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Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR

 
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Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 12/9/2018 12:49:27 PM   
Big Ivan


Posts: 610
Joined: 6/9/2008
From: Mansfield, OH
Status: offline
Hello TotH Family,

Below is screen shot #1 of Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead. As you can see I easily got across the canal and
eliminated a Russian squad and broke the leader stacked with him.

This scenario is being played with normal difficulty using the new 1.1.20 executable.






Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Big Ivan -- 1/3/2019 10:45:38 AM >


_____________________________

Blitz call sign Ivan the Big.
Post #: 1
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 12/9/2018 5:35:54 PM   
Big Ivan


Posts: 610
Joined: 6/9/2008
From: Mansfield, OH
Status: offline
Hello TotH Family,

Below is screen shot #2 showing the second group of Germans crossing the canal in Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead. However this crossing was a bit more difficult
as Russian defensive fire did break some German troops who subsequently had to rout. However I did get some squads
across the canal after eliminating 1 Russian squad.






Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Big Ivan -- 1/3/2019 10:51:26 AM >


_____________________________

Blitz call sign Ivan the Big.

(in reply to Big Ivan)
Post #: 2
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/3/2019 7:08:06 PM   
Big Ivan


Posts: 610
Joined: 6/9/2008
From: Mansfield, OH
Status: offline
Hello TotH Family,

Screen shot below is end of Advance Phase German Turn 2.

As a reminder this AAR is being played on normal difficulty using the 1.1.20 executable.

The Germans continue their advance indicated by the yellow arrows. Unfortunately the SPW 251/1 was stunned.
Then recovered. Then went from BU to CE only to be buttoned up again after Russian defensive fire. Got a feeling
that will be the norm for that halftrack in this game. Bad news for the one German MMG. It malfunctioned in the
prep fire phase. Hope to get it back soon but usually that can take a long time if ever.

Two more Russian squads were broken this turn along with 2 half squads eliminated due to German fire.

The object is to get to the near bank of the Vistula River to claim victory. Have a strong feeling there is
concealed Russian squads and leaders unseen but blocking my advance nonetheless. Time will tell what is
lurking out there...







Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Blitz call sign Ivan the Big.

(in reply to Big Ivan)
Post #: 3
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/4/2019 12:29:49 AM   
Hailstone


Posts: 272
Joined: 1/19/2016
From: Phoenix, AZ
Status: offline
I hate halftracks.

(in reply to Big Ivan)
Post #: 4
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/5/2019 12:03:55 PM   
Big Ivan


Posts: 610
Joined: 6/9/2008
From: Mansfield, OH
Status: offline
Hello TotH Family,

First off I hear you Hailstone. Halftracks are not worth much but they are kinda fun to look at.

Screen shot below is German end of Advance Phase Turn 3.

Yellow arrows indicate the axis of advance of my German troops. I decided to move the malfunctioned MMG and the
good order HMG across the canal in preparation for the battle ahead. The "red" stars indicate where a Russian
8-0 Leader and 1st Line Squad were surrounded and eliminated due to failure to rout. The way ahead on this portion of
the map looks pretty clear. However I am taking notice of the lone Russian 1st Line half-squad in the wood building
rubble at the near bank of the Vistula river. Hopefully its not a prelude to a stronger force awaiting me there!






Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Blitz call sign Ivan the Big.

(in reply to Hailstone)
Post #: 5
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/5/2019 12:18:29 PM   
Big Ivan


Posts: 610
Joined: 6/9/2008
From: Mansfield, OH
Status: offline
Hello TotH Family,

Below is screen shot #2 showing the bottom portion of my map. It is the end of the German Advance Phase Turn 3.

