Naval Bombardement of Heavy Urban - Can the aircraft be touched? (Full Version)

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KenchiSulla -> Naval Bombardement of Heavy Urban - Can the aircraft be touched? (7/24/2015 6:06:41 AM)

In my game vs Mundy (DBB:C - scenario 30) battleships and cruisers are lobbing shells at the airbases around Sydney:


Night Naval bombardment of Sydney at 90,167 - Coastal Guns Fire Back!

39 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.

Japanese Ships
BB Kirishima
BB Hiei, Shell hits 2
BB Kongo

Allied ground losses:
111 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 2 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 8 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 2 (1 destroyed, 1 disabled)
Vehicles lost 2 (1 destroyed, 1 disabled)

Airbase hits 12
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 34

E13A1 Jake acting as spotter for BB Kirishima
North Fortress firing at BB Kirishima
BB Kirishima firing at North Fortress
North Fortress firing at BB Hiei
BB Hiei firing at North Fortress
E13A1 Jake acting as spotter for BB Kongo
BB Kongo firing at Sydney


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Naval bombardment of Sydney at 90,167 - Coastal Guns Fire Back!

109 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.

Japanese Ships
CA Suzuya
CA Nachi, Shell hits 3
CA Haguro, Shell hits 3, on fire
CA Myoko

Allied ground losses:
120 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 12 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 5 disabled

Airbase hits 13
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 28

CA Suzuya firing at Sydney
CA Nachi firing at North Fortress
North Fortress firing at CA Nachi
CA Haguro firing at North Fortress
North Fortress firing at CA Haguro
CA Myoko firing at Sydney


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Naval bombardment of Sydney at 90,167 - Coastal Guns Fire Back!

4 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.

Japanese Ships
BB Hyuga
BB Ise
BB Yamato
BB Mutsu

Allied ground losses:
592 casualties reported
Squads: 3 destroyed, 6 disabled
Non Combat: 9 destroyed, 38 disabled
Engineers: 8 destroyed, 6 disabled
Vehicles lost 2 (1 destroyed, 1 disabled)

Airbase hits 31
Airbase supply hits 4
Runway hits 31

BB Hyuga firing at North Fortress
North Fortress firing at BB Hyuga
BB Ise firing at Sydney
BB Yamato firing at Sydney
BB Mutsu firing at Sydney


While watching the replay I assumed Mundy pulled the aircraft out of Sydney...

But looky here! The airfields are wrecked but not a plane hit!

[image]local://upfiles/30342/E8B615D1A0984D9395DF7E3F700577DD.jpg[/image]

Feature or bug? Singapore is urban light and I know aircraft can be hit there... It might be a terrain thing!




Yaab -> RE: Naval Bombardement of Heavy Urban - Can the aircraft be touched? (7/24/2015 8:21:05 AM)

Canton - heavy urban.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Naval bombardment of Canton at 77,59

Japanese aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-15-II Babs: 3 damaged
Ki-36 Ida: 1 damaged

Allied Ships
DD Thanet
DD Scout
DM Thracian

Runway hits 2
Port hits 2

DD Thanet firing at Canton
DD Scout firing at Canton
DM Thracian firing at Canton
-------------------------------------


Night Naval bombardment of Canton at 77,59

Japanese aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-36 Ida: 1 damaged
Ki-15-II Babs: 5 damaged
Ki-15-II Babs: 1 destroyed on ground
Ki-51 Sonia: 4 damaged
Ki-51 Sonia: 1 destroyed on ground
Ki-27b Nate: 2 damaged
Ki-27b Nate: 1 destroyed on ground

Allied Ships
DD Thanet
DD Scout
DM Thracian

Japanese ground losses:
30 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Manpower hits 1
Heavy Industry hits 1
Fires 37
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 9
Port hits 2
Port fuel hits 1

DD Thanet firing at Canton
DD Scout firing at Canton
DM Thracian firing at Canton
-----------------------


Cannonfodder, some of your ships are duelling with the North Fortress instead of shelling the Sydney airfields.




Mundy -> RE: Naval Bombardement of Heavy Urban - Can the aircraft be touched? (7/24/2015 11:54:31 AM)

That's odd.

On my combat reports, the airfields weren't touched, period. I'll have to look next turn to see if there's any real damage. I was wondering if these airfields were somehow flagged "non-coastal".

quote:

Night Naval bombardment of Sydney at 90,167 - Coastal Guns Fire Back!

29 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.

Japanese Ships
BB Kirishima
BB Kongo

Allied ground losses:
23 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

E13A1 Jake acting as spotter for BB Kirishima
North Fortress firing at BB Kirishima
BB Kirishima firing at North Fortress
North Fortress firing at BB Kongo
BB Kongo firing at North Fortress


---------------------------------------------

Night Naval bombardment of Sydney at 90,167 - Coastal Guns Fire Back!

36 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.

