CMO and TACVIEW (Full Version)

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sluggy2010 -> CMO and TACVIEW (11/9/2019 9:34:00 AM)


Hi all,

I wanted to commend the devs for the fantastic work on CMO I'm really looking forward to firing the money cannon at it [:)] next week - the maps look great.

I've had a look at TACVIEW as well - which is also a great piece of work BTW - and I note it has about 60 or so models in it and tries to match its 3d objects to the object being tracked.

For those with as many milsims as myself TACVIEW allows 3rd party .obj files to be loaded into its repository - so I looked to my old favorite Dangerous Waters and note that it is possible to convert the J3D files in Dangerous waters, Sub Command and the LWAMI mod to .obj's.

So if you own DW and/or SC then this may be a good option to boost your TACVIEW models base.

Rgds

Sluggy




bradinggs -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/9/2019 11:34:46 AM)

Interesting, thanks sluggy2010!




sluggy2010 -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/9/2019 1:30:16 PM)


Sorry - forgot to mention how

J3D Files -> i3dConverter to .OFF ( currently free ) -> Meshlab to .obj and you're done.




JOhnnyr -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/9/2019 3:40:09 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sluggy2010


Sorry - forgot to mention how

J3D Files -> i3dConverter to .OFF ( currently free ) -> Meshlab to .obj and you're done.


Here are the steps I've figured out:

1)Extract the .J3D Files from DW, following steps 2-6

2)download decompress.exe from https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=3122
3)grab the 3d.ndx file located in the DW install > Graphics folder, and make a copy of it, and place the copy in the same folder as decompress.exe
4)open a command prompt and get into the directory where decompress is
5)type: decompress.exe 3d (or whatever the file name of the .ndx is)
6) files are now extracted

7)Use i3dConverter (http://www.i3dconverter.com/) to convert the .j3d files to .OFF
8)Use Meshlab (http://www.meshlab.net/#download) to convert the .OFF to .obj
9)Import the .obj to Tacview: https://www.tacview.net/documentation/3dobjects/en/
10)Profit!

It's a shame Tacview doesn't support textures, but I suppose that keeps things simple!

One concern I have is how underwater is rendered in tacview, or rather, how it *isn't*, looking at the dev videos there is no sense of the subs being underwater.




sluggy2010 -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/10/2019 4:53:39 AM)


Yep - that's it exactly, you have two options after performing the above use the base model - or if feeling adventurous you can add the superstructure on as well - but that is a bit more fiddling about with alignment and not conducive to performance etc.

To your point about sea levels - I believe the video below at ~27 secs shows the sea levels ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OL_yotxnRo at ~27 secs






AlGrant -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/10/2019 8:04:41 AM)

If creating additional models for use in Tacview, keep the file size in mind!
These Dangerous Waters files sound like a good idea, but does anybody have any idea what size are the models once extracted and converted to .obj format?

I have done some model conversions that work in Tacview and from what I've seen, smaller is better - typically below 1mb

The Tacview size doesn't mention file size but does advise 'typically less than 4000 triangles per object' to avoid performance issues.




sluggy2010 -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/10/2019 8:38:42 AM)


Hi, good steer for the 4000.

The biggest file is the naval base - ~5000 faces, the average is way less.

The P3C one of the most complex models at 5600, (and you need to lop off the props in meshlab )

Shipyard - only ~4400 faces, Seawolf ~4300 so most of these should work fine.

Meshlab can also perform a quadratic simplification of the faces to say the target 4000, so good as you say to target 4000 as a working target maximum, ta for the tip.

Just tried on the Seawolf and dropped it to 1500 faces and you can't tell - it actually looked better.

When using mesh-> filters -> remesh -> simplification it just drops the un-needed details mostly, we're after general shape not the exact number of vents etc.

Note that I am not going to post any of these works - happy to guide those who also have bought them - but Sonalyst's produced a great product and I am not going to betray them by distributing any of their work.








JOhnnyr -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/10/2019 1:28:46 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sluggy2010


Hi, good steer for the 4000.

The biggest file is the naval base - ~5000 faces, the average is way less.

The P3C one of the most complex models at 5600, (and you need to lop off the props in meshlab )

Shipyard - only ~4400 faces, Seawolf ~4300 so most of these should work fine.

Meshlab can also perform a quadratic simplification of the faces to say the target 4000, so good as you say to target 4000 as a working target maximum, ta for the tip.

Just tried on the Seawolf and dropped it to 1500 faces and you can't tell - it actually looked better.

When using mesh-> filters -> remesh -> simplification it just drops the un-needed details mostly, we're after general shape not the exact number of vents etc.

Note that I am not going to post any of these works - happy to guide those who also have bought them - but Sonalyst's produced a great product and I am not going to betray them by distributing any of their work.


Where are you doing the simplification? (which program?)


quote:

ORIGINAL: sluggy2010

To your point about sea levels - I believe the video below at ~27 secs shows the sea levels ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OL_yotxnRo at ~27 secs





Yeah, but the subs don't look like they are underwater at all, it looks like they are at periscope depth all the time, and the ocean doesn't look like the ocean.

I'm picky, I know :)





sluggy2010 -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/10/2019 1:52:41 PM)

Simplification in Meshlab - FILTER->REMESH->SIMPLIFICATION QUADRATIC EDGE COLLAPSE not with texture

E.G. KiloChi636_7b.off 50% face removal ( e.g. dive plane too many really )

Settings used attached - could probably drop the normals as TACVIEW adds its own.



[image]local://upfiles/46355/71AE43BCFBDA41F683CBD4E18F0271D7.jpg[/image]




JOhnnyr -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/10/2019 6:35:49 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: sluggy2010

Simplification in Meshlab - FILTER->REMESH->SIMPLIFICATION QUADRATIC EDGE COLLAPSE not with texture

E.G. KiloChi636_7b.off 50% face removal ( e.g. dive plane too many really )

Settings used attached - could probably drop the normals as TACVIEW adds its own.



