The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (Full Version)

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Mad Russian -> The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (8/11/2013 1:59:10 AM)

Flash Point Campaigns is designed to cover modern land warfare.

That means anything from WWII through a considerable distance into the future.

It means everything from desert environments - like the Middle East, to jungle settings - like the Pacific theater of WWII, from major battles like engagements on the Golan Heights to smaller actions like the Battle of Goose Green in the Falklands.

From tank heavy actions on the Golan Heights to the infantry combat actions of the Vietnam War. One series to cover all of modern warfare.

It will cover all the major combat models that encompass land combat. Infantry, tank, artillery, close air support, helicopters, anti-aircraft artillery, surface to air missiles, anti-tank guided missiles, infantry combat vehicles, and everything else associated with land combat, is intended to be in the series when we are through with it.

That's the goal.

Hopefully, it will be many of your goals as well.

Good Hunting.


KEYSTONE07950 -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (8/11/2013 2:58:46 AM)


Hopefully, it will be many of your goals as well.

Indeed it is. Looking forward to exploring modern combat with this engine.

wodin -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (8/29/2013 11:35:02 PM)

Looking forward to either Vietnam or Korea...hint hint :)

Mad Russian -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (8/30/2013 1:31:49 AM)

One of those is very much in line with being the first module after Red Storm...hint hint :)

Good Hunting.


wodin -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (8/30/2013 2:51:37 AM)


Richie61 -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/4/2013 5:30:42 AM)

Vietnam or Korea? [&:]
I was hoping for Arab vs Israeli or Middle East series. IMHO, I would rather see Europe 1946 to pre Red Storm WAY before Vietnam. I guess a Korea in the 80's could be interesting, but the Middle East would be my choice!
Lots of great battles in the Middle East from 1967 to 2003 [:D]

Mad Russian -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/4/2013 6:06:19 AM)

There are lots of choices for expansions. We would like to release about 6 expansions at one time!!!! Just to get the game series going in multiple different directions. The issues of what's next comes in 2 flavors.

1) What we have the most research done on.
2) What we can add the most features to the base game, the quickest, for the next module to so you guys can create what you want. Middle East is a very tank centric game and that works well with FPC but there are some features that we would like to bring to that module that may take a bit more time than some others. Rather than make you wait we thought we would release some that only need very little additional work done to them.

That could be you gamers choice though. If you want to wait for us to get the tougher theaters done rather than have us release theaters that would work with a minimum of coding we could do that. You guys call.

Nothing stopping any of you from creating your own scenarios once the game is released. In fact, I think you'll be amazed at just how simple it is to create scenarios. For those of you that have played my scenarios before, you know if it was easy to use the editor I couldn't be doing it in the first place.

Good Hunting.


wodin -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/4/2013 9:44:46 AM)

I meant the Korean War. I have zero interest in the middle east.

Mad Russian -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/4/2013 5:17:28 PM)

The Middle East holds great interest for many because of the wide open spaces for maneuver and it has the largest armored force clashes in history. I can see the allure of that area.

That doesn't mean that other, less well gamed theaters can't/won't be added to the series as well. The first one for sure will not be ME unless a lot of things change from where they currently are in development.

Good Hunting.


Hexagon -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/4/2013 6:32:38 PM)

I see it oposite, to the game scale i see more interesting ME over other conflicts (out of what ifs of course) Korea has his point to but compared with ME for me lose specially when engine look at this moment "poor" in infantry part, i think that game needs improve a lot infantry part with more details for it (number of soldiers, weapons...).

Maybe Korea could be interesting but in a diferent level, maybe at company level for infantry and sections for armor (i refer to the step before company level) at least in big operations/battles... i think that the engine can do a good job moving between the company/section level (even squads to cover special units) but when engine is improved to cover better infantry with more details.

Mad Russian -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/5/2013 3:22:33 AM)

Hexagon, we'll wait to discuss what the infantry does or doesn't do until you have actually played the game.

The whole idea of having different time periods and theaters is to highlight the combat situations in them. So, I would think that if we decided to showcase a theater that was mostly infantry combat, or any other combat situation, we would have the system adjusted to go with it.

Don't you? [&:]

Good Hunting.


Richie61 -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/5/2013 5:16:00 AM)


ORIGINAL: Mad Russian

The first one for sure will not be ME unless a lot of things change from where they currently are in development.

