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Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/11/2018 2:44:44 PM   
Searry

 

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I've been waiting for this year's voucher and been looking at this game.
What resources are recommended to read and learn etc? These GG games are always very complex so I expect there are some good resources somewhere.
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RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/11/2018 2:48:44 PM   
Jorge_Stanbury


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start with the manual

(in reply to Searry)
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RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/11/2018 3:03:45 PM   
Lecivius


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And look through the AAR's. Find an old one that went through the entire game, and read through it. It will give you great ideas on what to expect.

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RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/11/2018 3:23:15 PM   
GetAssista

 

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Sardaukar's newbie AAR is a great place to start http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2564541

But be warned, there is no learning curve. Instead, there is a never-ending learning cliff. So plan accordingly

(in reply to Lecivius)
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RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/11/2018 3:51:49 PM   
mind_messing

 

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Once you're done with the manual, this works as a good reference. The real gold is in the linked comments:

www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2260137

Andy Mac's AAR is well worth reading, even if it isn't the most palatable format, as he was on the development team and has some great insights into the working of the game overall.

Lowpe's first AAR is great, as you can follow misconceptions and how to fix them.

Mike Solli's AAR is a good primer for Japanese industry.

Play the game and search the forums. The search function on the forum isn't the most user friendly, but there's a pretty good response rate on the forums to posts asking questions.

(in reply to Searry)
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RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/11/2018 6:21:14 PM   
rustysi


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Here's one I like for when you get ready to try Japan. Not necessarily recommended for a new player, unless you're a real masochist. Although you may still find it to be an interest read.

Suggest you try the Allies first.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3329605#

See the attachment in the first post.

_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to mind_messing)
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RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/12/2018 2:33:55 PM   
Searry

 

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Thanks for the suggestions! The manual is obvious but how outdated is it?
I fully expect needlessly detailed and complicated features but aren't those the point of these GG games?

< Message edited by Searry -- 10/12/2018 2:35:05 PM >

(in reply to rustysi)
Post #: 7
RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/12/2018 2:47:20 PM   
btd64


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Searry

Thanks for the suggestions! The manual is obvious but how outdated is it?
I fully expect needlessly detailed and complicated features but aren't those the point of these GG games?


You'll need to read all of the Readme files as well. That will help catch you up on manual stuff....GP

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RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/12/2018 6:07:04 PM   
rustysi


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quote:

The manual is obvious but how outdated is it?


It may not have every little nuance of the game included, but is still required reading, and is accurate for what it includes.

_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to btd64)
Post #: 9
RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/12/2018 9:30:01 PM   
dasboot1960


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You may see some things... If you go down the rabbit hole following check this check that references - always check the dates. I have seen some that no longer apply, as an example, ASW TFs not reacting to subs - they do. There are also suggested merchant setups for IJ shipping back to home islands that do not indicate how temporary or intermittent they may be. I mean no disrespect to all of the people who's references I have filched. I didn't always check the dates as I copied, pasted and printed. This is the game you want to play if you want your head so far up the pacific you are not sure how you got there.

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Down like a CLOWN!

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RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/13/2018 2:06:56 PM   
m10bob


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youtube hhas many film clips concerning this game and you can learn things by watching.

I learned the game by starting a turn...going a couple of turns and then starting all over again when I learned something I had been missing all along.
The game itself is VERY forgiving as it will allow you to play without doing everything you might in each turn.

Return to these forums and ask questions.

Many good people here will respond. We want to help you.

Have a great time and welcome to the Pacific.

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Post #: 11
RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/13/2018 6:02:22 PM   
wegman58

 

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In THE WAR ROOM there is a newbie thread - go there.

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RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/17/2018 7:15:55 PM   
rustysi


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quote:

I have seen some that no longer apply, as an example, ASW TFs not reacting to subs - they do.


This has been beaten to death lately. They do not react. They simply will follow a sub that intersects their path. You'll see no attacks while this goes on.

quote:

We want to help you.


Yeah, fresh meat.

_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to wegman58)
Post #: 13
RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/17/2018 8:38:15 PM   
dasboot1960


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I beg to differ rustysi
(but please don't stop responding to my questions!)
I've repeatedly seen "task force xyz (my asw) reacting to task force abc (yankee sub)". I mean what else could it be? I don't know the actual TF# of the subs, but they're the only thing spotted and my asw moves right on top.

< Message edited by dasboot1960 -- 10/17/2018 8:57:26 PM >


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Down like a CLOWN!

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RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/17/2018 10:13:34 PM   
rustysi


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quote:

ORIGINAL: dasboot1960

I beg to differ rustysi
(but please don't stop responding to my questions!)
I've repeatedly seen "task force xyz (my asw) reacting to task force abc (yankee sub)". I mean what else could it be? I don't know the actual TF# of the subs, but they're the only thing spotted and my asw moves right on top.


