Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (Full Version)

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dduckett -> Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (5/31/2021 6:57:54 PM)

In moving an artillery unit I noticed I could bombard locations where no units visible that were 'Guerrilla' units. First time I had seen this. Curious if that is the intended behavior (or a bug) since it gives away Guerrilla positions despite my unit being unable to detect them other ways.

[image]local://upfiles/60192/E203FCE3E93343CAAA6B2FFF492044C3.jpg[/image]




golden delicious -> RE: Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (6/1/2021 8:12:12 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: dduckett

In moving an artillery unit I noticed I could bombard locations where no units visible that were 'Guerrilla' units. First time I had seen this. Curious if that is the intended behavior (or a bug) since it gives away Guerrilla positions despite my unit being unable to detect them other ways.


The hex is "observed", which means mousing over the hex you would see the guerrilla unit, even though it's not displayed on the map.

It's one of the more dubious design elements in recent version of TOAW that guerrilla units are hidden-but-not hidden: the correct action for the player is to scroll his pointer over every hex in the rear area at the start of every turn to locate the guerrilla units. This isn't fun for anyone so I think either guerrilla units should simply be visible in the hex (provided the hex is at least "observed"), or never visible even if you mouse over the hex, unless the hex is "spotted".




jmlima -> RE: Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (6/1/2021 8:44:06 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

... I think either guerrilla units should simply be visible in the hex (provided the hex is at least "observed"), or never visible even if you mouse over the hex, unless the hex is "spotted".


Seconded. Even a '?' shown on the hex would do.




Hellen_slith -> RE: Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (6/1/2021 5:53:33 PM)

I like it the way it is! :)




Lobster -> RE: Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (6/1/2021 10:37:33 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

quote:

ORIGINAL: dduckett

In moving an artillery unit I noticed I could bombard locations where no units visible that were 'Guerrilla' units. First time I had seen this. Curious if that is the intended behavior (or a bug) since it gives away Guerrilla positions despite my unit being unable to detect them other ways.


The hex is "observed", which means mousing over the hex you would see the guerrilla unit, even though it's not displayed on the map.

It's one of the more dubious design elements in recent version of TOAW that guerrilla units are hidden-but-not hidden: the correct action for the player is to scroll his pointer over every hex in the rear area at the start of every turn to locate the guerrilla units. This isn't fun for anyone so I think either guerrilla units should simply be visible in the hex (provided the hex is at least "observed"), or never visible even if you mouse over the hex, unless the hex is "spotted".


Kind of defeats everything about guerrillas. Makes them pointless. [:D]




Hellen_slith -> RE: Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (6/1/2021 11:35:48 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster


quote:

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

quote:

ORIGINAL: dduckett

In moving an artillery unit I noticed I could bombard locations where no units visible that were 'Guerrilla' units. First time I had seen this. Curious if that is the intended behavior (or a bug) since it gives away Guerrilla positions despite my unit being unable to detect them other ways.


The hex is "observed", which means mousing over the hex you would see the guerrilla unit, even though it's not displayed on the map.

It's one of the more dubious design elements in recent version of TOAW that guerrilla units are hidden-but-not hidden: the correct action for the player is to scroll his pointer over every hex in the rear area at the start of every turn to locate the guerrilla units. This isn't fun for anyone so I think either guerrilla units should simply be visible in the hex (provided the hex is at least "observed"), or never visible even if you mouse over the hex, unless the hex is "spotted".


Kind of defeats everything about guerrillas. Makes them pointless. [:D]


I KNOW, man, in my FitE2 game w/ david, its like, he MUST be mousing over every hex to be able to find my Roving Harrison.

Like I know he really does that, because it took him all that 2 hours to turn his move, and my P Harrison unit .... is ...... oh, I guess he must have missed ol' Rover :)

Yeah, like he gonna do that <rolls eyes> or like the PO does that.

Sure, man. Whatever you say. Do you even PLAY this game?




Lobster -> RE: Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (6/2/2021 1:47:56 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hellen_slith


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster


quote:

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

quote:

ORIGINAL: dduckett

In moving an artillery unit I noticed I could bombard locations where no units visible that were 'Guerrilla' units. First time I had seen this. Curious if that is the intended behavior (or a bug) since it gives away Guerrilla positions despite my unit being unable to detect them other ways.


The hex is "observed", which means mousing over the hex you would see the guerrilla unit, even though it's not displayed on the map.

It's one of the more dubious design elements in recent version of TOAW that guerrilla units are hidden-but-not hidden: the correct action for the player is to scroll his pointer over every hex in the rear area at the start of every turn to locate the guerrilla units. This isn't fun for anyone so I think either guerrilla units should simply be visible in the hex (provided the hex is at least "observed"), or never visible even if you mouse over the hex, unless the hex is "spotted".