Good Hunting.


Too bad.... [:(]

Hexagon -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/5/2013 10:08:57 AM)

I refer that for my taste infantry in a game like this need be represented in soldier numbers and number of weapons (in superior level like battalion number of soldiers is enough but is not bad some details in heavy weapons), i can asume that appear a tank "damage" in abstract way (but is much better select the company, see the tank status one by one in armament, engine, tracks, integrity...) but not in infantry... what represent a damage squad??? 1 guy dead/wounded/MIA/captured, 2 guys dead/wounded/MIA/captured ... if we dont know the size of the unit on his basic componets (for tank units is number of tanks in infantry units number of soldiers) is hard try understand what damage means.

I dont say that game represent bad infantry combat, i dont know it really but how represent infantry in the game scale... i allways dislike the PG mode with an abstract number i like a lot more see number of tanks, soldiers, guns etc etc.

Then ME is not the next... but do you refer to full title (a new title of the Flash point Campaigns serie) or next add-on to serie??? i know that you plan release at least 2 add-ons for the title after release it but after you complete a little more Red Storm you go for ME or other title??? thanks.

CapnDarwin -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/5/2013 12:23:53 PM)


I think there is split in scope here. You are looking for each soldier and tank to be fully addressed in the game. That would be a tactical level game. Basically a step down the ladder from where we are. That would be more a Steel Panthers, Combat Mission, etc style game. We are basically a platoon and company level game. We do track each vehicle and squad in those formations and each on of those can exist in a counter/formation. We track the loss (kill, knockout, combat ineffective) of each squad and vehicle in those platoons and companies. Again, going to track, gun, systems of each is a scope one step down. There has been talk about adding a more detailed breakdown of losses in the post-mortem giving some details like you are talking. It is a bit of chrome and not a game mechanic. I see where you are coming from but it is not the level of scope we designed this game too.

As for next releases, first this one needs to get out and more than 10 people need to buy a copy. Assuming sales are good and will fund future work a bit, we will be looking at two add-ons to Red Storm adding more countries, maps and scenarios. We will also be working on the next game engine upgrade and a whole new setting (maybe in the far east, maybe) and time frame.


Hexagon -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/5/2013 6:33:55 PM)

This is my point, if the info is in the game (in a black box) why not made it visible for players??? something like a detailed mode where you can see more details in casualties and infantry units soldiers, i ask in the other point about what means the icon over damage/destroyed units to diference between destroyed unit and damage unit for example, if you can see the info about the tank/squad is more clear the info (if a squad of 10 soldiers lose 2 or a tank lose gun...).

I know the scope of the game but at this level you are closer to Close combat, Squad battles or Steel panthers level (remember for example that SPIII was a game with same level of your game) and even games like operational Tiller games, WITE or Decisive Campaigns series use as info for units vehicles-soldiers-guns in absolute numbers (even when they use other scope to calculate results).

I know that i am talking like a guy that build castles in the air but is a way to wait the release [:D] add-ons... never be my favourite "modern" feature in games, i am more a "expansions" guy where with a single expansion you complete the game but... and new titles and features i think that we need wait some years even if all works fine because at least 12-18 months are to complete Red Storm.

I dont think you have problems to sell 10 games at least i know that you have... 3-4 sells done out of this forum [sm=00000436.gif]

Good luck.

wodin -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/5/2013 7:02:15 PM)

Hexagon..I too prefer my games counting soldiers no matter the scale and yes Tiller games are a good example..however most don't do this which goes back to wargames boardgame roots. So it doesn't surprise me they have gone the way most wargames play at this scale. As for detailed equip damage..that is def a tactical 1 tank 1 counter game and isn't needed at this scale.
I expect the minimum Inf loss is a squad...not sure on this but it wont be counting individual soldiers.

I would like to see the casualty chrome in the post-mortem though Cpt!

CapnDarwin -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/5/2013 8:04:58 PM)

The black box is at the vehicle /squad level. It doesn't dig any deeper than that. A unit is either shades of gray functional or out of action.

I'm pretty sure the post mortem chrome is in our 2.1 wish list.

wodin -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/5/2013 8:10:23 PM)

Squad is fine for a coy scale game..again I can see where Hexagon is coming from and I'm very similar..but I can deal with squad casualty [;)][:D].

