In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (Full Version)

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SapperAstro_MatrixForum -> In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 1:47:30 PM)

And conversely, who do you rarely, if ever, refuse/dislike playing as?

After reading the piece on Jewish wargaming, I understood where they were coming from when some of them said "I don't feel comfortable playing as the Germans"...well, you wouldn't, would you?

When I play wargames, I usually have certain nations I prefer starting as;

WW2: Commonwealth nations are usually at the top of my play list. US usually at the bottom, mainly because the US is rarely, if ever, in danger. There is no real tension for a US player in that regard, and the knowledge that losses can be made up without having their capital/nation in mortal danger from such a loss leaves me a little cold when playing them in strategy games. I don't mind playing them in tactical games though.

Modern conflicts: again, usually Commonwealth at the top, good quality forces, but never enough of them. Makes a game tense but (usually) winnable through good use of assets. US again at the bottom; how can they lose? Seriously? Only through political will after a long conflict, and that only because they don't turn enemy nations into parking lots. Kills the buzz for me.

WW1: I actually enjoy just about anyone in a decent WW1 game. They all have the capacity to do well, or equally, do terribly. Nobody is a sure winner (or should be the case) in a WW1 game.

Pre 20th century: Depends on the setup. I don't have a lot of likes/dislikes or preconceived loyalties here, so just about anyone will do with the possible exception of; England over France, English over Northmen (Viking era games).

So I guess I am fairly easy to please. Make me a decent wargame with a good setup and I will come. I cannot think of anyone I wouldn't play as. There are a few times where I will pick a certain side over another, but this doesn't rule them out during later games.









terje439 -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 1:49:08 PM)

Underdogs;
-CSA
-Axis
-Entente

etc etc


Terje




SLAAKMAN -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 2:51:53 PM)

quote:


After reading the piece on Jewish wargaming, I understood where they were coming from when some of them said "I don't feel comfortable playing as the Germans"...well, you wouldn't, would you?

This is utterly stupid. What makes a game that personal? Making it such is Bullshit.




DerTroof -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 2:57:19 PM)

Usually the attacking side, because I'm always playing solitaire vs. the AI.




invernomuto -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 4:23:40 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: terje439

Underdogs;
-CSA
-Axis
-Entente

etc etc


Terje


+1

BUT, in WITE i loved the Soviet and in WITP:AE I'm currently playing with Allies.
B-24&Corsairs rocks :) .

In tactical wargames I really have no preferences: I like to play armies from all sides, from Italy to USA (e.g. in CMFI).




Curtis Lemay -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 4:40:04 PM)

I don't reject any side, but I think there's something special about filling Rommel's shoes (or Napoleon's, or Lee's, etc.). That's sort of what wargaming is all about.




Alchenar -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 5:06:44 PM)

It's all about presentation, because really any wargame is just an abstract set of rules that has a context placed upon it. The rules might have a historical inspiration, but it's the game that matters. For example you might take WitP and change all the terrain templates and the nouns and pretend it's a strategy game set in space and while the inspirations might still be recognisable, the game would still work.

In contrast imagine that in WitE instead of awarding the German player a 'win' for holding out longer than history, the game had a 'genocide counter' that went up every turn and awarded the German player a win if he could kill more people than Hitler did. In gameplay and historical terms those two things are essentially identical, but for obvious reasons most people would balk at playing Germany and being told explicitly that's what they are being rewarded for.




