How to prevent massive allied casualties? (Full Version)

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rysgame -> How to prevent massive allied casualties? (1/19/2020 3:06:57 PM)

It's currently jul/44 playing as WA. I am already well into northern Italy (about 150mi from the southern Alps) and control the contenin peninsula, as well as St Lo and Caen. But my VPs suffer drastically at my casualties. I know the reasoning behind it (politics and what not) but as soon as I landed in Normandy, I had 3-4 hex deep lines of triple stacked German divisions. I've been bombing logistical infrastructure since game start, as well as focusing on various industry. But yet and still, I'm losing 2-3k men attacking a German position because it is, for example, a full SS panzer div, a full infantry div, and a full PzrGr div. Usually with another 1-2 INF divs in reserve. I'm winning the battles slowly but surely, but my casualties are causing to much -VP. What am I doing wrong?

loki100 -> RE: How to prevent massive allied casualties? (1/19/2020 4:55:57 PM)

presume this is an AI game?

So first the AI 'moves' by very different rules to the player (since it can't anticipate its allowed to respond faster).

General pt, I reckon that the period say May invasion - December will shed an allied player around 400 VP.

Bit late, but its worth asking yourself what you wanted in Italy once you got Rome, that is a lot of losses for actually not very much (in the end you prob won't get to S Germany that way.

Generally what you want is damaged German units not to repair. Again this might be a bit late but I like to use 8 AAF on tanks and trucks, both are key components to the German mobile formations. The idea is you fight them at full strength (you really can't avoid this) and the next time they are still weakened.

More tactical, a combination of interdiction (hits supply/replacements and worsens any retreat), a 'unit' bombing mission and allocated ground support will help. This will cause a lot of disruptions and disrupted elements don't fight, even better they are more likely to be damaged or destroyed if you win the battle.

Good news, once you start to take German cities in 1945 the VP recovers - you get both occupation VP and 'bombing' VP (as those assets can't produce for the axis).

its HtH game, but you might want to have a read of the AAR I'm doing, might put some of this into context.

rysgame -> RE: How to prevent massive allied casualties? (1/19/2020 5:29:48 PM)

So, it's an AI game.

As for ITA, my goal was basically to tie up Axis forces there with constant light offensives, not really to gain ground, but make the AI not want to withdraw units from a stagnant front. I focused heavily on bombing oil/fuel as well as aircraft early game. This resulted in almost 100% air dominance and it does take a little longer for mech/armor units to reinforce the lines. And make them much for liable to route vs retreat I think.

I'm still in bocage country in France, which is definitely not helping the situation. But I'm confidant that after I breakout, I should be able to use my large armoured force to form a pocket from avranches up along the river orne and hopefully destroy several panzer/pzrgre divisions.

I'm still learning air power and setting up manual targets and the like. Especially as axis (where air power is basically worthless in AI mode it seems)

But WA AI air seems mostly competent. But as I said in another thread, playing as either side I'll get to mid-late '44 and realize/learn something then just start over. Such as using fortified regions in ITA to form near unbreakable defense lines along rivers/mtns.

As for repair/refit of German formations. Targeting the rail lines in N ITA was vital I found to hampering German defense, this is how I was able to surround and destroy the HG Pzr div in late 43 near Naples. But seems the same tactic isn't really working in France.

Overall my strategy needs work. Especially since ITA strategies aren't really always applicable to France. I lost 3x BR tank divisions in a failed attempt to isolate Caen in may '44. Which the strategy was basically identical to how I destroyed the HG div.

GloriousRuse -> RE: How to prevent massive allied casualties? (1/20/2020 2:38:29 AM)

So, the AI is what we might call "a cheating bastard." Still, as Loki's HtH opponent I would tell you to look closely at how he goes about cracking my lines (which he has done depressingly well). It is rarely a front wide offensive - it is one or two battles that he can't possibly lose after the air force does its job.

bomccarthy -> RE: How to prevent massive allied casualties? (1/20/2020 9:22:01 PM)

Don't forget to use your heavy bombers in the same way the real-life Allies used theirs - targeting the German units where you want to breakthrough. Historical note: the 8th AF flew three such separate carpet bombing missions in July 1944 alone; each mission included 600-1500 bombers, who released their payloads from 10,000 feet or less. These types of raids were flown at other times over the next 7 months, although the 8th AF commanders tried to discourage use of their bombers for such tactical missions.

cfulbright -> RE: How to prevent massive allied casualties? (1/21/2020 1:19:44 AM)

Two other things:

1. Make sure you have one combat engineer support unit assigned to one of the attacking units, and then load up the remaining support unit slots with SP art bns and armor bns.

2. Put strong units behind the attacking units in Reserve mode so they may help out on the attack.

And I endorse use of both the heavy bombers (I prefer 1000lb bombs for ground support) doing Ground Attack against Unit, as well as all your fighter-bombers, all on a one hex front.


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