The Art of Conflict 2.0
- larryfulkerson
- Posts: 40908
- Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2005 9:06 pm
- Location: Tucson, AZ,usa,sol, milkyway
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The Art of Conflict 2.0
I think that Matrix/Slitherene has probably spent a pretty penny getting the source code from Norman and, yeah, they probably won't want to give that up. So the answer might be to start with a blank sheet of paper and start an open source project that does what TOAW does now. But in a more concurrent language instead of C. Maybe Python. Or Java. Maybe something that a lot of programmers already know to hit the ground running. And YES a different name for the game engine. I'm wondering how many people we could count on to do a project like that. We'd need an AI expert I'm guessing. What would we call it? I'm thinking SimWar has already been taken. How about Universal Game Engine 5.0
Interviewer: "What is your greatest weakness?"
Elderly Gentleman: "My honesty."
Interviewer: "Well I hardly think that could be a weakness."
Elderly Gentleman: "I don't give a fuck what you think."
Elderly Gentleman: "My honesty."
Interviewer: "Well I hardly think that could be a weakness."
Elderly Gentleman: "I don't give a fuck what you think."
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RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
How about The Art of Conflict?
- larryfulkerson
- Posts: 40908
- Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2005 9:06 pm
- Location: Tucson, AZ,usa,sol, milkyway
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RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
I like that a lot. That's good. TAoC, cool. We need something that hints that our product is capable to simulating almost anything at all from any time period because I suspect that may be one of our goals for the game engine. Keep those good ideas coming.ORIGINAL: Simon Edmonds
How about The Art of Conflict?
Interviewer: "What is your greatest weakness?"
Elderly Gentleman: "My honesty."
Interviewer: "Well I hardly think that could be a weakness."
Elderly Gentleman: "I don't give a fuck what you think."
Elderly Gentleman: "My honesty."
Interviewer: "Well I hardly think that could be a weakness."
Elderly Gentleman: "I don't give a fuck what you think."
- larryfulkerson
- Posts: 40908
- Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2005 9:06 pm
- Location: Tucson, AZ,usa,sol, milkyway
- Contact:
RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
I established a Facebook group for us and you can find it here:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/571381640314323/
https://www.facebook.com/groups/571381640314323/
Interviewer: "What is your greatest weakness?"
Elderly Gentleman: "My honesty."
Interviewer: "Well I hardly think that could be a weakness."
Elderly Gentleman: "I don't give a fuck what you think."
Elderly Gentleman: "My honesty."
Interviewer: "Well I hardly think that could be a weakness."
Elderly Gentleman: "I don't give a fuck what you think."
RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
I'm not a facebook user and intend never to be. Facebook is a hated medium to some of us.
USMC: 1970-1977. A United States Marine.
We don't take kindly to idjits.
We don't take kindly to idjits.
RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
same here on facebook and mark zookercrookenbachstealingyouridentityandheisnotahumanbeing
Beta Tester for: War in the East 1 & 2, WarPlan & WarPlan Pacific, Valor & Victory, Flashpoint Campaigns: Sudden Storm, Computer War In Europe 2
SPWW2 & SPMBT scenario creator
RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
Agree. Feeling a bit lonely now after stirring the pot finding the truth of the matter.
USMC: 1970-1977. A United States Marine.
We don't take kindly to idjits.
We don't take kindly to idjits.
RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
I don't use Facebook either. I would suggest that in order to see if there is any interest, maybe run a thread in the General Forum here.
If I understand correctly what Al Sousa [WarPlan] said, it took him two years to write that game using Unity. I know we have a great community of selfless contributors here, but I don't know how many volunteer 'coders' or [whatever you call those folks] there are. Also, I have recently talked to some others about such a project and one of the items that came out of that discussion was an outline that would be needed by coders in order to know what they are doing. This seems like a huge task in itself.
I am willing to participate and contribute whatever I can though, because its depressingly obvious that what we have now and have had for many years is completely disappointing.
If I understand correctly what Al Sousa [WarPlan] said, it took him two years to write that game using Unity. I know we have a great community of selfless contributors here, but I don't know how many volunteer 'coders' or [whatever you call those folks] there are. Also, I have recently talked to some others about such a project and one of the items that came out of that discussion was an outline that would be needed by coders in order to know what they are doing. This seems like a huge task in itself.
