Matrix Games Forums

Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

Tanker Capacity

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Command: Modern Air / Naval Operations >> Tanker Capacity Page: [1]
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
Tanker Capacity - 4/7/2018 4:42:35 AM   
fatgreta1066

 

Posts: 240
Joined: 12/30/2012
Status: offline
Is there a way to see how many planes a tanker can serve before it runs out of fuel? I can see how many KG of fuel they carry, what I'm not sure of is there any way to see the amount of fuel other aircraft will need to get filled up, something like that?
Post #: 1
RE: Tanker Capacity - 4/7/2018 7:43:18 AM   
Sardaukar


Posts: 6784
Joined: 11/28/2001
From: Finland/Israel/Bulgaria
Status: offline
I have had this same question a long time....

_____________________________

"To meaningless French Idealism, Liberty, Fraternity and Equality...we answer with German Realism, Infantry, Cavalry and Artillery" -Prince von Bülov, 1870-


(in reply to fatgreta1066)
Post #: 2
RE: Tanker Capacity - 4/7/2018 1:03:04 PM   
guanotwozero

 

Posts: 255
Joined: 12/27/2013
Status: offline
You can see how much fuel is in the tanker 'til Bingo, so that's what's currently servable.

Next, see what thirsty planes are about, and this is really where the estimation happens: they show what fuel they have, but not how much empty space is in the tank. This could probably be worked out form the database, including external tanks, but that's a lot of kerfuffle. Normally I just estimate from the green bar/empty bar ratio which gives me a rough figure. That way you can see how many tanks can be filled.

It would be good if the fuel info would give a precise figure for empty space, making this calculation easier. Maybe time for a feature request :)

(in reply to Sardaukar)
Post #: 3
RE: Tanker Capacity - 4/7/2018 10:01:44 PM   
michaelm75au


Posts: 12063
Joined: 5/5/2001
From: Sydney, Australia
Status: offline
Not sure how you would come up with an actual 'number of planes that can be refueled' by a tanker. Not all planes need the same amount of fuel.

_____________________________

Michael

(in reply to guanotwozero)
Post #: 4
RE: Tanker Capacity - 4/7/2018 10:56:13 PM   
nukkxx


Posts: 1871
Joined: 2/3/2005
Status: offline
i guess you should get a constant flow of tankers by using the 1/3 rule ... then problem solved.

(in reply to michaelm75au)
Post #: 5
RE: Tanker Capacity - 4/8/2018 12:13:49 AM   
guanotwozero

 

Posts: 255
Joined: 12/27/2013
Status: offline
It also depends on what mission setting you use for "start looking for tankers" - I tend to keep it about 25% for patrols and have a 1/3 rule tanker nearby. That way they don't drop out of patrol too often.

Strike missions are a bit different as you may want one-off forward/return refuelling. The recently-added tanker planning abilities make that easier, but I'll still try to work out roughly what's needed beforehand. When you arm the planes, each loadout shows the mission profile including range; that way you can work out how many refills you'll need to get there and back. More than 2 and you may need some serious tanker planning, a la Black Buck.

This is an area where the Advanced Mission Planner could help, if it could work out fuel budgets beforehand. We could plan all tanker stations around that.

(in reply to nukkxx)
Post #: 6
RE: Tanker Capacity - 4/8/2018 10:31:10 AM   
fatgreta1066

 

Posts: 240
Joined: 12/30/2012
Status: offline
What is that Black Buck diagram from? That's interesting, if I could only figure out what it means...

(in reply to guanotwozero)
Post #: 7
RE: Tanker Capacity - 4/8/2018 11:12:29 AM   
Gunner98

 

Posts: 3557
Joined: 4/29/2005
From: The Great White North!
Status: online
Operation Black Buck: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Black_Buck

This book - Vulcan 607 is an excellent read on the subject: https://www.amazon.com/Vulcan-607-Remarkable-British-Attack/dp/0552152293



(in reply to fatgreta1066)
Post #: 8
RE: Tanker Capacity - 4/8/2018 1:09:21 PM   
fatgreta1066

 

Posts: 240
Joined: 12/30/2012
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gunner98

Operation Black Buck: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Black_Buck

This book - Vulcan 607 is an excellent read on the subject: https://www.amazon.com/Vulcan-607-Remarkable-British-Attack/dp/0552152293





