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RE: AI for MWiF - USA

 
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RE: AI for MWiF - USA - 1/31/2013 9:01:10 PM   
Extraneous

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur
Personally, I think that you are using too much optional rules into your strategy. What happens with these building strategies when a lot of the optional rules are not in play? That makes a very different building strategy for the USA and the AI should take this into account.
I would suggest you make one, if all additional units optional rules, AMPH rules, break down etc. etc. (divisions, pilots, CVP's, CL, CX, ASW etc. etc.) aren't used. What would you build in those cases? Suddenly, it is a totally different game of WiF you're playing (and faster on the board too...).


I agree the game would be different but I want to continue to give a broad view.



quote:

ORIGINAL: composer99
The other thing to note is about US entry.

The US cannot really plan ahead on US entry as it depends more on Axis and Allied activity than on the US' entry draws.

For example, in a minimal Sep/Oct 1939 the US has to plan to gain chits from a German declaration of war on Poland and lose chits from the CW/French counter-declaration and the USSR occupying East Poland.

But often Germany will declare war on Denmark and/or Yugoslavia and align Rumania and/or Hungary, and maybe even declare war on Netherlands - heck if the turn & weather cooperate, Belgium too. None of these are guaranteed chits but they might result in draws. In addition there is the possibility of chits gained or lost if Italy enters the war (either by going to war with, or being declared war on by, the CW and/or France, or some combination thereof).

In addition, the US is not likely to place all its drawn markers in the Ge/It entry pool each turn. If playing with the new Chinese cities there may be more opportunities to draw chits vs Japan when they occupy cities, but otherwise most chits drawn during the turn will be against Ge/It because they declare war on more powers, align more powers, and have more early-game effects (landing in UK, Allied minor support in Belgium or Yugo or Greece, conquering Suez, conquering or Vichying France, that sort of thing). So the US would expect to place some of the chits it draws at the end of the turn in the Japan pool.


You are correct but please note.

USA entry actions (this is a very simplified version due to the lack of importance at this time)

Note: The inclusion of the USA entry pools, USA tension pools, and USA entry levels are for reference only and are not to be considered as being advocated.

This was only included to see if it could be calculated when the USA player would be able to increase the USA tension pools to be able to increase production.


quote:

ORIGINAL: paulderynck
Neutral major powers can only save 1 oil per turn.


You would be correct (good call) except as composer99 Post #: 269 shows.

Option 14: Each oil marker you place on the map costs 1 build point. It is free to increase the value of the marker (up to their maximum value of 4 oil). Please note that this means it is in your interest not to use up that last barrel of oil in a particular hex if there is any other source of supply. Neutral major powers (like all others) may now save any number of oil per turn.


quote:

ORIGINAL: composer99
The other thing to note is about US entry.

The US cannot really plan ahead on US entry as it depends more on Axis and Allied activity than on the US' entry draws.

For example, in a minimal Sep/Oct 1939 the US has to plan to gain chits from a German declaration of war on Poland and lose chits from the CW/French counter-declaration and the USSR occupying East Poland.

But often Germany will declare war on Denmark and/or Yugoslavia and align Rumania and/or Hungary, and maybe even declare war on Netherlands - heck if the turn & weather cooperate, Belgium too. None of these are guaranteed chits but they might result in draws. In addition there is the possibility of chits gained or lost if Italy enters the war (either by going to war with, or being declared war on by, the CW and/or France, or some combination thereof).

In addition, the US is not likely to place all its drawn markers in the Ge/It entry pool each turn. If playing with the new Chinese cities there may be more opportunities to draw chits vs Japan when they occupy cities, but otherwise most chits drawn during the turn will be against Ge/It because they declare war on more powers, align more powers, and have more early-game effects (landing in UK, Allied minor support in Belgium or Yugo or Greece, conquering Suez, conquering or Vichying France, that sort of thing). So the US would expect to place some of the chits it draws at the end of the turn in the Japan pool.


And Japan will take Chinese cities. This is simplified situation so as not to cause too much chaos (we would "what if" forever otherwise).