I am willing to participate and contribute whatever I can though, because its depressingly obvious that what we have now and have had for many years is completely disappointing.
RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
I'm not a Facebook user either, and like a few others have said never will be.
Other than that I'm willing to help out any way I can. Not a programmer though.
Other than that I'm willing to help out any way I can. Not a programmer though.
RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
I'll volunteer. I used to be a good COBOL programmer about 27 years ago, then played with basic for a few years on my pc's. I'm sure that was a helpful skill back then.
Now I have time to spend on whatever I desire and this could be something very worthwhile. I also seem to have a useful trait for fomenting a rebellion of sorts.
We need to have somebody step up and be the honcho for such a project otherwise it is going to run in all directions.
Now I have time to spend on whatever I desire and this could be something very worthwhile. I also seem to have a useful trait for fomenting a rebellion of sorts.
We need to have somebody step up and be the honcho for such a project otherwise it is going to run in all directions.
USMC: 1970-1977. A United States Marine.
We don't take kindly to idjits.
We don't take kindly to idjits.
- larryfulkerson
- Posts: 40908
- Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2005 9:06 pm
- Location: Tucson, AZ,usa,sol, milkyway
- Contact:
RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
So many of you don't like the Facebook idea so I went to GitHub and established an account for us to use. It's here:
https://github.com/DonaldTrump240/TheArtofConflict
Please let me know if you guys have a problem getting to it etc. I think I did it right, so maybe we're on our way.
https://github.com/DonaldTrump240/TheArtofConflict
Please let me know if you guys have a problem getting to it etc. I think I did it right, so maybe we're on our way.
Interviewer: "What is your greatest weakness?"
Elderly Gentleman: "My honesty."
Interviewer: "Well I hardly think that could be a weakness."
Elderly Gentleman: "I don't give a fuck what you think."
Elderly Gentleman: "My honesty."
Interviewer: "Well I hardly think that could be a weakness."
Elderly Gentleman: "I don't give a fuck what you think."
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- Posts: 253
- Joined: Fri Mar 26, 2004 3:46 pm
- Location: United States
RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
Also not a facebook user.
But I am a programmer and AI researcher.
A couple of things:
- This is a huge undertaking that will require multiple talents for 1000s of hours.
- Cannot do this through a BB or Facebook group. It will require regular face-to-face meetings (via internet, I'd assume). Too easy to be an outlier personality when the only mechanism for communication is "Post Reply".
- I wouldn't even bother talking about programming until a core group of dedicated people comes together and designs the thing. That means hammering out the mechanisms, the math and scope for as much of it as possible in as much detail as possible. Easy to say TOAW is broken; hard to say how it should be fixed...and have everyone agree.
- Must be cross-platform. It has been slow, but fewer and fewer developers believe a Windows only release is all they need. Matrix/Slitherine is a bit behind in this area. I think this is doubly true for independent projects.
- Develop the group first. Start regular meetings to draft the idea. Only once you've come together and feel confident the majority are in for the long haul then look for programmers, artists, etc. I'd go with a Patreon model so that everyone in the community can contribute. A constant flow of cash is a base line motivator to keep working.
My two cents.
But I am a programmer and AI researcher.
A couple of things:
- This is a huge undertaking that will require multiple talents for 1000s of hours.
- Cannot do this through a BB or Facebook group. It will require regular face-to-face meetings (via internet, I'd assume). Too easy to be an outlier personality when the only mechanism for communication is "Post Reply".
- I wouldn't even bother talking about programming until a core group of dedicated people comes together and designs the thing. That means hammering out the mechanisms, the math and scope for as much of it as possible in as much detail as possible. Easy to say TOAW is broken; hard to say how it should be fixed...and have everyone agree.
- Must be cross-platform. It has been slow, but fewer and fewer developers believe a Windows only release is all they need. Matrix/Slitherine is a bit behind in this area. I think this is doubly true for independent projects.