[image]local://upfiles/46355/71AE43BCFBDA41F683CBD4E18F0271D7.jpg[/image]


Could you share the XML files? (If you've made them yet) for TacView?




sluggy2010 -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/11/2019 9:22:52 AM)


I have not created them yet - but started using the following https://github.com/Vyrtuoz/Tacview to build them, you'll find all you need in there.

Rgds

Sluggy




thewood1 -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/11/2019 10:26:07 PM)

I would suggest waiting until CMO's release before expending a lot of effort. I think there was a lot of work done on populating TacView.




sluggy2010 -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/12/2019 8:15:49 AM)

Yes - I notice in the stream from the weekend they said they were expanding the models, just looking to the possibilities :)

And I assume the Beta 4 release here is not coincidental timing ,

http://dogsofwarvu.com/forum/index.php/topic,7833.0.html?PHPSESSID=585b332f21f182dbb2de9d894b979c46




Dimitris -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/14/2019 7:08:18 AM)

Thanks guys, this is handy information.

We also now added some new material on our WS downloads page: http://www.warfaresims.com/?page_id=1876

Specifically, texture tiles based on the Sentinel-2 imagery, and SRTM30-Plus elevation tiles to closely match CMO's default terrain info.

Hope you'll find them useful!




sluggy2010 -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/14/2019 12:45:54 PM)


Thanks chap that's great - money cannon has been fired and good luck with the launch




JOhnnyr -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/14/2019 1:07:21 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dimitris

Thanks guys, this is handy information.

We also now added some new material on our WS downloads page: http://www.warfaresims.com/?page_id=1876

Specifically, texture tiles based on the Sentinel-2 imagery, and SRTM30-Plus elevation tiles to closely match CMO's default terrain info.

Hope you'll find them useful!


I can't seem to download the textures in bulk (unless I do them one by one).

Is there any way you could host the files somewhere other than onedrive?

Thank you!




sluggy2010 -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/14/2019 1:12:38 PM)

or just zip them instead of the individual files?




sluggy2010 -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/14/2019 1:43:39 PM)

yeah OK - the maps are a little more detailed than CMANO - I found my house...




JOhnnyr -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/14/2019 1:47:29 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: sluggy2010

or just zip them instead of the individual files?


I wonder if we actually need these? Dimitri, do we need these? It says these are lower res than in the game?




MirabelleBenou -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/14/2019 5:22:50 PM)

That's for Tacview only and yes, much recommanded to have them,




JOhnnyr -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/14/2019 5:26:39 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MirabelleBenou

That's for Tacview only and yes, much recommanded to have them,


Ah ok, thank you...if you could zip them up, that would be fantastic. (As it is now you'd have to download 19k files a few at a time)




sluggy2010 -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/16/2019 11:59:19 AM)

Ahh - just found the Resources directory now, simply awesome implementation devs! Just edit the spreadsheet and add a new model in there - from the heart what an intelligent implementation, clean simple and effective well done lads [&o]

So <CMOHOMEDIR>\Resources\Tacview\ Edit the spreadsheet
and pop the mesh into <CMOHOMEDIR>\Resources\Tacview\Data\Meshes

NOICE!




sluggy2010 -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/16/2019 11:39:06 PM)


Cool - managed to get a model into tacview, scale is 1/1000 for those trying to import models - my first attempt was the size of the airbase [:'(]



[image]local://upfiles/46355/B57AB1F4614042E5B7BD495BB0BBE8EF.jpg[/image]




sluggy2010 -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/17/2019 5:31:06 AM)


And a slightly tongue in cheek A10-C



[image]local://upfiles/46355/6E55D31CEE8C4D99BB1BEB796EB69E29.jpg[/image]




MirabelleBenou -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/17/2019 8:37:09 PM)

Hello ! Beware also of the file size.

Our test with AlGrants when we made/convert models found that the target must be below 500 KB. Never go up than 1 MB.

It will impact perf and memory usage.

For scale, Tacview should use telemetry data provided by CMO, so you "should" not bother with it (But it's best practice to check them :) I'll have to tweak some of the models I provided to the dev team).

By the way, for converting purpose, Al use Rhino3D and I use Blender. But I mainly prefer to create meshes from start, even if it took more times and even if the result is not as much detailled as other model you could download. That way, I'm pretty sure the mesh will be optimized for Tacview with a fairly low file size.

Al obtained reaaly good results with Rhino3D for scaling down the details and file size.




sluggy2010 -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/18/2019 10:44:42 AM)

OK will take that advice - all help gratefully received;

The Super Etendard above is only 158K and the A10C/Porker 126k so well within bounds, this is where Meshlab is handy for face reduction, I'll have a look at Rhino3D as well as its not a tool I've used before.

By 1/1000 scale I mean the "M" measurement in Meshlab so the Etendard is 14 "units" long - instead or 14000 (units(mm)) I guess this varies per package.

I had to do the Etendard first as I'm on the Falklands scenario at the moment.




sluggy2010 -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/18/2019 11:30:11 AM)

One other question comes to mind, for propeller art discs any guidance there ?

The material appears translucent - although I thought Tacview only had opaque faces?




kylania -> RE: CMO and TACVIEW (11/19/2019 7:59:41 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dimitris

Thanks guys, this is handy information.

We also now added some new material on our WS downloads page: http://www.warfaresims.com/?page_id=1876

Specifically, texture tiles based on the Sentinel-2 imagery, and SRTM30-Plus elevation tiles to closely match CMO's default terrain info.

Hope you'll find them useful!


The Sentinel-2 imagery link to OneDrive isn't working.




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