Hexagon -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/6/2013 10:45:19 AM)

Well, i never play boardgames, i am a PCguy and well, in a PC game i search "info" because is a machine who needs deal with numbers-stats etc etc.

Maybe i prefer see infantry units in number of soldiers because my first wargames were based on this ... curious my first wargame was a mix of many scales, i dont know if you know "Civil war" of Empire, my first wargame and after this "Steel Panthers" this game has a special history for me becuase before buy it a friend give me a CD with demos and the 2 wargames on it were "Panzer General" and "Steel Panthers" (SP demo, the best demo ever with 2 game sellers scens and a 3rd to see panthers hehehe) first demo i play was PG and i find it better than SP (to complex for my teen brain you know, sex uses 99% of brain power [:D]) but i start playing SP when i find more usefull the units value in number of soldiers it was something more attractive for me and i was lucky because 3 months after start playing SP demo i find the game in Gold version with WinPG and i buy SP, the best buy in a wargame (CC5 is closer thanks to the ton of mods for it).

I can asume play with squads but in battle see more info about how is the level of damage is interesting.

PD: i have near me the SP box [8|]

wodin -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/6/2013 12:54:12 PM)

Again I'm with you..however many wargames go the boardgame route esp at grand tactical and operational scale. One reason why I'm more a squad scale tactical wargamer due to it having less abstraction. The problem with a coy scale game is if you go the route of counting individual soldiers and weapons you create alot more work, something a small developer prob haven't the time to go that indepth and so they have to abstract it..I think OTS have abstracted as little as time would allow and put as much detail in as they can. I too love wargames with lots of detail but I'm happy with the way FC looks and it has some unique features that make it stand out.

Hex your a squad level tactical wargamer but this isn't a squad level game, however I'm sure once you start playing you wont mind so much that inf casualties are whole squads etc.

The biggest gripe I have with not having individual soldiers modeled is in a squad scale PC wargame. Where they are either whole squad or half squads. It's understandable it needs to be that way in a boardgame but this is where the power of the PC should come in. Squad Battles gets it right..but it too has an abstracted mechanic for ammo\wounds which for me really harms the game..SB is so close to a tactical hex based classic but let down by a couple of things. So yes a squad scale game going abstract with soldiers is REALLY annoying;)

Mad Russian -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/6/2013 4:43:42 PM)

The differences you are discussing is the difference between what is a game and what is a simulation. The more detailed the game and the deeper in depth you go the closer to a simulation you get.

All games are a blend of the two. Each game is presented to the buyers as the designers representation of what they want to emphasize in their 'game'. When I create scenarios I make them for me. I am my own biggest fan. If I don't like it, you never see it. If I like it then I share it with the rest of you.

Games are overall that same way. While you guys do have a say for certain things the basic design is what the designer likes and then shares with you.

Hope that helps a bit.

FPC is extremely detailed. I'm not sure that all the nuts and bolts will filter down to a level where you will get to turn all the knobs and see all the screens. To do that requires a tremendous energy on our part. Not sure that the required energy is worth the results. Would you want us spending time bringing you more information in the game or more module to play.

We only have so much time.

Good Hunting.


wodin -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/6/2013 5:05:12 PM)

Exactly what I was getting at..


ORIGINAL: Mad Russian

We only have so much time.

Good Hunting.


rjcme -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/12/2013 8:19:04 PM)

I have a little doubt.

I believe I read that the hex scale is 500 meters. But will the editor allow to change to less or more?

CapnDarwin -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/12/2013 8:59:45 PM)

No. The code is all based on a 500m hex. Rescaling would take some major changes in the code. It has been discussed as a target for future consideration.

rjcme -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/13/2013 3:03:47 PM)

It would increase the possibilities of the editor, which was one of the reasons for the sucess of TOAW. But itīs up to Matrix, of course.

wodin -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/13/2013 3:12:04 PM)

For a game to have re-scalable hex then it needs to be designed from the ground up with that feature, if not I'd imagine all kinds of issues with combat and range.

CapnDarwin -> RE: The Scope of Flash Point Campaigns (9/13/2013 4:12:45 PM)

We have vast editing /modding capabilities. Game scale is just not one of the possible options. There are a number of internal values we use that are not open to modification. Over time we may revise the code and expose more of these values.

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