- Develop the group first. Start regular meetings to draft the idea. Only once you've come together and feel confident the majority are in for the long haul then look for programmers, artists, etc. I'd go with a Patreon model so that everyone in the community can contribute. A constant flow of cash is a base line motivator to keep working.
My two cents.
Make wargames, not war.
RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
Perhaps the start up should not immediately become divisive by using the name of our commander in chief.
USMC: 1970-1977. A United States Marine.
We don't take kindly to idjits.
We don't take kindly to idjits.
RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
What @Menschenfresser says makes a great deal of sense.
Also, I would expect that ultimately some limited $$ might be required, for artwork, specialized software, etc; if necessary at the appropriate stage we could set up a Kickstarter project for that.
I'm on Github, but don't see any way to start conversations?
My understanding is that C# + Unity is a pretty popular game development platform, but I have to say that most of the Unity games I've seen have been a bit blah-looking.
Also, I would expect that ultimately some limited $$ might be required, for artwork, specialized software, etc; if necessary at the appropriate stage we could set up a Kickstarter project for that.
I'm on Github, but don't see any way to start conversations?
My understanding is that C# + Unity is a pretty popular game development platform, but I have to say that most of the Unity games I've seen have been a bit blah-looking.
RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
Is this to be a for profit undertaking?
Is this to be done as a labor of love for the game concept?
Will this game be distributed without cost to whoever wants it?
Will those who want the game have to pay for it?
Does anyone require cash payments to work on this concept?
Are you willing to volunteer your time?
Is this to be done as a labor of love for the game concept?
Will this game be distributed without cost to whoever wants it?
Will those who want the game have to pay for it?
Does anyone require cash payments to work on this concept?
Are you willing to volunteer your time?
USMC: 1970-1977. A United States Marine.
We don't take kindly to idjits.
We don't take kindly to idjits.
RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
Maybe a good place to move to for discussion and planning purposes? http://grogheads.com/forums/index.php
If you scroll down, you'll see they even have a section called "Game Forge" which looks like it's for game design and development discussions. Both professional and amateur.
Just a thought. I believe the faster we get off of Matrix's turf (unless they specifically OK it) the better. This is their territory after all, and this is a bit of an insurrection so to speak.
If you scroll down, you'll see they even have a section called "Game Forge" which looks like it's for game design and development discussions. Both professional and amateur.
Just a thought. I believe the faster we get off of Matrix's turf (unless they specifically OK it) the better. This is their territory after all, and this is a bit of an insurrection so to speak.
RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
That looks very appropriate for discussing this concept.
USMC: 1970-1977. A United States Marine.
We don't take kindly to idjits.
We don't take kindly to idjits.
RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
Actually, might make sense to have the initial discussions on some public game-related forum such as grogheads rather than github to see if anyone else might be interested.
RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
Larry, I can get to it with no problem, but can you rename it?ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson
So many of you don't like the Facebook idea so I went to GitHub and established an account for us to use. It's here:
https://github.com/DonaldTrump240/TheArtofConflict
Please let me know if you guys have a problem getting to it etc. I think I did it right, so maybe we're on our way.
Speaking only for myself I think we need to keep all controversy and politics out of this. The naming is "cute" but might stir up a little trouble. Doesn't matter what your beliefs are, we should check them at the door.
Further, not everyone is from the USA, and I'll bet they couldn't care less about domestic politics and issues.
I know you don't mean anything by the naming, but I'm just sayin'....
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RE: Universal Game Engine 5.0
That unfortunate choice is Larry's username which cannot be changed on github, AFAICT. The project name by itself is fine, but combined with the username, I strongly suspect many developers will avoid the project. I suggest some else create the project, since nothing's been done yet, but Larry has to delete the project if you want to use the same name.ORIGINAL: pz501
Larry, I can get to it with no problem, but can you rename it?
Speaking only for myself I think we need to keep all controversy and politics out of this. The naming is "cute" but might stir up a little trouble. Doesn't matter what your beliefs are, we should check them at the door.
Further, not everyone is from the USA, and I'll bet they couldn't care less about domestic politics and issues.
I know you don't mean anything by the naming, but I'm just sayin'....
Wargaming live streams https://www.twitch.tv/tomlowshang