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Czechoslovak Air Force in 1983

 
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Czechoslovak Air Force in 1983 - 7/24/2018 7:17:24 PM   
PN79

 

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Hello,

Slowly I am creating "scenario" which contains Czechoslovak Air and Air Defence units as it was in 1983. It will still take some time to finish it but nevertheless here is current version.

EDIT: Download is in later post.

< Message edited by PN79 -- 4/10/2019 3:55:09 PM >
Post #: 1
RE: Czechoslovak Air Force in 1983 - 7/24/2018 9:22:00 PM   
mikkey


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From: Slovakia
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Nice work Pavel, thanks!

(in reply to PN79)
Post #: 2
RE: Czechoslovak Air Force in 1983 - 4/10/2019 4:07:53 PM   
PN79

 

Posts: 146
Joined: 1/3/2015
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Attached is new version - added main Czechoslovak helicopter units (and some corrections).

Note that unfortunately there are not some type of aircrafts in database so some types are placeholders:

An-24B in Mosnov AB should be Il-14T which are missing in DB3000
Mi-8MT should be Mi-4 (note that Mi-8T are correct)
Su-7BMK should be Su-7BKL
L-39C should be L-29R (recon version of L-29)
An-26RR should be two Il-14RT and one Il-14RTR which are Czechoslovak ELINT variants of Il-14
some MiG-21F-13 should be MiG-21FR which are Czechoslovak later produced MiG-21 wired for recce pods but otherwise with same performance as basic MiG-21F-13

EDIT: Download is in later post.

< Message edited by PN79 -- 12/24/2019 6:35:02 PM >

(in reply to mikkey)
Post #: 3
RE: Czechoslovak Air Force in 1983 - 5/12/2019 7:14:45 PM   
PN79

 

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I have started adding Soviet Central Group of Forces, currently there are both fighter regiments and all main SAM formations.

Czechoslovak State Air Defense is complete with this orbat:
- 2nd State Air Defense Division
-- 8th Fighter Aviation Regiment (Brno - Turany, Mosnov)
-- 76th SAM Brigade
-- 77th SAM Regiment
-- 186th SAM Brigade
-- 2nd Radiotechnical Brigade
- 3rd State Air Defense Division
-- 1st Fighter Aviation Regiment (Ceske Budejovice - Plana)
-- 11th Fighter Aviation Regiment (Zatec)
-- 71st SAM Brigade
-- 185th SAM Regiment
-- 3rd Radiotechnical Brigade
-- 7th Electronic Warfare Radiotechnical Battalion

Czechoslovak Air Force is missing only reserve airfields. Orbat:
- 3rd Transport Aviation Regiment (Kbely, VIP transport, not represented)
- 10th Aviation Army
-- 1st Fighter Aviation Division
--- 4th Fighter Aviation Regiment (Pardubice)
--- 5th Fighter Aviation Regiment (Plzen - Dobrany)
--- 9th Fighter Aviation Regiment (Bechyne)
-- 34th Fighter Bomber Aviation Division
--- 6th Fighter Bomber Aviation Regiment (Prerov)
--- 20th Fighter Bomber Aviation Regiment (Namest nad Oslavou)
--- 28th Fighter Bomber Aviation Regiment (Caslav)
--- 30th Fighter Bomber Aviation Regiment (Hradec Kralove, only one squadron, others waiting for new aircrafts)
-- 47th Reconnaissance Aviation Regiment (Pardubice)
-- 1st Transport Airborne Aviation Regiment (Mosnov)
-- 11th Helicopter Squadron (Plzen - Bory)
-- 14th Helicopter Squadron (Bechyne)
-- 51st Helicopter Regiment (Prostejov)

Czechoslovak Ground Forces have there all main SAM units but otherwise most of EW, AAA and SSM units are still missing.

EDIT: Download is in later post.


< Message edited by PN79 -- 12/14/2019 5:51:58 PM >

(in reply to PN79)
Post #: 4
RE: Czechoslovak Air Force in 1983 - 12/14/2019 5:51:01 PM   
PN79

 

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Joined: 1/3/2015
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Attached is new version. Airfields are now finished and with them also all Soviet air units in CGF.

Mi-6 helicopter is missing in database so there are Mi-26 as placeholders.

Generic air traffic radars in Czechoslovak airfields represents Czechoslovak domestic radars like RL-4AS and RL-42.

EDIT: Download is in later post.

< Message edited by PN79 -- 9/2/2020 6:20:21 PM >

(in reply to PN79)
Post #: 5
RE: Czechoslovak Air Force in 1983 - 9/2/2020 6:34:36 PM   
PN79

 

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Joined: 1/3/2015
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I have finished Czechoslovak ground forces assets and made some corrections.

