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Oil problems....or not. What is going on???

 
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Oil problems....or not. What is going on??? - 4/26/2019 6:58:25 AM   
warspite1


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I don't know if I'll be able to re-create the problems being seen at the moment with saved oil - the problems are not consistent nor constant. But I will try and show screen by screen what I am seeing. It could be that at the end of it, all will work okay, but that is not the experience of either myself of Mayhemizer in our current game where Italy and Germany have been losing oil for no apparent reason.



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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 4/26/2019 1:50:13 PM >


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RE: Oil problems - 4/26/2019 7:40:33 AM   
warspite1


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Regardless of the fact that the production summary seems to be telling me I have only 4 oil in Berlin, the map tells me I have 7 there.

What I then want to achieve in the production stage is:

2 x Oil from Romania (both saved in Lodz)
2 x Oil from USSR (1 to production and 1 saved in Berlin)
1 x Oil from Austria (to Italy as part of the Trade Agreement)
1 x Oil from Germany (to production)

Note this turn I will need to use 4 oils.

So first things first, I need to amend the oil to fit the plan above.



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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 4/26/2019 12:32:52 PM >


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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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RE: Oil problems - 4/26/2019 12:27:10 PM   
warspite1


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Next I'll take a quick look at the Italians. They have 4 oil in place (note this said 3 initially in the Saved at Start section, but this as amended to 4). I have chosen to use the German traded oil in production. So the Italian oil is correct at 5 under control.




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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 4/26/2019 12:28:24 PM >


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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 3
RE: Oil problems - 4/26/2019 12:44:30 PM   
warspite1


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Next I need to use oil to reorganise. Annoyingly I need to use 4 oils as its a summer turn and I need everything available.

The form shows 10 oils available. That's the 9 saved last turn and also the Austrian oil which is being sent to Italy. I didn't think you could use traded oil that turn (which is why I assume the 2 x Romanian and 1 x Soviet oil saved this turn are not available).

But anyway, all looks good (Austrian oil clarification aside).




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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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RE: Oil problems - 4/26/2019 12:47:46 PM   
warspite1


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I want as few places to have to guard as possible so decide to use the Lodz saved oil as well as 2 from Berlin. Because I've expended more than 0.4 of an oil on the fourth saved oil, I will need to click Expend Oil Point.




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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 4/26/2019 12:49:16 PM >


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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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RE: Oil problems - 4/26/2019 12:52:22 PM   
warspite1


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I am in a similar position with Italy and have to spend two saved oil to reorganised all 1.9 points worth of units. Again I will need to press Expend Oil Point




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RE: Oil problems - 4/26/2019 12:59:29 PM   
warspite1


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So to finalise production and the Saved at Start is correct at 5. 7 in Berlin + 2 in Lodz less the 4 used to reorganise leaves 5 oil all in Berlin.

Clicking the Controlled button shows 8 i.e. the three saved have been added. I won't bother showing it but the same is true of Italy which has 2 saved at start and 3 now under control.




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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 4/26/2019 1:00:33 PM >


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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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RE: Oil problems - 4/26/2019 1:13:36 PM   
warspite1


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...and wouldn't you know. The oil is as it should be. So how did I end up with 1 oil in Berlin (and just 4 in total ) when I ran through production previously (see post 526 of the Minor Conflict AAR)?

Weird.... I think - as has been shown with undo's in the naval game, MWIF can be very temperamental.....




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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 4/26/2019 5:54:39 PM >


_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 8
RE: Oil problems - 4/29/2019 5:46:55 PM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

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It would have been useful information if you had shown the Main form for your screenshots. In which phase of the game were the first post's screenshots taken? Your text implies the current game phase for your later posts.

---

As you noted, trade agreements and using oil to reorganize units can affect saved oil. 'Control' is a tricky word here since does the major power sending the oil control it, or does the major power receiving it? The former chooses which specific oil point gets sent, while the later chooses what happens to it (where and saved or for production).

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Post #: 9
RE: Oil problems - 4/29/2019 6:39:51 PM   
warspite1


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IIRC the first pictures (post 1) are at Preliminary Production Planning stage, but BEFORE any changes to the resources and oil and whether saved or used in production.

The next pictures (post 2) are at the same stage but AFTER the various amendments to the resources and oil (in line with my stated aims at the top of that post).