Japanese Ships
BB Hyuga
BB Ise, Shell hits 1
BB Yamato
BB Mutsu

Allied ground losses:
66 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 6 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

E8N2 Dave acting as spotter for BB Hyuga
Banks Fortress firing at BB Hyuga
BB Hyuga firing at Banks Fortress
BB Ise firing at Banks Fortress
Banks Fortress firing at BB Ise
BB Yamato firing at North Fortress
North Fortress firing at BB Yamato
F1M2 Pete acting as spotter for BB Mutsu
BB Mutsu firing at G/H Battery Heavy Coastal Artillery Regiment
G/H Battery Heavy Coastal Artillery Regiment firing at BB Mutsu



quote:

Night Naval bombardment of Newcastle at 92,166

Japanese Ships
BB Hiei

Allied ground losses:
191 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 12 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 14 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Guns lost 3 (1 destroyed, 2 disabled)
Vehicles lost 3 (1 destroyed, 2 disabled)

E13A1 Jake acting as spotter for BB Hiei
BB Hiei firing at 9th Australian Division


Or is this a second round? [:(]




mind_messing -> RE: Naval Bombardement of Heavy Urban - Can the aircraft be touched? (7/24/2015 12:36:26 PM)

You can see from the combat report that the coastal defenses are distracting the bombarding ships. This is why you're not seeing nuclear bombardments.

I also suspect that the fact that there's industry targets in the hex may play a role in dispersing the potential damage between the troops, airbase and industry.




dr.hal -> RE: Naval Bombardement of Heavy Urban - Can the aircraft be touched? (7/24/2015 1:50:45 PM)

The fact that the airbase is a "9" might have been a very important contributing factor. Although I find it hard to believe that NO planes were damaged... Fog of war might also be at play here.




HansBolter -> RE: Naval Bombardement of Heavy Urban - Can the aircraft be touched? (7/24/2015 4:06:24 PM)

FOW is definitely in play if you aren't experiencing a syncbug.

It may be that the airfields were not targeted at all and Mundy's report is the accurate one.

Dr. Hal may also be on to something if level 9 fields have revetments to protect planes that don't appear at smaller fields.

It's all part of the flavor of the game for us to not have tactical control.

Many times I have targeted a bypassed garrison for bombardment practice and watched turn after turn in frustration as the ships target the unused port and airfield and ignore the garrison I want them to hit.




KenchiSulla -> RE: Naval Bombardement of Heavy Urban - Can the aircraft be touched? (7/24/2015 5:56:09 PM)

With regards to the turn, this was my second visit to Sydney... Sorry Mundy, no synch bug :-).. I don't believe in fog of war since usually the report gives at least decent indication of damage done.

Perhaps Mundy can shed some light (give indication if any aircraft have been hit by the bombardment and not showing up in the report?)... The airfield size might be a factor... But the base is now wrecked and no planes hit AT ALL is a bit hard for me to believe given my (extensive) experience with dealing out and receiving these types of bombardements... and the only objects targetted were the north fortress and the airfields...





KenchiSulla -> RE: Naval Bombardement of Heavy Urban - Can the aircraft be touched? (7/24/2015 6:02:48 PM)

Here is my June-19th report of Brisbane bombardement run.. The airfields are size 9, similar hit amounts against the base... The difference is that Brisbane is clear, not urban....

Night Naval bombardment of Brisbane at 96,160 - Coastal Guns Fire Back!

Allied aircraft
no flights

Allied aircraft losses
Boomerang C-12: 4 damaged
P-39D Airacobra: 5 damaged
Anson I: 7 damaged
Anson I: 1 destroyed on ground
Kittyhawk III: 9 damaged
Kittyhawk III: 2 destroyed on ground
Beaufort VIII: 12 damaged
Beaufort VIII: 3 destroyed on ground
P-40K Warhawk: 12 damaged
P-40K Warhawk: 3 destroyed on ground
Spitfire Vc Trop: 1 damaged
Spitfire Vc Trop: 1 destroyed on ground
F4U-1 Corsair: 6 damaged
F4U-1 Corsair: 2 destroyed on ground
Vengeance I: 2 damaged

Japanese Ships
BB Yamato
BB Mutsu

Allied ground losses:
281 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 2 disabled
Non Combat: 9 destroyed, 14 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 5 (1 destroyed, 4 disabled)

Airbase hits 13
Runway hits 16

BB Yamato firing at Brisbane
F1M2 Pete acting as spotter for BB Mutsu
BB Mutsu firing at Brisbane Fortress
Brisbane Fortress firing at BB Mutsu


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Naval bombardment of Brisbane at 96,160

Allied aircraft
no flights

Allied aircraft losses
Beaufort VIII: 47 damaged
Beaufort VIII: 5 destroyed on ground
F4U-1 Corsair: 18 damaged
F4U-1 Corsair: 1 destroyed on ground
Vengeance I: 10 damaged
P-39D Airacobra: 14 damaged
P-39D Airacobra: 2 destroyed on ground
Anson I: 20 damaged
Anson I: 2 destroyed on ground
Boomerang C-12: 3 damaged
Boomerang C-12: 1 destroyed on ground
Kittyhawk III: 3 damaged
Kittyhawk III: 1 destroyed on ground
P-40K Warhawk: 25 damaged
P-40K Warhawk: 2 destroyed on ground
Spitfire Vc Trop: 1 damaged
Spitfire Vc Trop: 1 destroyed on ground