KG Erwin -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 5:35:53 PM)

Depends on the game. In SPWaW, I either choose the USMC or the Germans, but I also like the Finns and the Aussies. In American Civil War games, I always choose the Confederates. In Medieval: Total War, I always take the Holy Roman Empire (the Germans).




sullafelix -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 5:40:38 PM)

Underdogs, usually.




catwhoorg -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 5:47:14 PM)

Given enough time, usually every possible 'side'




warspite1 -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 7:21:13 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: catwhoorg

Given enough time, usually every possible 'side'
warspite1

+1




aaatoysandmore -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 7:41:29 PM)

Yeah confederates in american civil war, US side mostly in other games and I hate playing the russians or Germans except North Africa campaign. Love land battle Pacific War games like Guadacanal my favorite since Avalon Hill Guadacanal game of the 60's. I played that game so much I used up every one of those play sheets. Romans in early ancient games. Love smashing the barbarians. Denmark or the northern countries in TW games. Napoleon in those type of games. Mostly though the underdog except for WWII. Game era's it would be a hard choice between D-Day, Battle of the Bulge, Guadacanal or Gettysburg.




wings7 -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 7:47:35 PM)

I like to play all the sides that are available. Sometimes it literally takes years to experience playing all sides [:(] but in the long run it is worth it...variety is the spice of life! [;)]

Patrick




Capt. Harlock -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 8:24:05 PM)

quote:

And conversely, who do you rarely, if ever, refuse/dislike playing as?


I have to admit, I was uncomfortable playing the Axis side in the old Grigsby game "Bomb Alley". There was no choice, though, for the AI only played the British side. I also have problems playing the Japanese in WWII Pacific games.




Boomer78 -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 9:22:10 PM)

I think anyone who has a personal problem playing as a certain side in a game needs to check not only the size of their stones but the size of their brain as well. They are after all GAMES. What's next, are we going to go PC and have to start calling cowboys and indians Caucasian settlers and native Americans?

One of the things that help build an understanding of tactics and strategy is to learn both roles in a conflict situation. This is what they teach in OPFOR/BLUFOR in the military, it's what they teach in police work, it's what they teach in chess tournaments. Would anyone ever see the white pieces on a chess board offensive? Anyone who does needs a new layer of skin to thicken it up.

I've played as both sides in just about every game I've ever played. Never gave playing as the Germans, the NVA, or the martians a second thought.




Lützow -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 9:51:17 PM)

I always choose the side which i can identify with or at least feeling closer to. Means in WW2 titles I solely play Germany, with the exception of Pacific War where I go with the Yank's. In ACW I prefer the South and for post WW2 conflicts Western forces.

Anything else would feel wrong for me. [:(]




Hotschi -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 10:22:58 PM)

No preferences here, no matter whether the faction I play is/was the aggressor historically. I'd love to play as Japan in WitP-AE, but I shun the economy/research stuff, looks too complicated for my taste (I am not saying it is bad).

Playing a particular faction in wargames is and should not be a political or ideological statement. There's enough politics and ideologies in real life, don't need them when gaming.




TonyE -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/1/2013 10:31:05 PM)

NATO (really USA, the world revolved around us until the Wall fell right?)





TheGrayMouser -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/2/2013 1:01:24 AM)

In any particular game, I usually take the side that the AI has the hardest time playing. (which is usually but not always the historical underdog)




aaatoysandmore -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/2/2013 1:52:30 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Boomer78

I think anyone who has a personal problem playing as a certain side in a game needs to check not only the size of their stones but the size of their brain as well. They are after all GAMES. What's next, are we going to go PC and have to start calling cowboys and indians Caucasian settlers and native Americans?

One of the things that help build an understanding of tactics and strategy is to learn both roles in a conflict situation. This is what they teach in OPFOR/BLUFOR in the military, it's what they teach in police work, it's what they teach in chess tournaments. Would anyone ever see the white pieces on a chess board offensive? Anyone who does needs a new layer of skin to thicken it up.

I've played as both sides in just about every game I've ever played. Never gave playing as the Germans, the NVA, or the martians a second thought.


Well that's you and you aren't everybody and this was a free world in most places I know and you are insignificant in the first place because you don't make up the thoughts of the collective whole. So shut up puke and go play with your caucasians and native americans, I'm gonna make the choices and play who I wants to play......yaaah yaaah. :{P




Jim D Burns -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/2/2013 2:53:23 AM)

I have no real preferences other than perhaps I want to try out some strategy I pondered over while reading about the conflict. Vs. an AI it is usually dictated by which side is more challenging to play against. Vs. a human I generally have no preferences and defer to my opponents preferences.

