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Pestilence - 2/7/2018 2:17:11 PM   
Teemu1986

 

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The manual says: "Half of Infantry, Cavalry, and Horse Transport equipment lost by units in Supplied locations are sent to the Replacement Pool. All non-Infantry, non-Cavalry, non-Horse Transport equipment lost by units in Supplied locations is sent to the Replacement Pool as well. All other Pestilence losses are permanent."

What about the unit being overextended? Will such pestilence losses be permanent or not?
Post #: 1
RE: Pestilence - 2/7/2018 9:27:44 PM   
Cabido

 

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As I understand it, overextended will be considered supplied for this purpose, since they have a line-of-communications to a supply source.

Much of the equipment “lost” during combat
is not actually destroyed. Instead, it is considered
damaged or temporarily unserviceable. This
damaged equipment goes to the Replacement
Pool unless the owning unit is Out of Supply. In
the case of Air equipment, the fraction of damaged
equipment going to the Replacement Pool is
proportional to the owning unit’s Proficiency. Naval
equipment never goes to the Replacement Pool.


§ “Overextended” units receive supply normally.
§ However, they also suffer desertion losses (see
below) during the interturn calculations the
same as if they were “Unsupplied” – except
that those losses go to the “On Hand” pool,
not the dead pile.

(in reply to Teemu1986)
Post #: 2
RE: Pestilence - 2/8/2018 4:04:25 AM   
Lobster


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From: Third rock from the Sun.
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Yeah, 'overextened'. LMAO. They walk 200 km back to their barracks. And of course in this case deserted doesn't mean deserted. It has some other meaning since deserters don't go back to the barracks. This game has always suffered from silly things like this and the powers that be absolutely refuse to resolve it in a real world manner. For instance, motorized units never run out of gas. That is pure bs. The Germans would have loved to never run out of gas during the Battle of the Bulge. And Rommel would have been in heaven if his tanks could run forever on 'overextended'.

In the real world if someone cuts the road that your supplies have to come down you are not overextended. You are out of supply. Period. Doesn't matter that you have a 400 km line of communications. You are not getting any ammo, fuel or food.

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When I grow up I would either like to manage a supermarket or be Vice President of the United States. Of course, I know it takes brains to manage a supermarket.

(in reply to Cabido)
Post #: 3
RE: Pestilence - 2/8/2018 4:24:14 AM   
Zecke


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Post #: 4
RE: Pestilence - 2/8/2018 2:21:06 PM   
Curtis Lemay


Posts: 10397
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From: Houston, TX
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster

Yeah, 'overextened'. LMAO. They walk 200 km back to their barracks. And of course in this case deserted doesn't mean deserted. It has some other meaning since deserters don't go back to the barracks. This game has always suffered from silly things like this and the powers that be absolutely refuse to resolve it in a real world manner. For instance, motorized units never run out of gas. That is pure bs. The Germans would have loved to never run out of gas during the Battle of the Bulge. And Rommel would have been in heaven if his tanks could run forever on 'overextended'.

In the real world if someone cuts the road that your supplies have to come down you are not overextended. You are out of supply. Period. Doesn't matter that you have a 400 km line of communications. You are not getting any ammo, fuel or food.

Have you ever actually tried operating in an Overextended condition in any scenario?

_____________________________

My TOAW web site:

Bob Cross's TOAW Site

(in reply to Lobster)
Post #: 5
RE: Pestilence - 2/8/2018 7:03:29 PM   
secadegas

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster

YThe Germans would have loved to never run out of gas during the Battle of the Bulge. And Rommel would have been in heaven if his tanks could run forever on 'overextended'.





Now - under TOAW IV - your unit will not be able to run forever on overextended supply. If it insists on keeping on moving it will suffer from a heavy amount of desertions and it will be INOP in no time.





(in reply to Lobster)
Post #: 6
RE: Pestilence - 2/8/2018 7:04:03 PM   
secadegas

 

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double post

< Message edited by secadegas -- 2/10/2018 2:50:57 PM >

(in reply to secadegas)
Post #: 7
RE: Pestilence - 2/8/2018 11:36:51 PM   
Lobster


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From: Third rock from the Sun.
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quote:

ORIGINAL: secadegas


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster

YThe Germans would have loved to never run out of gas during the Battle of the Bulge. And Rommel would have been in heaven if his tanks could run forever on 'overextended'.





Now - under TOAW IV - your unit will not be able to run forever on overextended supply. If it insists on keeping on moving it will suffer from a heavy amount of desertions and it will be INOP in no time.







And all of the 'desertions' go back into the replacement pool!!! How does the abandoned equipment make it all the way back with no fuel??? Reduce the number of squads returning to 50% and even that is generous. Remove all equipment as lost. Unless the 'deserters' are pushing it all the way back to the motor pool. Currently overextended is a toothless tiger.

_____________________________

http://www.operationbarbarossa.net/

When I grow up I would either like to manage a supermarket or be Vice President of the United States. Of course, I know it takes brains to manage a supermarket.

(in reply to secadegas)
Post #: 8
RE: Pestilence - 2/8/2018 11:55:13 PM   
Curtis Lemay


Posts: 10397
Joined: 9/17/2004
From: Houston, TX
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster

And all of the 'desertions' go back into the replacement pool!!! How does the abandoned equipment make it all the way back with no fuel??? Reduce the number of squads returning to 50% and even that is generous. Remove all equipment as lost. Unless the 'deserters' are pushing it all the way back to the motor pool.

