24 was the most any US boat carried?

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Post #: 20
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