Victory conditions must be reforged (Full Version)

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nukkxx5058 -> Victory conditions must be reforged (4/18/2019 4:50:09 PM)

Hi there. I love the game but seriously, for the next game , i.e. Southern Storm, Victory conditions must be totally changed. It's simply too frustrating now. Sudden death really sucks (particularly in PBEM), regardless you are wining or losing. Hope you guys can figure out a way to improve it. It's a must !

nukkxx5058 -> RE: Victory conditions must be reforged (4/18/2019 4:54:27 PM)

The problem is that when sudden death is triggered, you almost always have the impression that the game didn't finish (and sometime that it even didn't really start !!)! Hence the frustration.

Please guys, find a way ! Such a great game ... [&o][&o][&o]

mirrorshades -> RE: Victory conditions must be reforged (4/18/2019 5:06:29 PM)

I don't know about PBEM, but at least vs the AI you have the option to continue the game after the sudden death trigger if you like. I've done this on some occasions where the current victory was marginal or tactical, but I know within a short time I'd be in a great position to bump that up. Of course, once you continue, you have to play the scenario out to the bitter end time-wise (so things may swing back in the enemy's favor if you're not careful).

ComOxLoSxNinoS -> RE: Victory conditions must be reforged (4/18/2019 5:12:22 PM)

It would be nice to have the option to force the game to play until the end but it should be an option that is agreed upon before the start of the game, just like the 'allow past sudden death' option is.

CapnDarwin -> RE: Victory conditions must be reforged (4/18/2019 5:26:36 PM)

Adding a PBEM option to continue past SD is a good idea and we can look at it for Southern Storm. We have discussed internally some changes to scenario objectives and force levels to replace the straight VP calculations. We are looking at have a more mission oriented approach to victory so we can have more options than score more points. Plus we would like to be able to have scenarios where the objective is different for each side/player. This would give us many more ways to craft a scenario.

Drop in your ideas here as well. [8D]

mirrorshades -> RE: Victory conditions must be reforged (4/18/2019 6:48:22 PM)

It always feels a little game-y to me when I can pop a recon unit waaaaay back behind the enemy and just "touch" the VP hexes to boost my score, then have them scoot away. Obviously, they can just send another unit to go get them back, and I'll lose them at endgame if they have more units in the area, but I've also used that technique to turn a draw into a marginal victory, for example. (Not proud of that, but hey, war is hell.) I think the genesis of VP hexes (in all wargames, not this one specifically) is to show that one side or the other has control of an area. I like the endgame "influence" mechanic to do away with some of this, but maybe a different type of VP hex would only count towards the army that is in the hex at a specific time? It could be "contested" if nobody is in the hex, or if both sides are still duking it out at endgame.

Also would be interesting to have a time-based relevance for VP locations. Maybe "Capture hex 0123 before 1600" would get you the VPs and an extra set of reinforcements ("If you can secure that hill before dark, we can roll another tank company or some extra resupply your way")? Or a requirement to take and hold a VP hex for a certain time before VPs are awarded could also be interesting, and would require a little more pre-planning.

Could also have non-VP effects for certain hexes, though that might make some stuff on the back-end more complicated. One examples that comes to mind: designate certain high elevations as "enhanced radio coverage". If a recon unit can get to the location and remain for XX minutes, they have managed to set up a radio antenna/repeater that shortens the command cycle by X minutes.

For that matter, let recon units do some other mission-support type stuff besides just touching VP hexes and getting blown up. Maybe award some VPs every time a recon unit is the first to spot an enemy unit, but have it so that they lose some or all of them if that unit ends up getting destroyed (in addition to the normal VP loss of the unit).

How about a "victory zone"? An identified area of hexes which must contain XX% of your remaining force at endgame to receive points, though it doesn't matter specifically which ones. This provides more of an idea of control of an area.

None of the above are grounded in actual military theory or experience, so apologies to you veterans out there who are rolling your eyes at me right now. :)

nukkxx5058 -> RE: Victory conditions must be reforged (4/19/2019 7:36:12 AM)



It would be nice to have the option to force the game to play until the end but it should be an option that is agreed upon before the start of the game, just like the 'allow past sudden death' option is.

It's good to see that the devs are very reactive. Well, it's not new, as they are since D1. :-)

Yes, an option to force the game past SD in multi would be a good first step. This should however let the door open to unilateral resignation (when the situation seems hopeless).
Same, the resignation could be an optional rule pre-agreed between players (ie. allow resignation or not).

It's good to read CapnDarwin post and to see that the subject is seriously considered within the team.
Can't wait for FPC-SS [&o]

KungPao -> RE: Victory conditions must be reforged (4/19/2019 4:46:11 PM)

Wait, I thought ignore SD is an option in PBEM game?

I have an issue with current PBEM game mechanism is, anyone can end the game anytime with all current VP counted. I saw several time in PBEM game, a ceasefire enforced without my agreement. On the bright side my opponents admitted I am winning in their message :)

Hopefully in South Storm, ceasefire needs the other side's agreement by hitting cease fire too. Surrender is a separate button that will be effective immediately.

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