I know what it says, and what you think, but it does nothing other than follow. In addition from my limited testing it does in fact seem that this occurs when one TF intersects with the other.

The Devs have explicitly stated that there's no code to allow ASW TF's to 'react' to subs. Now, could it be that the normal naval 'react' routine is responding in some fashion in this instance. Who knows? I spent an entire career in computers/electronics and have seen tons of unsuspected results when it comes to code, so...

Also, I would never stop responding to your questions just because you disagree with me. Although at some point on a subject I may say I'm done. With this particular topic I am in fact done.

BTW some of the discussions on this were pretty recent, and you could probably find them with a search.


_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to dasboot1960)
Post #: 15
RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/18/2018 3:08:05 AM   
geofflambert


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A "learning cliff". I like that. Today I heard someone talk about a "calculated mistake". I love that concept. All mistakes should be calculated.

(in reply to GetAssista)
Post #: 16
RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/18/2018 6:56:25 AM   
Zorch

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

A "learning cliff". I like that. Today I heard someone talk about a "calculated mistake". I love that concept. All mistakes should be calculated.

There is a calculated risk of falling off the learning curve into the abyss of ignorance.

(in reply to geofflambert)
Post #: 17
RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/18/2018 7:04:27 AM   
Sardaukar


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I started a new AAR, now more up to date with stuff. Lot of things have changed since my previous one.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4542674

Hopefully some will fing my "insight" useful

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Post #: 18
RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/18/2018 1:50:59 PM   
BBfanboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: rustysi


quote:

ORIGINAL: dasboot1960

I beg to differ rustysi
(but please don't stop responding to my questions!)
I've repeatedly seen "task force xyz (my asw) reacting to task force abc (yankee sub)". I mean what else could it be? I don't know the actual TF# of the subs, but they're the only thing spotted and my asw moves right on top.


I know what it says, and what you think, but it does nothing other than follow. In addition from my limited testing it does in fact seem that this occurs when one TF intersects with the other.

The Devs have explicitly stated that there's no code to allow ASW TF's to 'react' to subs. Now, could it be that the normal naval 'react' routine is responding in some fashion in this instance. Who knows? I spent an entire career in computers/electronics and have seen tons of unsuspected results when it comes to code, so...

Also, I would never stop responding to your questions just because you disagree with me. Although at some point on a subject I may say I'm done. With this particular topic I am in fact done.

BTW some of the discussions on this were pretty recent, and you could probably find them with a search.


After some back-and-forth discussion the conclusion was that the developers had not completed the "react" code for ASW to include finding and attacking a sub. They get a D/L on the sub and move to the next hex looking for it, but that is it. So it just depend on how you define "react", and Alfred made clear that a true "react" script includes attacking, so officially it is not a react.

No need to argue on semantics, just know that your ASW is not going to attack that turn based on the partial code that sends it chasing the sub D/L.

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to rustysi)
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RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/18/2018 2:33:53 PM   
oaltinyay


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quote:

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

A "learning cliff". I like that. Today I heard someone talk about a "calculated mistake". I love that concept. All mistakes should be calculated.

By definition that is NOT a mistake. Sorry. Maybe in "Gornia"

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RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/18/2018 4:20:55 PM   
BBfanboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: oaltinyay


quote:

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

A "learning cliff". I like that. Today I heard someone talk about a "calculated mistake". I love that concept. All mistakes should be calculated.

By definition that is NOT a mistake. Sorry. Maybe in "Gornia"

Obviously, you are just misundercalculating the Gorn's meaning...

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to oaltinyay)
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RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/18/2018 5:46:26 PM   
Zorch

 

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Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: oaltinyay


quote:

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

A "learning cliff". I like that. Today I heard someone talk about a "calculated mistake". I love that concept. All mistakes should be calculated.

By definition that is NOT a mistake. Sorry. Maybe in "Gornia"

Obviously, you are just misundercalculating the Gorn's meaning...

Is 'Gornia' anything like like Narnia?

(in reply to BBfanboy)
Post #: 22
RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/18/2018 10:26:57 PM   
rustysi


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quote:

Is 'Gornia' anything like like Narnia?






_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to Zorch)
Post #: 23
RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/19/2018 7:09:35 AM   
Barb


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Well I would like to introduce a new word for ASW and SUB "TRACK" instead of "React".

Based on how both routines work, i would say it is the same... and it more closely resembles tracking then real reaction.