As you can see a different picture is painted as there are few Russian 1st Line squads in the area. Yellow arrows
indicate the axis of advance of my German troops. This turn I decided to move my SPW 251/1 halftrack across the
canal in the hope it will have some better luck and not get buttoned up all the time due to Russian fire attacks.
The "red" arrows from across the canal indicate my preparatory fires in the Prep Fire Phase. The other red arrows
on the Russian side of the canal indicate my Advancing Fires in order to DM Russian squads already broken. I'm a bit
uneasy in this area of the battle unlike in the previous screen shot because there is a substantial Russian presence
here. Again I hope its not a prelude to a larger Russian force lurking in the shadows. Only time will tell...






Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Blitz call sign Ivan the Big.

(in reply to Big Ivan)
Post #: 6
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/5/2019 1:19:34 PM   
UP844


Posts: 1248
Joined: 3/3/2016
From: Genoa, Republic of Genoa (occupied by Italy)
Status: online
Hello Big Ivan, nice AAR!

Am I allowed to make a couple remarks?

What's the purpose of firing the HMG to the Russian squad 7 hexes away? It won't fire at your HMG, and you lose an opportunity to move towards the exit hexes. It can move north-east at double time rate, and then to advance into the hex hust west of the bridge (blue arrows). The Russian squad in the building on the other side of the river, if not broken by fire from the 8-1 stack, will deliver a 4FP attack with a +2 DRM, which will require a roll of 5 or less (27% chance to get a possibly effective hit; the squad morale level is 7, so you have a 58% chance to pass a MC or TC. Your chance to move without suffering any adverse effect should be around 85%.

As for the 8-1 leader stack, it has two options:
a) firing on the Russian squad and wait for the HMG stack, which can reach it moving at double time rate; the new stack can then advance in the hex just west of the bridge, moving 1 hex closer to the exit hexes. The Russian squad will not fire at this hex, since it is 5 hexes away, beyond its normal range.
b) moving along the path highlighted by the magenta arrow: the Russian squad won't fire as you cross the bridge (see above) and you will be able to set up a perfect fire lane down the road and to fire with a -3 DRM on any Russian crossing the road in their next Movement Segment.




Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Chasing Germans in the moonlight is no mean sport

Siegfried Sassoon

Long Range Fire (A7.22)........1/2 FP

(in reply to Big Ivan)
Post #: 7
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/5/2019 3:00:48 PM   
Big Ivan


Posts: 610
Joined: 6/9/2008
From: Mansfield, OH
Status: offline
Hi UP844!

Hey thanks for the in depth analysis. Two heads are better than one!

I never thought about what you are offering.
Sometimes "Old Habits" from my ASL days long ago rear their ugly heads. I'm always afraid of being fired at in the
open while moving to the point I sometimes miss great opportunities. I was gun shy in ASL and I think its showing here.
One thing I am not sure of is will the A/I fire at my troops moving in the open at long range? I would do that in ASL but maybe
I give the A/I to much credit here in TotH.

My thought was if I could break the Russian squad with the MMG 7 hexes away it would be all the better to move in my next turn.
I do have 10 turns (7 remaining) to get to the near bank of the Vistula so I'm not pressed for time yet. But I may come to regret
saying that with only 3 turns remaining.

One thing did come to mind after seeing your post ( and I thank you for that) was getting the German MMG and HMG up with Leaders.
The HMG can be especially effective when directed by a Leader.

OK in my next turn I will give your advice a chance and see what happens. The only bad thing is I could get my fanny shot off.
But what the hell, live and learn.

Thanks again UP844!!

John

_____________________________

Blitz call sign Ivan the Big.

(in reply to UP844)
Post #: 8
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/5/2019 3:06:11 PM   
Hailstone


Posts: 272
Joined: 1/19/2016
From: Phoenix, AZ
Status: offline
UP844, I agree the HMG did not have to fire but its hard to give up an opportunity to stick it to the enemy.
Besides, Big Ivan is only on turn 3 of 10 so there's plenty of time for the exit but I also believe it's a good idea
for Big Ivan to keep his troops consolidated rather than send off an HMG stack to exit on its own. That's a lot
of firepower that can be used to get the rest of the Germans out. And, let's not forget what's written in the
scenario description, there's still the Home Army Patriots to contend with as the Germans move pass the
initial defenders of the crossing. The Home Army Patriots historically held the German onslaught temporarily
until the very end with no survivors as their Russian allies left them to deal with the Germans alone. They
are out there.