Jim




sweeteye -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/2/2013 3:07:45 AM)

I like playing all sides.It matters not to me what actually happened historically regarding what side did what bad things. War is a bad thing anyways,for all sides.In recent past years I have spent a lot of time playing board wargames by myself and play both sides at the same time.I try to play as best I can for both sides involved.




warspite1 -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/2/2013 4:29:13 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Boomer78

I think anyone who has a personal problem playing as a certain side in a game needs to check not only the size of their stones but the size of their brain as well.

One of the things that help build an understanding of tactics and strategy is to learn both roles in a conflict situation.


warspite1

Really? You think there is necessarily something wrong in the head with a person of the Jewish faith simply for not wanting to play the Germans in a WWII game?

You think that they should play the Germans in order to understand the Nazi tactics and strategy?

I think that comment was rather unfair.




Twotribes -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/2/2013 4:44:49 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: Boomer78

I think anyone who has a personal problem playing as a certain side in a game needs to check not only the size of their stones but the size of their brain as well.

One of the things that help build an understanding of tactics and strategy is to learn both roles in a conflict situation.


warspite1

Really? You think there is necessarily something wrong in the head with a person of the Jewish faith simply for not wanting to play the Germans in a WWII game?

You think that they should play the Germans in order to understand the Nazi tactics and strategy?

I think that comment was rather unfair.

Since no war game I know of dealing with WWII has any of the bad things Germany did in them I see no problem. If one plays wargames for fun why would it be a concern? If one plays wargames to learn a little history again what is the problem?




warspite1 -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/2/2013 4:58:19 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Twotribes


quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: Boomer78

I think anyone who has a personal problem playing as a certain side in a game needs to check not only the size of their stones but the size of their brain as well.

One of the things that help build an understanding of tactics and strategy is to learn both roles in a conflict situation.


warspite1

Really? You think there is necessarily something wrong in the head with a person of the Jewish faith simply for not wanting to play the Germans in a WWII game?

You think that they should play the Germans in order to understand the Nazi tactics and strategy?

I think that comment was rather unfair.

Since no war game I know of dealing with WWII has any of the bad things Germany did in them I see no problem. If one plays wargames for fun why would it be a concern? If one plays wargames to learn a little history again what is the problem?
warspite1

What is the problem? To me, and to many others who have answered, there appears to be no problem.

What I was responding too was the comment that for anyone that has a problem they "must" have something wrong in the head.

As I said, I think that is unfair - particularly, but not limited to, being applied in the Jewish/German situation.




Boomer78 -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/2/2013 8:26:54 AM)

Warspite,
So by your logic I suppose there shouldn't be a Holocaust museum, then. Or maybe we should take down the monument at Wounded Knee. Why? Because, God forbid, someone has a problem with it or gets upset. They're just words, man. Sticks and stones and all the rest.

You probably know that the swastika is banned in Germany, right? Well, who but the nazis would go around banning things? Seems a bit contradictory, doesn't it? I don't think many people would understand freedom of movement, idea, or speech if it walked up and slapped them in the face. And to me, that's what's wrong with political correctness. We don't forget bad things because they happened. We REMEMBER bad things because they happened. To shove something down into the dark dust bin of history is basically begging to repeat it. Everything the swastika stands for is wrapped up in the idea of the force behind banning it. It is it's own best friend and worst enemy. Same goes for ideas. We all have the right to express what we want. The best way to expose a foolish nazi bigot isn't to ban him or his ideas. That only lends weight and power to his foolishness. We expose the nazi by allowing him to stick his foot into his mouth every time he opens it.