_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 10
RE: Oil problems - 5/2/2019 5:58:58 AM   
warspite1


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Okay I've encountered more oil issues this turn so I'll do another run through. The law of sod being what it is there will probably be no issue again but lets see.....

_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 11
RE: Oil problems - 5/2/2019 6:12:48 AM   
warspite1


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First shot taken at HQ Reorganisation stage of Nov/Dec 1941 turn.




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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 5/2/2019 6:13:01 AM >


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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 12
RE: Oil problems - 5/2/2019 6:30:11 AM   
warspite1


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The next shot is taken at preliminary production planning before any action is taken.

The Saved at Start has reduced to 19 and, from running down the list, I can see the program has decided I have only two oil saved in Prague.

The program also thinks the Germans 'control' 22 Oil. These are the '19' saved and the three from Romania which are currently being saved (based on last turn's orders).

Not showing under Saved Oil Points as controlled are:
- The two trade from the USSR are showing as going to Production
- The German and Austrian Oil are still showing as Trade to Italy.

Again these are before any adjustment and so must simply reflect last turn orders (the Trade Agreement with Italy was reduced to 1 oil at the end of last turn).

Picture is after clicking the Controlled button:




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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 5/2/2019 6:31:02 AM >


_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 13
RE: Oil problems - 5/2/2019 6:33:45 AM   
warspite1


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So what are my orders for the Preliminary Production Stage?

Production Planning:
Germany

3 x Oil from Romania (2 saved in Berlin, 1 saved in Prague)
2 x Oil from USSR (both to production)
1 x Oil from Austria (Saved in Dresden).
1 x Oil from Germany (to Italy as part of existing trade agreement).
21 Build Points

Italy

1 x Oil from Germany (saved in Genoa)
9 Build Points.

Japan

12 Build Points


Just for information at this stage, I intend to use no oil with any of the three nations and so at the start of next turn:

- The Germans will have 24 Oil (increased by 3 Romanian and 1 Austrian oil)
- The Italians will have 13 Oil (increased by the 1 trade from Germany)
- The Japanese will remain on 16 Oil

< Message edited by warspite1 -- 5/2/2019 6:37:25 AM >


_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 14
RE: Oil problems - 5/2/2019 6:49:24 AM   
warspite1


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So in line with the above in preliminary planning I amend the oils.

In the top picture we can see the Trade rec'd from the USSR going to production and the 1 Trade sent (from Germany) going to the Italians. The three Romanian oil and the Austrian oil is being saved.

Also note that now the Saved at Start has moved to the 20 it should have been showing all along - and the Controlled has also increased by 1. A look at the bottom picture shows the reason for the increase - the 3rd Prague oil, oddly missing from before, has now appeared.

At this stage Controlled has not increased to 24 (remember the Austrian Oil is now saved) but this may be because this is still preliminary planning.




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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 5/2/2019 6:55:07 AM >


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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 15
RE: Oil problems - 5/2/2019 7:03:29 AM   
warspite1


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The Italian oil is correctly showing as 12 Saved at Start, but Controlled shows 14. I assumed this was because the Italians were getting 2 oil from the Trade Agreement with Germany and perhaps, until preliminary planning is over, the program had not updated. However under Oil Resources, the Trade Received has already been reduced to 1 so the difference seems strange. Furthermore the detail shows 13 oil (correctly).

Finally, note that the location for the Traded oil is now changed to Genoa as per the plan.




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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 5/2/2019 7:04:50 AM >


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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 16
RE: Oil problems - 5/2/2019 7:06:20 AM   
warspite1


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Japan is nice and simple. They are receiving no oil. So the Saved at Start is correct at 16, as is the Controlled figure.




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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 5/2/2019 7:09:05 AM >


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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 17
RE: Oil problems - 5/2/2019 7:27:43 AM   
warspite1


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So I go through the phases and spend just 0.4 on oil reorganisation for each of the powers. I do a quick check to ensure that none of the numbers have changed since preliminary planning and that all orders remain in place e.g. Austrian oil to Dresden, the Ploesti oils are being saved in Berlin (2) and Prague (1), German oil to Genoa.

All is as it was.

So I move the turn on to Jan/Feb 1942 and......

For the second time, the oils are where they should be!!! an oil in Dresden and an oil in Genoa. No overstacking in Lodz....