Kind of defeats everything about guerrillas. Makes them pointless. [:D]


I KNOW, man, in my FitE2 game w/ david, its like, he MUST be mousing over every hex to be able to find my Roving Harrison.

Like I know he really does that, because it took him all that 2 hours to turn his move, and my P Harrison unit .... is ...... oh, I guess he must have missed ol' Rover :)

Yeah, like he gonna do that <rolls eyes> or like the PO does that.

Sure, man. Whatever you say. Do you even PLAY this game?


I have zero idea of what you are talking about. The OP is playing a Vietnam scenario. [8|]




golden delicious -> RE: Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (6/2/2021 8:15:17 AM)

The point is, the game currently rewards the player who has the time and patience to do something extremely boring and time consuming.

Why? Because it sounded like a good feature when it was added to a list in TOAW III. Guerrillas didn't work like this in COW. Technically, guerrillas are just as visible now as they were then- it's just laborious to find them. Either hide them properly, or do away with the notional concealment they have now. It's stupid.




larryfulkerson -> RE: Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (6/2/2021 1:42:14 PM)

I concur. Hidden units should be hidden. Visible units should be visible. Not in some kind of weird superposition of both states.




76mm -> RE: Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (6/2/2021 5:15:33 PM)

Agreed...players shouldn't have to hunt and peck around for "invisible" units. Tedious, time-consuming, poor gameplay.




Hellen_slith -> RE: Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (6/3/2021 10:45:21 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hellen_slith


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster


quote:

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

quote:

ORIGINAL: dduckett

In moving an artillery unit I noticed I could bombard locations where no units visible that were 'Guerrilla' units. First time I had seen this. Curious if that is the intended behavior (or a bug) since it gives away Guerrilla positions despite my unit being unable to detect them other ways.


The hex is "observed", which means mousing over the hex you would see the guerrilla unit, even though it's not displayed on the map.

It's one of the more dubious design elements in recent version of TOAW that guerrilla units are hidden-but-not hidden: the correct action for the player is to scroll his pointer over every hex in the rear area at the start of every turn to locate the guerrilla units. This isn't fun for anyone so I think either guerrilla units should simply be visible in the hex (provided the hex is at least "observed"), or never visible even if you mouse over the hex, unless the hex is "spotted".


Kind of defeats everything about guerrillas. Makes them pointless. [:D]


I KNOW, man, in my FitE2 game w/ david, its like, he MUST be mousing over every hex to be able to find my Roving Harrison.

Like I know he really does that, because it took him all that 2 hours to turn his move, and my P Harrison unit .... is ...... oh, I guess he must have missed ol' Rover :)

Yeah, like he gonna do that <rolls eyes> or like the PO does that.

Sure, man. Whatever you say. Do you even PLAY this game?


I have zero idea of what you are talking about. The OP is playing a Vietnam scenario. [8|]


Of course you don't, or you are being deliberately obtuse again.

The principle is the same no matter the scenario. Dig?

BTW, I was looking for that AAR of yours, could not find. <shrug>




Lobster -> RE: Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (6/3/2021 1:22:25 PM)

Seems to me I'm not the only one who thinks something is amiss with how guerrilla units can be found. And here's a news flash, FitE is not the only scenario that uses guerrillas. But if you think they should stay as they are, fine. Considering how slowly the game is being developed it probably will stay the same. BTW, I don't see you on the beta team. Did you sign up for it? See, crap like that doesn't mean squat. [:D]




Lobster -> RE: Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (6/3/2021 1:48:44 PM)

On another note. Boonierat went to a lot of trouble to make his series of Vietnam scenarios. This exploit throws all of that effort out the window. I think just making his scenarios work properly would be worth making guerrilla units actually invisible. Not to mention all the other Vietnam scenarios made.
https://sites.google.com/site/vietnamcombatoperations/




golden delicious -> RE: Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (6/3/2021 2:47:05 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster

On another note. Boonierat went to a lot of trouble to make his series of Vietnam scenarios. This exploit throws all of that effort out the window. I think just making his scenarios work properly would be worth making guerrilla units actually invisible. Not to mention all the other Vietnam scenarios made.
https://sites.google.com/site/vietnamcombatoperations/


You could just have a house rule: "no snooping for guerrillas"

Also, and to touch on another thread, it might be worthwhile to revisit the theatre recon ratings in scenarios like this.




Lobster -> RE: Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (6/3/2021 3:45:03 PM)

While that might seem like a solution there would be occaisions where simply moving the cursor from one place to another would reveal units. And pretending like you didn't see it wouldn't make you unsee it. Boonierat's scenarios have lots of guerrillas so it would be highly likely to accidently find them. [:)]

It doesn't really matter though. I doubt this will be touched on by Bob since he has more then he can handle anyway. A one legged man in a butt kicking contest.




StuccoFresco -> RE: Bombarding guerrilla unit that is not visible (6/8/2021 10:15:00 AM)

Yeah, this is a really bad way to handle guerrillas.




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