It shows the basics of increasing USA entry pools, reducing the common entry marker pools, and how to calculate the USA tension pools.


quote:

ORIGINAL: paulderynck
Yes you can play with any part or all of an option as players may agree and most don't bother with the 1 BP per oil marker. Although essentially it would mean the US can spend a BP for every extra 4 oil they can save, which will turn into a lot more BPs down the road, but early on they'll suffer from under-producing. The problem is if they can choose the entry option for Resources to Western Allies fairly early - that's where all the extra oil ought to go, especially since it does not need convoys to get to Canada.


Excellent points. But don't forget oil intensive units when it comes to reorganization.

That's why buying an Oil marker is only listed as an option when you don't have to pay for a CVP. I didn't want to increase the Aircraft gearing limit so I suggested build something else. But remember if you don't have the storage the Oil cannot be saved.







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University of Science Music and Culture (USMC) class of 71 and 72 ~ Extraneous (AKA Mziln)

(in reply to paulderynck)
Post #: 271
RE: AI for MWiF - USA - 1/31/2013 10:17:19 PM   
Orm


Posts: 6110
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quote:

Option 14: Each oil marker you place on the map costs 1 build point. It is free to increase the value of the marker (up to their maximum value of 4 oil). Please note that this means it is in your interest not to use up that last barrel of oil in a particular hex if there is any other source of supply. Neutral major powers (like all others) may now save any number of oil per turn.

I belive that the cost for placing oil markers has been removed from RAW.

_____________________________

Ladies and Gentlemen, this is your Captain speaking. We have a small problem. All four engines have stopped. We are doing our damnedest to get them going again. I trust you are not in too much distress. - Captain Eric Moody

(in reply to Extraneous)
Post #: 272
RE: AI for MWiF - USA - 2/1/2013 12:05:44 AM   
Extraneous

 

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Joined: 6/14/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Orm

quote:

Option 14: Each oil marker you place on the map costs 1 build point. It is free to increase the value of the marker (up to their maximum value of 4 oil). Please note that this means it is in your interest not to use up that last barrel of oil in a particular hex if there is any other source of supply. Neutral major powers (like all others) may now save any number of oil per turn.

I belive that the cost for placing oil markers has been removed from RAW.


There is nothing on the AUSTRALIAN DESIGN GROUP WiF FE Rule Clarification Summary to that effect.

_____________________________

University of Science Music and Culture (USMC) class of 71 and 72 ~ Extraneous (AKA Mziln)

(in reply to Orm)
Post #: 273
RE: AI for MWiF - USA - 2/1/2013 12:19:12 AM   
Orm


Posts: 6110
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From: Sweden
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Extraneous


quote:

ORIGINAL: Orm

quote:

Option 14: Each oil marker you place on the map costs 1 build point. It is free to increase the value of the marker (up to their maximum value of 4 oil). Please note that this means it is in your interest not to use up that last barrel of oil in a particular hex if there is any other source of supply. Neutral major powers (like all others) may now save any number of oil per turn.

I belive that the cost for placing oil markers has been removed from RAW.


There is nothing on the AUSTRALIAN DESIGN GROUP WiF FE Rule Clarification Summary to that effect.

I can't make a rule reference to a rule that has been removed. So I suggest that you check RAW and make a search for option 14.

http://www.a-d-g.com.au/download/WiF-RaW-7-aug-04.zip
http://www.a-d-g.com.au/download/WiF-RaW-7-aug-04.doc

I could of course be wrong and I simply missed the rule and if so I am sorry. But if my memory serves that rule was changed long ago.

_____________________________

Ladies and Gentlemen, this is your Captain speaking. We have a small problem. All four engines have stopped. We are doing our damnedest to get them going again. I trust you are not in too much distress. - Captain Eric Moody

(in reply to Extraneous)
Post #: 274
RE: AI for MWiF - USA - 2/1/2013 3:52:43 AM   
composer99


Posts: 2243
Joined: 6/6/2005
From: Ottawa, Canada
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Orm


quote:

ORIGINAL: Extraneous


quote:

ORIGINAL: Orm

quote:

Option 14: Each oil marker you place on the map costs 1 build point. It is free to increase the value of the marker (up to their maximum value of 4 oil). Please note that this means it is in your interest not to use up that last barrel of oil in a particular hex if there is any other source of supply. Neutral major powers (like all others) may now save any number of oil per turn.