E.G.:
1. "Convoy" stumbles on a sub hex (say convoy, it could be any TF)
2. Sub can detect, or even attack
3. Regardless of outcome, the convoy continues to next hex
4. Several rolls later (Sub leader, aggression, damage, speed, ammo, detection etc.) the sub CAN TRACK (or follow) the contact to the next hex
5. Routine from point 2. is repeated
- you wont see sub steaming a hex out of its patrol zone without contact!
- Sub has to have Patrol orders (so the TRACK routine could happen on way to-from the patrol area)

Same with the ASW vs Sub.
1. Sub and ASW meets at certain hex. Of course Sub wish to evade, while ASW trying to contact
2. they could miss each other, raise DL, attack one another
3. sub moves to the next hex on patrol
4. Several rolls later (ASW TF leader stats, DL, etc) the ASW TF can TRACK the sub to the next hex
5. Routine from point 2. is repeated.
- as ASW is usually faster then sub, you can see it follow the sub several hexes away during the same night/day phase.
- Each time they occupy same hex they will try to interact based on rolls (evade, detect, sub attack, asw attack)

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RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/19/2018 11:33:49 AM   
oaltinyay


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Searry

I've been waiting for this year's voucher and been looking at this game.
What resources are recommended to read and learn etc? These GG games are always very complex so I expect there are some good resources somewhere.


If you are playing blue and see red pieces then attack them. Opposite if you are playing red. Works for me.

_____________________________

"Battles are fought by cowards afraid to run" - Gene Wolfe

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RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/19/2018 12:11:43 PM   
GetAssista

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: oaltinyay
If you are playing blue and see red pieces then attack them. Opposite if you are playing red. Works for me.

So many colors on the Allied side - green, brown, blue, yellow and in-between. Can make your head hurt. So much easier as Japan - kill everything that is not red!

(in reply to oaltinyay)
Post #: 26
RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/19/2018 6:41:03 PM   
BBfanboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

quote:

ORIGINAL: oaltinyay
If you are playing blue and see red pieces then attack them. Opposite if you are playing red. Works for me.

So many colors on the Allied side - green, brown, blue, yellow and in-between. Can make your head hurt. So much easier as Japan - kill everything that is not red!

Yes! By all means go and attack those sissy coral coloured Soviet units!

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to GetAssista)
Post #: 27
RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/20/2018 6:56:23 PM   
rustysi


Posts: 4650
Joined: 2/21/2012
From: LI, NY
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quote:

Well I would like to introduce a new word for ASW and SUB "TRACK" instead of "React".


OK, I can get on board with this.

quote:

Each time they occupy same hex they will try to interact based on rolls
quote:

asw attack


However as far as it goes, I've never seen this happen.

_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to BBfanboy)
Post #: 28
RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/20/2018 7:55:42 PM   
oaltinyay


Posts: 541
Joined: 12/20/2012
From: California
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: oaltinyay


quote:

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

A "learning cliff". I like that. Today I heard someone talk about a "calculated mistake". I love that concept. All mistakes should be calculated.

By definition that is NOT a mistake. Sorry. Maybe in "Gornia"

Obviously, you are just misundercalculating the Gorn's meaning...



Actually I did fight with a Gorn in the lastest ComicCon in SJ 2 months ago. Seriously exaggrated strength and a glass jaw. My captain's shirt was torn but that is normal.

Anyway, I dont get it. What can be so philosophical about a space reptile ?

_____________________________

"Battles are fought by cowards afraid to run" - Gene Wolfe

(in reply to BBfanboy)
Post #: 29
RE: Essential reading and useful strategies etc. - 10/20/2018 8:37:29 PM   
adarbrauner

 

Posts: 1238
Joined: 11/3/2016
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Barb

Well I would like to introduce a new word for ASW and SUB "TRACK" instead of "React".

Based on how both routines work, i would say it is the same... and it more closely resembles tracking then real reaction.

E.G.:
1. "Convoy" stumbles on a sub hex (say convoy, it could be any TF)
2. Sub can detect, or even attack
3. Regardless of outcome, the convoy continues to next hex
4. Several rolls later (Sub leader, aggression, damage, speed, ammo, detection etc.) the sub CAN TRACK (or follow) the contact to the next hex
5. Routine from point 2. is repeated
- you wont see sub steaming a hex out of its patrol zone without contact!
- Sub has to have Patrol orders (so the TRACK routine could happen on way to-from the patrol area)

Same with the ASW vs Sub.
1. Sub and ASW meets at certain hex. Of course Sub wish to evade, while ASW trying to contact
2. they could miss each other, raise DL, attack one another
3. sub moves to the next hex on patrol
4. Several rolls later (ASW TF leader stats, DL, etc) the ASW TF can TRACK the sub to the next hex
5. Routine from point 2. is repeated.
- as ASW is usually faster then sub, you can see it follow the sub several hexes away during the same night/day phase.
- Each time they occupy same hex they will try to interact based on rolls (evade, detect, sub attack, asw attack)



I'm definitely for this suggestion to be implemented!!

< Message edited by adarbrauner -- 10/20/2018 8:38:21 PM >

(in reply to Barb)
Post #: 30
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