(in reply to UP844)
Post #: 9
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/5/2019 4:04:29 PM   
UP844


Posts: 1248
Joined: 3/3/2016
From: Genoa, Republic of Genoa (occupied by Italy)
Status: online
@ Big Ivan:

The very first time I played SL back in the late 1970s, I thought "What the hell, I just have to cross the road to come adjacent to those few Germans who survived the deadly Prep Fire of my Guards and kill them in Close Combat". Then I discovered how much a -2 DRM could be deadly.

The ToTH AI, however, is much less trigger-happy than the average bloodthirsty ASL player: squads will not fire at long range, so you can freely move in the open in front of the whole Red Army, as long as you remain at least 5 hexes away (6 if the Russians are Guards units).

This is NOT true of MMGs and HMGs, which WILL fire even at long range in the Movement Segment of the opposite side (and, as we all know all too well, a few FP with a negative DRM are much deadlier than a lot of FP with a positive one). AFVs, ordnance and light mortars (i.e. units requiring a to-hit roll) will also fire as soon as they spot you, regardless of the range. I am not sure about AFV MGs, since they are quite long ranged anyway, but I assume they will fire (AI tank crews appear to be more aggressive than the poor bloody infantry).

The AI also seems to be reluctant to fire when it has a small chance to achieve a possibly effective result (this is why I suggested moving the HMG in the stone house even though it was exposed to possible fire from the Russian squad on the other side of the river). I have not yet investigated this aspect in depth, however.

P.S. Besides the leadership DRM, keeping MMGs and HMGs stacked with a leader gives you a 2 MF bonus, that allows them to keep the pace of the rest of your infantry: when this is not possible (as it is often the case with Russians) MMGs and HMGs tend to remain in the rear and play a minor role in an engagement as they struggle to join the fight.

@ Hailstone:

Since this is a breakthrough scenario, killing enemy units not directly preventing you to advance should not be a priority, especially when it means losing an opportunity to move.

I usually prefer to make maximum use of the Movement Segment to gain favourable positions, and the to deliver fire in the opponent's turn, when I can't do anything else anyway (preferably, with the enemy moving to close with my units and an extra -1 FFNAM).

As for the Home Army units, this is just another reason to keep the German units together and not letting any of them behind to fight units that cannot possibly hinder the German advance.



_____________________________

Chasing Germans in the moonlight is no mean sport

Siegfried Sassoon

Long Range Fire (A7.22)........1/2 FP

(in reply to Hailstone)
Post #: 10
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/8/2019 3:55:15 PM   
Big Ivan


Posts: 610
Joined: 6/9/2008
From: Mansfield, OH
Status: offline
Hello TotH Family,

Below is the first screen shot at end of German Advance Phase Turn 4. It is the top part of the battle map.

I was able to move all my troops up on the top portion of them map w/o any return fire from the Russians. Yellow
arrows indicate my direction of movement. I was able to spot some more Russian half squads in and around the near
bank of the Vistula River. I'm assuming these are the Polish home guard discussed in the briefing.






Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Big Ivan -- 1/8/2019 3:57:27 PM >


_____________________________

Blitz call sign Ivan the Big.

(in reply to UP844)
Post #: 11
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/8/2019 4:10:15 PM   
Big Ivan


Posts: 610
Joined: 6/9/2008
From: Mansfield, OH
Status: offline
Hello TotH Family,

Below is the second screen shot at end of German Advance Phase Turn 4. It is the bottom part of the battle map.

Yellow arrows indicate my direction of movement. I took UP844 advice and moved my troops from the opposite side of
the canal across the bridge and started heading for the Vistula River. The only fire I received was from the lone
Russian squad indicate by the red line. The fire was no effect against my German crew with MMG. The other Russian
half squad "Red Star" location succumbed to German fire oddly enough during the Advancing Fire Phase.