I belive that the cost for placing oil markers has been removed from RAW.


There is nothing on the AUSTRALIAN DESIGN GROUP WiF FE Rule Clarification Summary to that effect.

I can't make a rule reference to a rule that has been removed. So I suggest that you check RAW and make a search for option 14.

http://www.a-d-g.com.au/download/WiF-RaW-7-aug-04.zip
http://www.a-d-g.com.au/download/WiF-RaW-7-aug-04.doc

I could of course be wrong and I simply missed the rule and if so I am sorry. But if my memory serves that rule was changed long ago.


Maybe they're getting rid of it in RAW 8?

Anyway, I've tried to upload a screen capture of the most recent rules (RAW 7 with 2008 annual corrections) with the rule intact.





Attachment (1)

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(in reply to Orm)
Post #: 275
RE: AI for MWiF - USA - 2/1/2013 6:23:03 AM   
paulderynck


Posts: 4245
Joined: 3/24/2007
From: Canada
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RAW8 uses a completely different system for oil. You can still save it and indeed in RAW8 there is no BP cost to place a marker anymore.

It occurs to me the BP cost (which indeed is still in RAW7) - can really be gamed around especially for the USA and Russia. Put your 3 oil markers to start with as '1's in three separate hexes. You can store 9 more oil without paying a thing.

I don't think that the BP cost option is included in MWiF, however. Although Synthetic Oil facilities are included.


< Message edited by paulderynck -- 2/1/2013 6:32:59 AM >


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Post #: 276
RE: AI for MWiF - USA - 2/1/2013 6:29:49 PM   
Orm


Posts: 6110
Joined: 5/3/2008
From: Sweden
Status: offline
Thank you for correcting me.

I am sorry Extraneous. You are right and I was wrong. I hope I did not offend.

Keep up the good work.

_____________________________

Ladies and Gentlemen, this is your Captain speaking. We have a small problem. All four engines have stopped. We are doing our damnedest to get them going again. I trust you are not in too much distress. - Captain Eric Moody

(in reply to paulderynck)
Post #: 277
RE: AI for MWiF - USA - 2/1/2013 9:44:34 PM   
Extraneous

 

Posts: 1638
Joined: 6/14/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Orm

Thank you for correcting me.

I am sorry Extraneous. You are right and I was wrong. I hope I did not offend.

Keep up the good work.


No problem. I was under a little stress but after my Endoscopic (they send a camera down your throat) examination I have calmed down quite a bit.

Seams he has never seen a case of acid reflux as bad as mine. I was sleeping through acid reflux at night (that impressed the doctor).

More pills and must keep my head elevated 30 degrees when sleeping etc. I have another Endoscopic examination in 30 days (I'll try not to freak out again).

When the Chaplin from the Veterans Administration called to verify that I knew about My appointment I was seriously worried



< Message edited by Extraneous -- 2/1/2013 9:53:08 PM >


_____________________________

University of Science Music and Culture (USMC) class of 71 and 72 ~ Extraneous (AKA Mziln)

(in reply to Orm)
Post #: 278
RE: AI for MWiF - USA - 2/1/2013 10:01:43 PM   
michaelbaldur


Posts: 3745
Joined: 4/6/2007
From: denmark
Status: offline

the BP cost for saved oil is an option

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I work hard, not smart.

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(in reply to Extraneous)
Post #: 279
RE: AI for MWiF - USA - 2/4/2013 6:20:45 PM   
Edfactor


Posts: 98
Joined: 6/13/2008
From: Dallas
Status: offline
There is a version of Axis and Allies that you can play, it is called tripleA. The AI for the US will often build up large armies that it cannot transport. The US should be careful to maintain a balance unless it is being invaded of course. And for all nations the building of new ships should automatically stop 2 years before the game ends.

(in reply to michaelbaldur)
Post #: 280
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