Ability to dump stratagem cards (Full Version)

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Hazard151 -> Ability to dump stratagem cards (6/19/2020 10:39:12 PM)

Exactly what it says in the title. Sometimes you either don't have the fate/political points to play a stratagem or it doesn't fit your play style and a given type of stratagem card just keeps piling up.

Might also be useful to be able to exclude certain stratagems from being generated, or directly consigning them to the bin after generation.




zgrssd -> RE: Ability to dump stratagem cards (6/19/2020 10:49:15 PM)

Aside from a few technical issues (that are being fixed in the Beta), there is no downside to having many Stratagems.

The ability to block certain cards makes sense, but only if that does not mean those BP are wasted.
Definitely needs more categories, however. Especially National needs ot be split!




Hazard151 -> RE: Ability to dump stratagem cards (6/19/2020 11:02:15 PM)

If blocking certain cards means you can concentrate BP generating certain cards you want it should definitely waste BP or otherwise involve an opportunity cost, because that can get very powerful by letting you cherry pick cards for little investment.




Malevolence -> RE: Ability to dump stratagem cards (6/20/2020 2:40:59 AM)

I've suggested that Political Points balance should not roll over each turn and that unused stratagem cards should be discarded as well. The purpose would be to stress a defined period of opportunity and a limit on cached political power. Both these elements have a time component not stressed by the game now.




Grotius -> RE: Ability to dump stratagem cards (6/21/2020 6:07:13 AM)

I also think it's too easy to stockpile certain cards. E.g., I used two cards on one turn to improve relations with a neighboring major power. It seemed too easy to raise relations from 20 to 50 with two cards. And I had 3 or 4 more cards I could've used to raise it more.




Lovenought -> RE: Ability to dump stratagem cards (6/21/2020 8:44:56 AM)

I've noticed that once I get a huge amount of cards (like 40+), it actually takes a second or two to load that category. Maybe just have a box we can drag unwanted cards into? Like an archive? Who knows, you might use them one day. But some definitely just clutter.




FAA -> RE: Ability to dump stratagem cards (6/21/2020 9:28:20 AM)

In late game (turn 200+ or 300+) it can take 15-20 seconds to load a category with several hundred cards in it.




GodwinW -> RE: Ability to dump stratagem cards (6/21/2020 10:47:21 AM)

Political points should carry over for sure imo. It allows people to decide whether to stockpile in case of emergency later or to just spend each turn to never get in trouble. It's an extra choice we have.
Without it we can only change the budget allocation, which is something you'd want to do anyway in some cases, but now it's the only resort.
I'm against them being for one turn only.

I've also noticed (but this was in release version) multiple stratagems disappearing and that's annoying (the 'bribe major' cards just vanished all the time).

What I do like of your suggestion is that there is some limit to Stratagems you collect. Not that they vanish, I think again that removes player choice in when to use what, but some limit.

Maybe overall you should be able to only hold 100 Stratagems. Then you can decide the priority of what to stockpile in which category yourself.
It would need to come with a 'delete' button so that you choose what to delete (if you're above 100 and ignore the warning on end of turn (maybe it's a Decision: we have too many Stratagems: decide which to remove (in in-lore phrasing)) it's randomized), and a button to automatically distribute all non-artifact Unit Stratagems on units (prio units without any first, then random but never on militia!).




zgrssd -> RE: Ability to dump stratagem cards (6/21/2020 11:54:15 AM)

We need more categories, no question about that!
Particulary Nation is swamped with 3 different groups of cards.
"Money" and "Leader Recruitment" would be welcome additions/splits from the Nation Group.

One thing I wonder, is if having a stockpile of certain cards reduces the weight for drawing moer of the kind? I know I saw teh odds per card listed somewhere before, but of course I can never find stuff when I need it [:)]

quote:

ORIGINAL: Grotius

I also think it's too easy to stockpile certain cards. E.g., I used two cards on one turn to improve relations with a neighboring major power. It seemed too easy to raise relations from 20 to 50 with two cards. And I had 3 or 4 more cards I could've used to raise it more.

This sounds more like a case for "can only play one Stratagem (of this type) per Turn". There are already plenty of cards with such a limitation in the game, particulary in Diplomacy. Maybe it should just be a standing rule for this entire card group?





MatthewVilter -> RE: Ability to dump stratagem cards (6/21/2020 6:41:27 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Malevolence

I've suggested that Political Points balance should not roll over each turn and that unused stratagem cards should be discarded as well. The purpose would be to stress a defined period of opportunity and a limit on cached political power. Both these elements have a time component not stressed by the game now.



quote:

ORIGINAL: GodwinW

Political points should carry over for sure imo. It allows people to decide whether to stockpile in case of emergency later or to just spend each turn to never get in trouble. It's an extra choice we have.
Without it we can only change the budget allocation, which is something you'd want to do anyway in some cases, but now it's the only resort.
I'm against them being for one turn only.

I've also noticed (but this was in release version) multiple stratagems disappearing and that's annoying (the 'bribe major' cards just vanished all the time).

What I do like of your suggestion is that there is some limit to Stratagems you collect. Not that they vanish, I think again that removes player choice in when to use what, but some limit.

Maybe overall you should be able to only hold 100 Stratagems. Then you can decide the priority of what to stockpile in which category yourself.
It would need to come with a 'delete' button so that you choose what to delete (if you're above 100 and ignore the warning on end of turn (maybe it's a Decision: we have too many Stratagems: decide which to remove (in in-lore phrasing)) it's randomized), and a button to automatically distribute all non-artifact Unit Stratagems on units (prio units without any first, then random but never on militia!).


I think it would make the most sense if both political points and stratagems were pushed towards some kind of equilibrium (based on your bureaucratic point investment each turn) rather than accumulating indefinitely or being cleared away each turn. Basically the amount of points and cards you get would be proportional to how much lower you are at than a nominal level with the nominal level being set based on your government's priorities and capabilities.

This would incentivize you to run a "vigorous" government but also allow you to accumulate points and cards if you feel the need to keep your options open. There would probably need to be a system for discarding unwanted cards.

I could see discarding cards being something you pay political points for maybe. And I can think of a lot of different ways you could be allowed to and then penalized for removing cards from your deck (so to speak) in order to reduce or remove the chance of drawing them on future turns.




zuekamo -> RE: Ability to dump stratagem cards (6/23/2020 7:34:38 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: zgrssd

Aside from a few technical issues (that are being fixed in the Beta), there is no downside to having many Stratagems.



When there are many stratagems, it becomes "harder" to find those we want. The solution would be more filters.




zgrssd -> RE: Ability to dump stratagem cards (6/23/2020 7:50:48 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: zuekamo


quote:

ORIGINAL: zgrssd

Aside from a few technical issues (that are being fixed in the Beta), there is no downside to having many Stratagems.



When there are many stratagems, it becomes "harder" to find those we want. The solution would be more filters.

I already said that in the 3rd sentence of the post you somehow only quoted partially?




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