two turns in a row?

jnpoint · Post by **jnpoint** » Fri Nov 17, 2017 4:38 pm

I'm playing Kasserine 42 to learn the game (and it's not going well

.
But I wonder how come that I just finished turn 7 and then it was my turn 8 without a turn to the AI in between. Can that be explained or is it a kind of a bug?

sPzAbt653 · Post by **sPzAbt653** » Fri Nov 17, 2017 4:45 pm

10.1. Variable Initiative

Oberst_Klink · Post by **Oberst_Klink** » Fri Nov 17, 2017 4:46 pm

ORIGINAL: jnpoint

I'm playing Kasserine 42 to learn the game (and it's not going well .
But I wonder how come that I just finished turn 7 and then it was my turn 8 without a turn to the AI in between. Can that be explained or is it a kind of a bug?

It's called the 'New turn order rule'. -
New Turn Order Rules: If on, this option
will better equalize the two player-turns. The
details are listed in section 9.0.2.

Gruß nach Danmark!

Klink, Oberst

jnpoint · Post by **jnpoint** » Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:14 pm

ORIGINAL: Oberst_Klink

Gruß nach Danmark!

Klink, Oberst

Danke

Oberst_Klink · Post by **Oberst_Klink** » Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:19 pm

Ikke nævne det!

Hvordan er Brigitte Nyborg, din statsminister?

Klink, Oberst

jnpoint · Post by **jnpoint** » Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:24 pm

Hun er en god skuespiller, men bliver nok aldrig statsminister

Oberst_Klink · Post by **Oberst_Klink** » Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:39 pm

I liked 'Borgen', a great show

Klink, Oberst

secadegas · Post by **secadegas** » Wed Dec 13, 2017 7:25 am

ORIGINAL: Oberst_Klink

ORIGINAL: jnpoint

I'm playing Kasserine 42 to learn the game (and it's not going well .
But I wonder how come that I just finished turn 7 and then it was my turn 8 without a turn to the AI in between. Can that be explained or is it a kind of a bug?

It's called the 'New turn order rule'. -
New Turn Order Rules: If on, this option
will better equalize the two player-turns. The
details are listed in section 9.0.2.

Klink, Oberst

On TOAW III the variable initiative only had effect on human vs PO/AI games. On PBEM and hotseat there wasn't variable initiative.
Apparently, reading the manual" this wasn't changed for TOAW IV

From the manual:
"10.1. Variable Initiative
The Force defined in the Scenario as “the first player” (usually the Attacking Force) will always
move first on the first Turn of a Scenario. After that, the first player is determined by an Initiative Check. This means the order of players can change from Turn to Turn.
The Initiative Level of a Force is partly randomized, but is strongly influenced by the average Movement Allowance of all friendly Land units on the map not assigned to Formations with a Reserve status.
PBEM and Hotseat Exceptions: In PBEM and Hotseat games, the Initiative remains fixed in the
order established on the first Turn of the game."

So are you sure the New Turn rules (in effect already on TOAW III) will change the variable initiative previous rules in hotseat and PBEM games?

secadegas · Post by **secadegas** » Wed Dec 13, 2017 7:44 am

I'm testing TOAW IV with a solo / hotseat game and i could already verify that the variable initiative is not working as it is discribed in the manual.

In solo / hotseat mode the initiave doesn't remain fixed as it should.

I just don't know if this is a feature or a bug.

secadegas · Post by **secadegas** » Wed Dec 13, 2017 6:46 pm

Kept on testing and verified that either on new turn rules or "old" turn rules the variable initiative doesn't work as it should.

In solo / hotseat game - when initiative should be fixed (as per TOAW IV manual and it was on TOAW III) it is variable.
Didn't test in PBEM.

On a scenario as Europe Aflame or others where fixed initiative is a must in order to work smoothly this bug is a big problem.

sPzAbt653 · Post by **sPzAbt653** » Wed Dec 13, 2017 11:42 pm

New Turn Order Rules have nothing to do with Initiative Switches.

This is reproducible, and along with the Formation Report bug you reported has been posted in Development. Thanks.

76mm · Post by **76mm** » Thu Dec 14, 2017 2:55 am

Is there any way to leave players the option of playing PBEM or hotseat games with variable initiative? I like the uncertainty that it introduces, and it's obviously possible, because that's how it's working now!

secadegas · Post by **secadegas** » Thu Dec 14, 2017 1:16 pm

ORIGINAL: sPzAbt653

This is reproducible, and along with the Formation Report bug you reported has been posted in Development. Thanks.

Thanks for your concern and to all in the team for their dedication to this project.

marion61 · Post by **marion61** » Fri Jan 12, 2018 2:38 pm

ORIGINAL: sPzAbt653

This is reproducible, and along with the Formation Report bug you reported has been posted in Development. Thanks.

I'm reviving this thread in the hopes that this will not be left out of the next patch.

secadegas · Post by **secadegas** » Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:57 pm

ORIGINAL: marion61

ORIGINAL: sPzAbt653

This is reproducible, and along with the Formation Report bug you reported has been posted in Development. Thanks.

I'm reviving this thread in the hopes that this will not be left out of the next patch.

+1

76mm · Post by **76mm** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 10:24 am

As far as I can tell, hotseat games still feature Variable Initiative, after all of these months? Is this going to be fixed at some point? Also, as per my previous request, is it possible to leave Variable Initiative as an option for hotseat games? Not sure how popular it would be, but it does add an interesting wrinkle...

gliz2 · Post by **gliz2** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 7:13 pm

Can this be switched off?
I'm finding it frustrating and cannot figure any reason why it should be there. What it supposed to simulate with half weekly turns? I'm playing in hot seat in FITE2 and it just happened twice for Soviets (in early July, seriously?) and once for Germans (in August but why?).

In IGUGO system is an odd idea in my view [8|]

MikeJ19 · Post by **MikeJ19** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 9:10 pm

Gliz2,

I understand your frustration, but I really enjoy the feature. It makes me think more if I move first. I know that lots of players do not like it, so it would be nice if it was an optionally feature.

Have a good day,

gliz2 · Post by **gliz2** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 4:14 am

I artificially adds some tension, I agree.
Where is the logic behind you not being on initiative (operationally) and suddenly the enemy gets an upper hand. I mean it is not related to anything but completely random.
In FITE2 twice in July'41 when Soviets were being ripped appart this happened. And only by this events I was prevented from crossing Dvina river or capturing Zhytomir as the Soviets got double movement.
The rules are either the same for both sides with factors being changed (like initiative or organizational penalties) and not random.
In the FITE2 it really allowed for some absurdalities.

larryfulkerson · Post by **larryfulkerson** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:11 am

I'm not sure I like variable initiative and I think that whether it works for the scenario or not depends on the size and complexity of the scenario. Little scenarios, short scenarios, it might not work out really well. In large scenarios it might not make a much difference and in monster scenarios it might not matter all.

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