That goes on the to read list. This by the same author looks pretty good too. https://www.amazon.com/Storm-Front-Secret-Greatest-British/dp/0552160210/ref=pd_sbs_14_2?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=0552160210&pd_rd_r=C43BQ1823AHVMH0EN037&pd_rd_w=tyleP&pd_rd_wg=uusVp&psc=1&refRID=C43BQ1823AHVMH0EN037

(in reply to Gunner98)
Post #: 9
RE: Tanker Capacity - 4/8/2018 1:14:55 PM   
Gunner98

 

Posts: 3557
Joined: 4/29/2005
From: The Great White North!
Status: online
Have not read Storm Front but I have read Phoenix Squadron by the same author and that was also excellent - also iirc it had a lot of A2A refueling stuff in it.

https://www.amazon.com/Phoenix-Squadron-Britains-Dramatic-Mission/dp/0552152900/ref=pd_bxgy_14_img_2?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=0552152900&pd_rd_r=342S714MAR8925FPE14X&pd_rd_w=OjH2R&pd_rd_wg=UKh6S&psc=1&refRID=342S714MAR8925FPE14X

(in reply to fatgreta1066)
Post #: 10
RE: Tanker Capacity - 4/8/2018 1:58:09 PM   
guanotwozero

 

Posts: 255
Joined: 12/27/2013
Status: offline
Thanks for the recommendations guys! I've read V607 but not the others.

quote:

ORIGINAL: fatgreta1066

What is that Black Buck diagram from? That's interesting, if I could only figure out what it means...


There's a briefer account of the first Black Buck raid here, with a simpler refuelling diagram. Also includes a Youtube version of the Ch4 documentary about the raid.

It's a little reminiscent of a pyramidal binomial-type distribution, with tankers fuelling tankers fuelling the bomber. The longer the range the more tankers needed for the bomber, and so a larger pyramid of tankers for those tankers, etc. Black Buck 1 had two such pyramids for the outward trip and another one for the return.



(in reply to fatgreta1066)
Post #: 11
RE: Tanker Capacity - 4/10/2018 12:47:42 PM   
fatgreta1066

 

Posts: 240
Joined: 12/30/2012
Status: offline
Well I was able to get my strike launched against the carrier. It was an open question if they strike aircraft would have enough fuel to get back to the tankers on RTB. That ended up being a moot point as the Aegis equipped ships not only shot down all the ARM missiles I launched but also shot down all my strike aircraft before they could get out of missile range. As an American I truly hope that the Aegis system is as good as it's modeled in this game. As a human I very seriously doubt it is.

Thanks for all the help on this, and definitely for pointing me toward that Black Buck information. I'm sure I'll have plenty of other chances to organize a long range tanker assisted strike. BTW, is there a scenario in this game for the Black Buck mission?

(in reply to guanotwozero)
Post #: 12
RE: Tanker Capacity - 4/10/2018 2:25:52 PM   
Primarchx


Posts: 2745
Joined: 1/20/2013
Status: offline
I usually over-budget tankers as fuel is a 'free' resource and sortie turn-around time on tankers is typically pretty short.

At worst you can add up fuel weights, determine how much fuel the tanker needs for getting and staying on station and how much fuel your receivers will need. LOTS of work.

(in reply to fatgreta1066)
Post #: 13
RE: Tanker Capacity - 4/10/2018 5:24:36 PM   
guanotwozero

 

Posts: 255
Joined: 12/27/2013
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Primarchx
At worst you can add up fuel weights, determine how much fuel the tanker needs for getting and staying on station and how much fuel your receivers will need. LOTS of work.

THIS is one of the things I'd love the Advanced Mission Planner to handle.

(in reply to Primarchx)
Post #: 14
RE: Tanker Capacity - 4/12/2018 12:40:12 AM   
guanotwozero

 

Posts: 255
Joined: 12/27/2013
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: fatgreta1066
BTW, is there a scenario in this game for the Black Buck mission?

There is! It's called Operation Black Buck 1, in the Community group. Haven't tried it yet, but I will now I know it's there.

(in reply to fatgreta1066)
Post #: 15
Page:   [1]
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Command: Modern Air / Naval Operations >> Tanker Capacity Page: [1]
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

0.188