They're not deserters, they're like stragglers. Just that it's supply, not fatigue that's causing the straggling.

And where is "all the way back to the replacement pool"? It's anywhere in the rear. They're in friendly controlled territory - just like stragglers. They are all recoverable.

quote:

Currently overextended is a toothless tiger.


Again, have you ever tried it?

_____________________________

My TOAW web site:

Bob Cross's TOAW Site

(in reply to Lobster)
Post #: 9
RE: Pestilence - 2/9/2018 3:54:46 AM   
Lobster


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From: Third rock from the Sun.
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Yes. My guys push vehicles and drag guns back to the motor pool huge distances. With nothing to eat. Supermen I tell ya. So yeah, fatigue would certainly be a factor. But then they call AAA and those guys drive their trucks all the way to where the unit ran out of gas to tow them back. But guess what? They run out of gas too because now they have to travel twice as far to properly recover those vehicles and guns. And remarkably enough they send enough recovery vehicles/tow trucks to attempt to drag every single run out of gas vehicle and the gun it was towing all the way back to the motor pool. Yeah, there's a lot of thought went into that one.

_____________________________

http://www.operationbarbarossa.net/

When I grow up I would either like to manage a supermarket or be Vice President of the United States. Of course, I know it takes brains to manage a supermarket.

(in reply to Curtis Lemay)
Post #: 10
RE: Pestilence - 2/9/2018 2:23:44 PM   
Curtis Lemay


Posts: 10397
Joined: 9/17/2004
From: Houston, TX
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster

Yes. My guys push vehicles and drag guns back to the motor pool huge distances. With nothing to eat. Supermen I tell ya. So yeah, fatigue would certainly be a factor. But then they call AAA and those guys drive their trucks all the way to where the unit ran out of gas to tow them back. But guess what? They run out of gas too because now they have to travel twice as far to properly recover those vehicles and guns. And remarkably enough they send enough recovery vehicles/tow trucks to attempt to drag every single run out of gas vehicle and the gun it was towing all the way back to the motor pool. Yeah, there's a lot of thought went into that one.

They're not dragged anywhere. They just remain where they are till supply catches up to them. Unless what they are missing is ammo - that doesn't affect their mobility whatsoever - just their combat capacity.

_____________________________

My TOAW web site:

Bob Cross's TOAW Site

(in reply to Lobster)
Post #: 11
RE: Pestilence - 2/9/2018 3:29:31 PM   
Lobster


Posts: 1530
Joined: 8/8/2013
From: Third rock from the Sun.
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Curtis Lemay


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster

Yes. My guys push vehicles and drag guns back to the motor pool huge distances. With nothing to eat. Supermen I tell ya. So yeah, fatigue would certainly be a factor. But then they call AAA and those guys drive their trucks all the way to where the unit ran out of gas to tow them back. But guess what? They run out of gas too because now they have to travel twice as far to properly recover those vehicles and guns. And remarkably enough they send enough recovery vehicles/tow trucks to attempt to drag every single run out of gas vehicle and the gun it was towing all the way back to the motor pool. Yeah, there's a lot of thought went into that one.

They're not dragged anywhere. They just remain where they are till supply catches up to them. Unless what they are missing is ammo - that doesn't affect their mobility whatsoever - just their combat capacity.




_____________________________

http://www.operationbarbarossa.net/

When I grow up I would either like to manage a supermarket or be Vice President of the United States. Of course, I know it takes brains to manage a supermarket.

(in reply to Curtis Lemay)
Post #: 12
RE: Pestilence - 2/9/2018 7:33:20 PM   
Oberst_Klink

 

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Let's dispense of those little nagging titbits... I can't complain about how it works in my operational 'masterpieces'. So, let's be civilised and assist Ralph and devs with suggestions, not what Norm's code couldn't meet. Still... Norm is my hero.

Klink, Oberst

_____________________________


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Post #: 13
RE: Pestilence - 2/9/2018 10:26:53 PM   
Rokossovskiy

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Oberst_Klink

Let's dispense of those little nagging titbits... I can't complain about how it works in my operational 'masterpieces'. So, let's be civilised and assist Ralph and devs with suggestions, not what Norm's code couldn't meet. Still... Norm is my hero.

Klink, Oberst


What is this? This game could not do many things that have now changed. We should stop making this better is what you say. This is simply in my eyes a suggestion. Make the over extending do what real world actions dictate. Not what someone makes up for it to do. How is this bad?

(in reply to Oberst_Klink)
Post #: 14
RE: Pestilence - 2/9/2018 10:59:32 PM   
larryfulkerson


Posts: 33146
Joined: 4/17/2005
From: Tucson, AZ
Status: online
Somebody isn't getting the point of "abstraction" as a concept.

_____________________________

Honesty is an expensive gift... don't expect it from cheap people.

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Post #: 15
RE: Pestilence - 2/10/2018 2:00:14 PM   
Rokossovskiy

 

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Joined: 7/10/2015
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quote:

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

Somebody isn't getting the point of "abstraction" as a concept.


Navy was abstract. Now you are very happy because it is less so. Supply was abstract. Now you are happy because it is less so. Next air will be less abstract and you will be ok with this. Many things were abstract and are less so yet these are ok with you. Now someone asks make this more like what the real world is and you kick them???? Russian saying, You kick with the back feet while you lick with your tongue.

(in reply to larryfulkerson)
Post #: 16
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