Japanese Ships
BB Hyuga
BB Ise

Allied Ships
AVD Ballard, Shell hits 1

Allied ground losses:
689 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 4 disabled
Non Combat: 21 destroyed, 33 disabled
Engineers: 2 destroyed, 2 disabled
Guns lost 4 (1 destroyed, 3 disabled)
Vehicles lost 3 (2 destroyed, 1 disabled)

Airbase hits 18
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 33
Port hits 1

BB Hyuga firing at Brisbane
BB Ise firing at Brisbane


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Naval bombardment of Brisbane at 96,160 - Coastal Guns Fire Back!

Allied aircraft
no flights

Allied aircraft losses
Beaufort VIII: 21 damaged
Beaufort VIII: 5 destroyed on ground
Kittyhawk III: 4 damaged
Kittyhawk III: 1 destroyed on ground
Spitfire Vc Trop: 2 damaged
Spitfire Vc Trop: 1 destroyed on ground
P-39D Airacobra: 7 damaged
P-39D Airacobra: 1 destroyed on ground
Boomerang C-12: 5 damaged
F4U-1 Corsair: 7 damaged
F4U-1 Corsair: 1 destroyed on ground
Vengeance I: 5 damaged
Vengeance I: 1 destroyed on ground
P-40K Warhawk: 7 damaged
Anson I: 15 damaged
Anson I: 1 destroyed on ground

Japanese Ships
BB Kirishima
BB Hiei
BB Kongo

Allied ground losses:
142 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 9 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 20 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 1 disabled
Guns lost 2 (1 destroyed, 1 disabled)

Airbase hits 3
Runway hits 22

BB Kirishima firing at Brisbane
BB Hiei firing at Brisbane Fortress
Brisbane Fortress firing at BB Hiei
BB Kongo firing at Brisbane




Mundy -> RE: Naval Bombardement of Heavy Urban - Can the aircraft be touched? (7/24/2015 6:56:16 PM)

Ah, that was the second one. My reports are exactly like those above.




wdolson -> RE: Naval Bombardement of Heavy Urban - Can the aircraft be touched? (7/25/2015 1:28:53 AM)

Larger airfields have reventments to protect planes. Additionally naval bombardments select their targets at random from what is in the hex. If the hex has more things in there, like industries as well as a port and airfield, there are a lot of targets to select from. Large CD guns would also spoil the aim of BBs bombarding. Smaller guns would have less effect because they wouldn't have the range.

Bill




BattleMoose -> RE: Naval Bombardement of Heavy Urban - Can the aircraft be touched? (7/25/2015 3:58:16 AM)

I thought the fort level would also play a role?




wdolson -> RE: Naval Bombardement of Heavy Urban - Can the aircraft be touched? (7/25/2015 6:10:25 AM)

That's another factor.




KenchiSulla -> RE: Naval Bombardement of Heavy Urban - Can the aircraft be touched? (7/25/2015 6:56:42 AM)

Turn 3:

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Aug 04, 43
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Naval bombardment of Sydney at 90,167 - Coastal Guns Fire Back!

Allied aircraft
no flights

Allied aircraft losses
SBD-3 Dauntless: 46 damaged
SBD-3 Dauntless: 6 destroyed on ground
F4U-1 Corsair: 5 damaged
F4U-1 Corsair: 2 destroyed on ground
P-38G Lightning: 18 damaged
P-38G Lightning: 2 destroyed on ground
Spitfire Vc Trop: 5 damaged
P-39N1 Airacobra: 10 damaged

17 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.

Japanese Ships
BB Kirishima
BB Hiei, Shell hits 1
BB Kongo

Allied ground losses:
463 casualties reported
Squads: 5 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 6 destroyed, 15 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 5 disabled

Airbase hits 3
Runway hits 13

E13A1 Jake acting as spotter for BB Kirishima
North Fortress firing at BB Kirishima
BB Kirishima firing at North Fortress
E13A1 Jake acting as spotter for BB Hiei
BB Hiei firing at Banks Fortress
Banks Fortress firing at BB Hiei
E13A1 Jake acting as spotter for BB Kongo
BB Kongo firing at Sydney


Seems like those were really unlucky runs... Thanks for the clarification mr. Dolson




crsutton -> RE: Naval Bombardement of Heavy Urban - Can the aircraft be touched? (7/25/2015 3:35:42 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: wdolson

Larger airfields have reventments to protect planes. Additionally naval bombardments select their targets at random from what is in the hex. If the hex has more things in there, like industries as well as a port and airfield, there are a lot of targets to select from. Large CD guns would also spoil the aim of BBs bombarding. Smaller guns would have less effect because they wouldn't have the range.

Bill


Bill,

I think his point is that while he wrecked the airfield, no planes were damaged. It is a bit odd but I would suggest he try it again once or twice. Due to the complex factors involved, terrain, forts, base levels,CD guns it might just be a one off.




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