However, I'm still uneasy about this area as during the Russian Turn 3 I did catch a glimpse of 3 Russian squads and
a 9-1 Leader just off the map to the bottom. They quickly scurried out of my sight during the Russian Advance
Phase Turn 3. What could the A/I be up to I wonder!?








Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Blitz call sign Ivan the Big.

(in reply to Big Ivan)
Post #: 12
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/8/2019 6:25:37 PM   
UP844


Posts: 1248
Joined: 3/3/2016
From: Genoa, Republic of Genoa (occupied by Italy)
Status: online
You are almost there! A couple turns and your units can begin to exit the map (and earn VPs).

quote:

ORIGINAL: Big Ivan
However, I'm still uneasy about this area as during the Russian Turn 3 I did catch a glimpse of 3 Russian squads and a 9-1 Leader just off the map to the bottom. They quickly scurried out of my sight during the Russian Advance Phase Turn 3. What could the A/I be up to I wonder!?


I think they were moving to the closer Exit hex on the Vistula bank; since there are no VP hexes in this scenario, they have no reason to move north. If they move north, anyway, your units are well placed to welcome them with a hail of bullets.

In a situation like this, I usually send a single squad (moving Double Time, so that it moves as if it had a leader) to scout ahead, then I follow with the rest of my force.


_____________________________

Chasing Germans in the moonlight is no mean sport

Siegfried Sassoon

Long Range Fire (A7.22)........1/2 FP

(in reply to Big Ivan)
Post #: 13
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/10/2019 5:39:59 PM   
Big Ivan


Posts: 610
Joined: 6/9/2008
From: Mansfield, OH
Status: offline
Hello TotH Family,

Screen shot below is of the top side of the map.

Very quiet turn as the A/I let me move forward unscathed. That was a blessing in disguise! I did manage
to locate some of the Home Army troops guarding the entrance to the main bridge. Odd placement for them
is my thought.






Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Blitz call sign Ivan the Big.

(in reply to UP844)
Post #: 14
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/10/2019 9:29:06 PM   
UP844


Posts: 1248
Joined: 3/3/2016
From: Genoa, Republic of Genoa (occupied by Italy)
Status: online
Am I allowed to make a remark? Why do you leave the MGs at the rear? German MMGs cost no MF loss to carry and HMGs only cost 1 MF loss.

_____________________________

Chasing Germans in the moonlight is no mean sport

Siegfried Sassoon

Long Range Fire (A7.22)........1/2 FP

(in reply to Big Ivan)
Post #: 15
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/11/2019 1:01:50 AM   
Big Ivan


Posts: 610
Joined: 6/9/2008
From: Mansfield, OH
Status: offline
I guess I haven't absorbed the rule book to total memory like you have UP844. Remember TotH is not my primary go to game.
John Tillers Campaign Series and Campaign Series Middle East are my go to games. What I'm trying to accomplish
here is maybe bringing some new players sitting on the fence a chance to dive in the pool and experience Tigers on the Hunt
from a different perspective of an old ASL player like me. After all, its based heavily on ASL or did I miss something?

A comfortable AAR that they can read on their leisure without a lot of technical analysis is and was my goal in writing these AAR's.

I noticed over the last few months that there isn't a lot of new activity on this forum from new players coming forth to
experience TotH. Seems to me to be the same old guard set in their same old ways giving analysis, opinions or searching for bug
fixes of what the game ought to be or not be. Beyond that we have a select few cranking out scenarios at an alarming rate which
can play wildly different at each go around. There is no real discussion by the TotH family as to what is being cranked out or tested in the
individuals home, office or study. Its all trial and error in someone's perspective. Talk about a disconnect...

What's written on paper in ASL doesn't necessarily transfer well to TotH. We ALL must accept that!