The 2nd Squadron from 1st Transport Regiment in Mosnov had L-410 transport aircrafts from 1982. These are now substituted with DHC-6 because L-410 is not in database.

7th Radiotechnical Regiment and 7th Radio Regiment were despite similar names two different units (which were also different from PVOS's 7th EW Bn) and both weren't part of ground forces but they were specialized intelligence units subordinated to general staff. They operated ELINT stations and Ramona systems along western border. In scenario they are represented by these systems.

EDIT: Download is in later post.

< Message edited by PN79 -- 6/13/2021 7:59:27 AM >

(in reply to PN79)
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RE: Czechoslovak Air Force in 1983 - 9/3/2020 7:50:23 AM   
jimmyblond

 

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This is excellent work. Thank you for sharing this.

(in reply to PN79)
Post #: 7
RE: Czechoslovak Air Force in 1983 - 9/3/2020 5:33:33 PM   
thewood1

 

Posts: 6100
Joined: 11/27/2005
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I just bought this book that lays out the OOBs of NATO/WP air forces. Its a good book.

https://ospreypublishing.com/in-cold-war-skies

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Post #: 8
RE: Czechoslovak Air Force in 1983 - 9/3/2020 6:49:53 PM   
PN79

 

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Thank you.

Data about Czechoslovak army are relatively easily accessible for me but I was surprised how hard is to find information about Soviet CGF. Czechoslovak army was not allowed to spy on other Warsaw Pact states so data from this source are very limited. But even information from western sources are sketchy. For example trying to find out what SAM systems Soviets had there in 1983 was surprisingly hard and I had to search Russian sources to get the answers.


(in reply to thewood1)
Post #: 9
RE: Czechoslovak Air Force in 1983 - 6/13/2021 7:58:56 AM   
PN79

 

Posts: 146
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Elements of Soviet Central Group are finished - new version attached.

While I cannot get specific number of aircrafts in both fighter regiments I have decided to use 40 fighters instead of 36 as I have here in previous version. While standard fighter regiment organisation calls for three squadrons with 12 fighters each in second half of 1970s were set goals to have 40 aircrafts (plus training ones) and this was apparently accomplished in fighter regiments in CGF.

Sources for Soviet radiotechnical and electronic warfare units are very limited. There were two radiotechnical battalions and I have come to conclusion that 57th RT Bn has structure like PVOS unit with fixed radar stations while 1240th RT Bn is mobile unit for support of advancing ground forces. 233rd RT Rgt is specialized intelligence unit apparently operating single Soviet Ramona system in Czechoslovakia and sharing ELINT stations with Czechoslovak intelligence. In scenario is thus represented this way.

There are two electronic warfare battalions. Again sources are scarce but I think that 979th EW Bn task was to support 131st Mixed Aviation Division while 1921st EW Bn supports ground forces.

Finally I have marked Ramona systems as known to all as mobility of this system was limited and was continuously observed by NATO intelligence.

EDIT: Save replaced due to small typo.


Attachment (1)

< Message edited by PN79 -- 6/13/2021 9:42:39 PM >

(in reply to PN79)
Post #: 10
RE: Czechoslovak Air Force in 1983 - 6/29/2021 10:07:17 AM   
Blast33


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Joined: 12/31/2018
From: Above and beyond
Status: online
Very nice, thanx.

I just found this site: http://www.fortifikace.net/povalecne_pvos.html and I did a search if sombody did something with this and found your post

You are probably familiar with this one, correct?


(in reply to PN79)
Post #: 11
RE: Czechoslovak Air Force in 1983 - 6/29/2021 7:30:16 PM   
PN79

 

Posts: 146
Joined: 1/3/2015
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Yeah, I know this one. The forum there is one of the sources I was using for this - both Czechoslovak air force and CGF units. There are some information about CGF radar and EW formations but not complete and sometimes contradicting to other sources. For example in forum is discussed that 1240th RT Bn was subordinated to 233rd RT Rgt but Russian source says that 1240th was directly subordinated to 28th Army Corps HQ in Olomouc.

Regarding CGF units there are more contradicting information or no one ever bothered to research or publicize it. Just getting information what kind of SAMs Soviets had here was headache as I have to go through memoirs of former servicemen to get the picture. Further the CGF structure was changing over time so for example in 1989 divisional helicopter squadrons were already merged in second combat helicopter regiment in CGF but for me that meant getting names of these squadrons as they were there in 1983. Finally even such excellent source like vojenstvi.cz has errors in their list of CGF units in 1989. For example they have named SAM regiment under 18th GMRD as "130th" but Russian sources cleared that it is actually 139th.

So at the end I cannot claim that what I have here is exactly how it was but rather my current understanding based on available sources.


< Message edited by PN79 -- 6/29/2021 7:31:45 PM >

(in reply to Blast33)
Post #: 12
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