Long story short, people have the right to play games, pick sides, and believe in all kinds of things... even things you may not agree with. If someone is offended by playing as the nazis in a video game, then they have every right not to play it. At the same time, it gives them no right to stop me from playing it. I can't make my view point any simpler than that.




Alchenar -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/2/2013 10:05:02 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Boomer78

Warspite,
So by your logic I suppose there shouldn't be a Holocaust museum, then. Or maybe we should take down the monument at Wounded Knee. Why? Because, God forbid, someone has a problem with it or gets upset. They're just words, man. Sticks and stones and all the rest.

You probably know that the swastika is banned in Germany, right? Well, who but the nazis would go around banning things? Seems a bit contradictory, doesn't it? I don't think many people would understand freedom of movement, idea, or speech if it walked up and slapped them in the face. And to me, that's what's wrong with political correctness. We don't forget bad things because they happened. We REMEMBER bad things because they happened. To shove something down into the dark dust bin of history is basically begging to repeat it. Everything the swastika stands for is wrapped up in the idea of the force behind banning it. It is it's own best friend and worst enemy. Same goes for ideas. We all have the right to express what we want. The best way to expose a foolish nazi bigot isn't to ban him or his ideas. That only lends weight and power to his foolishness. We expose the nazi by allowing him to stick his foot into his mouth every time he opens it.

Long story short, people have the right to play games, pick sides, and believe in all kinds of things... even things you may not agree with. If someone is offended by playing as the nazis in a video game, then they have every right not to play it. At the same time, it gives them no right to stop me from playing it. I can't make my view point any simpler than that.



I love how your barely coherent rant ends with you accidentally making the wrong conclusion.

e: I mean you start with 'Jewish people who don't want to play a game as the Nazis are dumb' and then end with '. If someone is offended by playing as the nazis in a video game, then they have every right not to play it.'

You literally just lost an argument to yourself




Boomer78 -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/2/2013 10:21:21 AM)

Thanks for the edit... and the clarification.

Well, then I suppose I'll just have to disagree with myself and split us up before there's some kind of altercation between us. [:D]

I can't remember who was the first offended or the last. Are you offended that I was offended that some people might be offended? Or what is it something more sinister... offended times infinity!





Perturabo -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/2/2013 4:09:24 PM)

Whenever side has coolest vehicles and/or gets to commit most atrocities. If I'd want morality or comfort in gaming, I'd probably have to limit myself to sport games.
Nod was pretty cool. Too bad that Command & Conquer is a RTS which makes it unplayable to me.

Personally, I wish someone would make a serious Wh40k wargame featuring the Night Lords legion and their tactics.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Boomer78

Warspite,
So by your logic I suppose there shouldn't be a Holocaust museum, then. Or maybe we should take down the monument at Wounded Knee. Why? Because, God forbid, someone has a problem with it or gets upset. They're just words, man. Sticks and stones and all the rest.

Actually, the article doesn't say anything about censoring games. I haven't heard about Jewish groups attacking video game companies, unlike some other designated victim groups that lately plague gaming scene (like in the case of Hotline Miami 2 and Rock Paper Shotgun).

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alchenar

In contrast imagine that in WitE instead of awarding the German player a 'win' for holding out longer than history, the game had a 'genocide counter' that went up every turn and awarded the German player a win if he could kill more people than Hitler did. In gameplay and historical terms those two things are essentially identical, but for obvious reasons most people would balk at playing Germany and being told explicitly that's what they are being rewarded for.

IIRC STAVKA keeps track of genocide and overall death toll besides politics and military stuff.

Genocide counter could be an amusing addition to strategic wargame, though. The downside is that it would still be a strategic wargame.




Joe D. -> RE: In wargames, who do you prefer playing as? (10/2/2013 6:54:07 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DerTroof

Usually the attacking side, because I'm always playing solitaire vs. the AI.


Like Pallas Athena, usually the defending side, even solitaire vs. the AI.




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