So be it, doesn't make a whole lot of difference to me. I can take it or leave it, its all the same to me. I have the Campaign Series to go back to.

As long as TotH has one programmer, who has another day job, and doesn't have the time or
a team of developers like Campaign Series behind them, you won't see a lot of giant leaps forward.

Just saying...

_____________________________

Blitz call sign Ivan the Big.

(in reply to UP844)
Post #: 16
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/11/2019 9:52:20 AM   
rico21

 

Posts: 2365
Joined: 3/11/2016
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Well, that is game which go with giant leaps forward in the bay of pigs.

(in reply to Big Ivan)
Post #: 17
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/12/2019 4:29:49 PM   
Big Ivan


Posts: 610
Joined: 6/9/2008
From: Mansfield, OH
Status: offline
Hello TotH Family,

Fast forward screen shot below is end of Russian Turn 10 CC Phase. Achieved a Major Victory for the Germans with
18 points, nine squads exited. Moved pretty much down the center of the map unopposed eliminating a couple of
Russian defensive pockets in the process. Got to the river and started exiting squads.

Nice scenario Hailstone I enjoyed it! I played it on Norman Difficulty but it probably would have been a lot different
if I played it on Very Hard Difficulty. The out of command function can put a "kibosh" on ones plans if your not
real careful. I found the Russians rather subdued in this one. I thought maybe the A/I would try "Concentration of Force"
at the Vistula River edge but that never happened. Maybe I expected to much from the A/I. This scenario might be real good
head-to-head or maybe one day I'll try it as the Russians.

Cheers All!

Big Ivan






Attachment (1)

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Blitz call sign Ivan the Big.

(in reply to rico21)
Post #: 18
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/12/2019 7:54:00 PM   
Hailstone


Posts: 272
Joined: 1/19/2016
From: Phoenix, AZ
Status: offline
Big Ivan, it sounds like it went historically for you with just enough resistance to keep you from just walking down the streets in a one-sided situation.
If you recall from the scenario description, the Home Army Patriots did not survive to try to stop the Germans.


I have to add that trying to port over a scenario that's meant for two humans is a challenge to do the scenario justice but what can you do? I start out
by trying to recreate a scenario exactly as designed but playtesting has constantly proven that the attacker has a major advantage in TotH because
the AI is no true substitution for a human. I wind up trying to compensate by adding a squad or two here and a leader there to create more of a challenge
without changing the scenario much. So, thanks for the feedback.

(in reply to Big Ivan)
Post #: 19
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/13/2019 1:03:47 PM   
Big Ivan


Posts: 610
Joined: 6/9/2008
From: Mansfield, OH
Status: offline
Your quite welcome Hailstone, the pleasure was mine!

Good point, the A/I is OK but its not human by any stretch of the imagination.

If I get the chance I'd like to try it again as the Russians and see how the A/I handles the Germans.
I'm not expecting much because the A/I does fairly lousy on the attack, but who knows I have been surprised
sometimes with this game.

Take Care!

John

_____________________________

Blitz call sign Ivan the Big.

(in reply to Hailstone)
Post #: 20
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/13/2019 6:38:40 PM   
UP844


Posts: 1248
Joined: 3/3/2016
From: Genoa, Republic of Genoa (occupied by Italy)
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: Big Ivan
If I get the chance I'd like to try it again as the Russians and see how the A/I handles the Germans.


Very bad.

The screenshot is taken at the start of Turn 5 - Russian.




Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Chasing Germans in the moonlight is no mean sport

Siegfried Sassoon

Long Range Fire (A7.22)........1/2 FP

(in reply to Big Ivan)
Post #: 21
RE: Hailstone's Czerniakow Bridgehead Scenario AAR - 1/13/2019 7:34:27 PM   
Big Ivan


Posts: 610
Joined: 6/9/2008
From: Mansfield, OH
Status: offline
Well scratch that idea!

_____________________________

Blitz call sign Ivan the Big.

(in reply to UP844)
Post #: 22
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