Sack the admiral..
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Sack the admiral..
That's what I call a one sided fight and Japanese were on ASW. Down too poor visibility?
Day Time Surface Combat, near Tandjoengpinang at 50,85, Range 7,000 Yards
Japanese Ships
DD Akigumo
DD Shiranui
DD Urakaze, Shell hits 4, heavy fires, heavy damage
Allied Ships
BB South Dakota, Shell hits 12, Torpedo hits 1, heavy damage
CA Astoria, Shell hits 4, Torpedo hits 1, on fire
CL Detroit, Shell hits 2
DD Hotspur, Shell hits 9, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
DD Kennison, Shell hits 3, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
Reduced visibility due to Thunderstorms
Maximum visibility in Thunderstorms: 7,000 yards
Range closes to 23,000 yards...
Range closes to 17,000 yards...
Range closes to 11,000 yards...
Range closes to 7,000 yards...
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 7,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 7,000 yards
DD Hotspur engages DD Urakaze at 7,000 yards
CA Astoria engages DD Urakaze at 7,000 yards
DD Urakaze engages CL Detroit at 7,000 yards
DD Urakaze engages DD Hotspur at 7,000 yards
Range closes to 3,000 yards
BB South Dakota engages DD Urakaze at 3,000 yards
DD Shiranui engages DD Hotspur at 3,000 yards
BB South Dakota engages DD Akigumo at 3,000 yards
DD Urakaze engages DD Hotspur at 3,000 yards
CA Astoria engages DD Urakaze at 3,000 yards
BB South Dakota engages DD Akigumo at 3,000 yards
Gatch, Thomas Lee orders Allied TF to disengage
Range closes to 2,000 yards
BB South Dakota engages DD Urakaze at 2,000 yards
CA Astoria engages DD Urakaze at 2,000 yards
DD Akigumo engages DD Hotspur at 2,000 yards
Shiraishi, Nagayo orders Japanese TF to disengage
Range increases to 5,000 yards
CA Astoria engages DD Urakaze at 5,000 yards
DD Akigumo engages DD Kennison at 5,000 yards
Range increases to 10,000 yards
BB South Dakota engages DD Urakaze at 10,000 yards
CA Astoria engages DD Akigumo at 10,000 yards
DD Kennison engages DD Akigumo at 10,000 yards
Range increases to 13,000 yards
CA Astoria engages DD Shiranui at 13,000 yards
DD Akigumo engages CL Detroit at 13,000 yards
Range increases to 17,000 yards
BB South Dakota engages DD Urakaze at 17,000 yards
BB South Dakota engages DD Akigumo at 17,000 yards
Range increases to 22,000 yards
CA Astoria engages DD Shiranui at 22,000 yards
Task forces break off...
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RE: Sack the admiral..
Yooohh wooow
RE: Sack the admiral..
DD Urakazae is a goner, though.
RE: Sack the admiral..
A simple sacking is too good for the Admiral! You need the works: break his sword, rip off his badges of rank, a band playing "the rouge's march", perhaps burning his commission in front of him...
That being said, this looks kinda like the results the USN got in the Battle of Tassafaronga.
That being said, this looks kinda like the results the USN got in the Battle of Tassafaronga.
RE: Sack the admiral..
I would say give him a break. He is lucky to be alive, assuming he is.
It was the poor visibility. The Japanese are much better at night and in poor visibility than the Allies.
They trained for it.
DDs are very fast and in this case they got in close (2,000 yards) with superior torpedoes.
http://nationalinterest.org/feature/jap ... wwii-15541
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RE: Sack the admiral..
The admiral that assembled and deployed a TF with woefully deficient destroyers to support the capital ships is the one who would get sacked.
"Rats set fire to Mr. Cooper’s store in Fort Valley. No damage done." Columbus (Ga) Enquirer-Sun, October 2, 1880.
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RE: Sack the admiral..
ORIGINAL: Chris21wen
Japanese Ships
DD Akigumo
DD Shiranui
DD Urakaze, Shell hits 4, heavy fires, heavy damage
Each of those DD's carry 8 Long Lance Torpedos - You faced a spread of 24 of the biggest, baddest torpedoes in the game
The same torpedos achieved hits at Savo Island from a longer distance.
The weather conditions were perfect conditions for the IJN to make contact and then slip away.
You faced the perfect Storm.
From a situational perspective, the Admiral in charge of the TF was handed a shit sandwich and the results were beyond his control. Sacking him only makes him a scapegoat.ORIGINAL: Lovejoy
A simple sacking is too good for the Admiral! You need the works: break his sword, rip off his badges of rank, a band playing "the rouge's march", perhaps burning his commission in front of him...
That being said, this looks kinda like the results the USN got in the Battle of Tassafaronga.
RE: Sack the admiral..
One of the worst I have ever seen and in daylight combat too. But they are right. Two DDs escorting valuable capital ships is a big error.
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RE: Sack the admiral..
ORIGINAL: Yaab
DD Urakazae is a goner, though.
No, it happened one hex from Singas and made it back.
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RE: Sack the admiral..
ORIGINAL: Trugrit
I would say give him a break. He is lucky to be alive, assuming he is.
It was the poor visibility. The Japanese are much better at night and in poor visibility than the Allies.
They trained for it.