This is weird. Perhaps I am moving too fast when running through initially and when I come to write down step by step, I am not missing something I appear to have done before. After doing what I thought was exactly the same steps previously, there were 5 oils in Rome (and none in Genoa) and I had to destroy a Lodz oil that jumped from 3 to 5.....

But as another check, AllenK is independently inputting my orders and it will be interesting to see where the oils end up.





< Message edited by warspite1 -- 5/2/2019 7:47:23 AM >


_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 18
RE: Oil problems - 5/3/2019 3:19:10 PM   
warspite1


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So having got the game back to start the next turn I see the Germans appear to now have 25 oil and not 24....

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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 19
RE: Oil problems - 5/4/2019 5:52:27 AM   
warspite1


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Back to the game with Mayhemizer. CURRENTLY IN DRAFT

It's Jul/Aug 1940 End of Turn. These are the instructions to be followed:

So looking at Preliminary Production BEFORE any actions taken, the Saved At Start this time is actually correct as I do have 8 saved - 4 in Berlin and 4 in Lodz. This is the first time I've seen the German oil correct in this way - but that's a good start.

There is 1 oil going to Italy as per the trade agreement, I am using 2 oil in production and 3 are being saved.




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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 5/4/2019 6:02:44 AM >


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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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RE: Oil problems - 5/4/2019 6:09:25 AM   
warspite1


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I amended the Armavir Oil to 'Saved' in case I could keep the same production points, but there was a drop to 14 so I switch the Armavir traded oil back to production. So the plan is for:

2 x Oil from Romania (both saved in Berlin)
2 x Oil from USSR (1 to production and 1 saved in Berlin)
1 x Oil from Germany (to Italy as part of the Trade Agreement)
1 x Oil from Austria (to production)

At this stage I don't know how many oil I will need to use in the reorganisation phase but that is not important. The important thing is to know where the oil is, what it's doing, and what the effect should be.

The oil situation BEFORE reorganisation should be 7 oil in Berlin and 4 in Lodz.

Note: The Armavir oil is put back to production after looking to see the effect of saving.



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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 5/4/2019 6:12:19 AM >


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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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RE: Oil problems - 5/4/2019 6:15:40 AM   
warspite1


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Italy is more problematic and is frankly a total mess. Currently showing on map are 4 saved in Milan. I believe that Italy should have 5 oil but I want to avoid anymore editing so I will suck that loss up to try and avoid yet more problems.

So we shall assume the game is correct to say there are 4 oils in Italy. However the Saved at Start indicator suggests there are only two and, only with the two being saved this turn, do the Italians get back to 4.

I will follow this through and see where we end up. The amendments I make in preliminary planning is to save these two oils in Turin (second picture).



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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 5/4/2019 8:59:06 AM >


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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 22
RE: Oil problems - 5/4/2019 8:51:20 AM   
warspite1


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Again a look before I make any amendments.

The Japanese have the right number of oils both on map and in the Saved at Start section - 12. The starting locations are not where I put them, but again, we can ignore that for now. The Controlled number (14) includes two oils from trade that I've saved previously.

The program seems to have a hard-on for Ominato for some reason. So in the second picture I amend these to Nagoya. But otherwise I keep as is with the 4 Traded oils being split equally between saved and production.




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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 5/4/2019 9:06:27 AM >


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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 23
RE: Oil problems - 5/4/2019 9:47:25 AM   
warspite1


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Right so the German position post preliminary production was

7 - Berlin and 4 - Lodz

I expended 2 oil for reorganisation so should have 9 oil.

So at finalisation stage this is what is showing; 6 oil Saved at Start plus the three traded oil saved this turn = 9 Controlled.

5 - Berlin and 4 - Lodz




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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 5/4/2019 9:48:20 AM >


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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 24
RE: Oil problems - 5/4/2019 9:52:40 AM   
warspite1


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Ignoring the oil Italy has lost previously, the Italian position at the same stage looks correct.

4 oil saved in Milan + 2 oils saved this turn less 1 oil expended on reorganisation. Controlled is now 3 in Milan and 2 in Turin.




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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 25
RE: Oil problems - 5/4/2019 9:55:36 AM   
warspite1


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Finally Japan too has the right number. 12 Saved at Start, 2 saved this turn and none expended. The oil from the NEI has been saved to Nagoya.




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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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