OT China v Japan from the German prospective (Full Version)

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Chris21wen -> OT China v Japan from the German prospective (4/16/2020 8:34:28 AM)

If you read German this is a probably a good read. Probably as I don't. There's even a Chinese and Japanese Kreigsgliederung for an Inf Div!

https://wwii.germandocsinrussia.org/de/nodes/1019




Leandros -> RE: OT China v Japan from the German prospective (4/16/2020 11:00:05 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Chris21wen

If you read German this is a probably a good read. Probably as I don't. There's even a Chinese and Japanese Kreigsgliederung for an Inf Div!

https://wwii.germandocsinrussia.org/de/nodes/1019

Thank you for posting!

These are post WW2-captured German papers retrieved from Russian archives. This German report - an analysis on the supply and development of the Chinese Army till then - was issued in April 1938. It is very interesting and - as an appreciation - quite accurate as history proved. It also states that China had few problems - during this period, anyway - with supplying its fast developing army, financed as it was by western sources. From this it is "understandable" that the Japanese wanted desperately to close off the supply routes through South China, Indochina and Burma.

Fred

P.S.: Having gone a little further in the text it has some unexpected conclusions on the Japanese army leadership and the soldierly behaviour on various levels. Against this, the Chinese lower-rank soldier is ranked higher.




Knavey -> RE: OT China v Japan from the German prospective (4/16/2020 11:22:31 AM)

Grr...Google Translator is not quite to that level yet where it can help with that. Maybe in a few years. Babel fish anyone?




Chickenboy -> RE: OT China v Japan from the German prospective (4/16/2020 5:46:14 PM)

I'm currently reading "Tower of Skulls" that gives detailed discussion of the War in China from 1937 or so onwards. Significant discussion of the Japanese:Russian conflict leading into 1940 and how the Japanese fear of the Russians involvement in the Far East against Japan shaped the Japanese approach to war with the UK and USA. Recommended for an overview of these political and military machinations.




geofflambert -> RE: OT China v Japan from the German prospective (4/16/2020 7:01:41 PM)

Danke Schön.




Fishbed -> RE: OT China v Japan from the German prospective (4/18/2020 2:44:33 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Leandros

P.S.: Having gone a little further in the text it has some unexpected conclusions on the Japanese army leadership and the soldierly behaviour on various levels. Against this, the Chinese lower-rank soldier is ranked higher.


Interesting. Books the likes of Soldiers of the Sun do have some pretty grim and damning trivia about IJA ops in China, that tend to show that it was not alway - as a whole - the kind of efficiency that shocked the world in Malaya. Like any conscripted army at any rate.




Leandros -> RE: OT China v Japan from the German prospective (4/18/2020 10:06:08 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fishbed


quote:

ORIGINAL: Leandros

P.S.: Having gone a little further in the text it has some unexpected conclusions on the Japanese army leadership and the soldierly behaviour on various levels. Against this, the Chinese lower-rank soldier is ranked higher.


Interesting. Books the likes of Soldiers of the Sun do have some pretty grim and damning trivia about IJA ops in China, that tend to show that it was not alway - as a whole - the kind of efficiency that shocked the world in Malaya. Like any conscripted army at any rate.

It should be underlined that this report was from April 1938.

Fred




Chickenboy -> RE: OT China v Japan from the German prospective (4/18/2020 5:53:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Leandros


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fishbed


quote:

ORIGINAL: Leandros

P.S.: Having gone a little further in the text it has some unexpected conclusions on the Japanese army leadership and the soldierly behaviour on various levels. Against this, the Chinese lower-rank soldier is ranked higher.


Interesting. Books the likes of Soldiers of the Sun do have some pretty grim and damning trivia about IJA ops in China, that tend to show that it was not alway - as a whole - the kind of efficiency that shocked the world in Malaya. Like any conscripted army at any rate.

It should be underlined that this report was from April 1938.

Fred



That's really important as a distinction. 1937 was awful for the Chinese. Chinese defensive efforts in 1938 were decent, but not great. 1939 and 1940 were a different story and they did comparatively poorly in those years. So fits and starts to the Chinese effort: overall not great with some real catastrophes in there and a smaller handful of solid ripostes to the Japanese.




Alpha77 -> RE: OT China v Japan from the German prospective (4/19/2020 1:17:30 PM)

Here a related video (you can also find on the same channel a vid "British thoughts on the Japanese" plus "Japanese thoughts on the Germans"):

"What did the German Army think about the Japanese Army? There is a report from 1938 about the Japanese and Chinese performance and experiences in the Second Sino-Japanese War. It covers various topics like motorization and air-ground cooperation, but the concluding remarks about the Japanese Forces for an upcoming "Great War" ("großen Krieg") are especially interesting.
This is the first video in the "from the Archives" series, where I take a look at primary sources and add some context and discussion.":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCpq-A5bT5Y




Chris21wen -> RE: OT China v Japan from the German prospective (4/20/2020 6:36:46 AM)

There ae quite a few German doc on the subject in the germandocsinrussia.org website.




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