DDs are very fast and in this case they got in close (2,000 yards) with superior torpedoes.
http://nationalinterest.org/feature/jap ... wwii-15541
They trained for it.
Might not be as the TF was hit by Bettys and is reportardly sunk.
RE: Sack the admiral..
Suppose the Japanese had Oi and Kitakami, each launching 40 fish? [:D]
The 2 of them could have won night battles at Guadalcanal almost by themselves.
The 2 of them could have won night battles at Guadalcanal almost by themselves.
RE: Sack the admiral..
ORIGINAL: InfiniteMonkey
From a situational perspective, the Admiral in charge of the TF was handed a shit sandwich and the results were beyond his control. Sacking him only makes him a scapegoat.ORIGINAL: Lovejoy
A simple sacking is too good for the Admiral! You need the works: break his sword, rip off his badges of rank, a band playing "the rouge's march", perhaps burning his commission in front of him...
That being said, this looks kinda like the results the USN got in the Battle of Tassafaronga.
I was going for flippant humor: I agree that this TF was sent out without a sufficient screen. If the Admiral was subjected to what I suggested, it would scapegoating him in a bad way.
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RE: Sack the admiral..
Yeah, you just kind of hit a nerve.ORIGINAL: Lovejoy
ORIGINAL: InfiniteMonkey
From a situational perspective, the Admiral in charge of the TF was handed a shit sandwich and the results were beyond his control. Sacking him only makes him a scapegoat.ORIGINAL: Lovejoy
A simple sacking is too good for the Admiral! You need the works: break his sword, rip off his badges of rank, a band playing "the rouge's march", perhaps burning his commission in front of him...
That being said, this looks kinda like the results the USN got in the Battle of Tassafaronga.
I was going for flippant humor: I agree that this TF was sent out without a sufficient screen. If the Admiral was subjected to what I suggested, it would scapegoating him in a bad way.
Those who can, do or die trying. (Soldiers, sailors, engineers, doctors)
Those who can't try to figure out who to blame. (Politicians, managers, lawyers, and other idiots)
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RE: Sack the admiral..
ORIGINAL: InfiniteMonkey
Sacking him only makes him a scapegoat.
Maybe so, but I'd still start with that.
RE: Sack the admiral..
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If it ain't broke, don't fix it!
RE: Sack the admiral..
Dans ce pays-ci, il est bon de tuer de temps en temps un amiral pour encourager les autres... in Candide, Voltaire saying about the British...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Minorca_(1756)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Minorca_(1756)
RE: Sack the admiral..
ORIGINAL: InfiniteMonkey
ORIGINAL: Chris21wen
Japanese Ships
DD Akigumo
DD Shiranui
DD Urakaze, Shell hits 4, heavy fires, heavy damage
Each of those DD's carry 8 Long Lance Torpedos - You faced a spread of 24 of the biggest, baddest torpedoes in the game
The same torpedos achieved hits at Savo Island from a longer distance.
The weather conditions were perfect conditions for the IJN to make contact and then slip away.
You faced the perfect Storm.
From a situational perspective, the Admiral in charge of the TF was handed a shit sandwich and the results were beyond his control. Sacking him only makes him a scapegoat.ORIGINAL: Lovejoy
A simple sacking is too good for the Admiral! You need the works: break his sword, rip off his badges of rank, a band playing "the rouge's march", perhaps burning his commission in front of him...
That being said, this looks kinda like the results the USN got in the Battle of Tassafaronga.
Put simply---it is LOVELY! BANZAI!
Member: Treaty, Reluctant Admiral and Between the Storms Mod Team.
RE: Sack the admiral..
What was the date of the battle?
If South Dakota was present - it's safe to assume the US Surface TF was RADAR equipped... and the battle was late 1942 at the earliest.
Somebody wasn't watching their RADAR screens and/or failing to pass info up channels...somebody's butt is in a sling.
Suffice to say - it shouldn't have happened, but it certainly could have been possible - though unlikely any DD's would survive engaging a South Dakota at 3000 yards.
Grog for the Japanese DD crews is in order.
If South Dakota was present - it's safe to assume the US Surface TF was RADAR equipped... and the battle was late 1942 at the earliest.
Somebody wasn't watching their RADAR screens and/or failing to pass info up channels...somebody's butt is in a sling.
Suffice to say - it shouldn't have happened, but it certainly could have been possible - though unlikely any DD's would survive engaging a South Dakota at 3000 yards.
Grog for the Japanese DD crews is in order.
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RE: Sack the admiral..
ORIGINAL: Big B
What was the date of the battle?
If South Dakota was present - it's safe to assume the US Surface TF was RADAR equipped... and the battle was late 1942 at the earliest.
Somebody wasn't watching their RADAR screens and/or failing to pass info up channels...somebody's butt is in a sling.
Suffice to say - it shouldn't have happened, but it certainly could have been possible - though unlikely any DD's would survive engaging a South Dakota at 3000 yards.
Grog for the Japanese DD crews is in order.
Mar 43. I should add it was against the AI which is why it had such poor DD screen. For some weird reason it transisted through the Torres Straits, Java Sea and I assume for somw reason it was heading for India as it never attacted anything.
Playin the AI you expect such thing to happen so I turned of all air groups with Naval attack (forgot one) and had no major TF set to surface. Basically I left it alone. It was a ASW TF that engaged it.
It's the result that is astonishing.