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DE oddities - 9/11/2017 12:29:12 PM   
Leadwieght

 

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Hi,

I've noticed a few more places where the either the Manual mis-describes the conditions for a Decision Event or I don't understand it:

1. DE643 (Norway invasion by Germany)--the Manual says "Event fires: on March 23rd 1940 when Norway is neutral and pro-Axis..."
I took that to mean that if the Allied player used diplo early in the war to swing Norway away from its 0% pre-Axis Mobilization level, then the Axis player would NOT be presented with this DE in March, 1940 (or ever for that matter).
So in a recent PBEM game, I spent some MPPs on French and British diplo chits and got lucky; Norway switched to 9% pro-British mobilization. The level was still at 7% pro-Britain in March of 1940 (I inadvertrantly lowered it myself by sending a British sub too cloe to Norway for one turn).
Much to my surprise, my opponent took Norway in April via the DE with full benefits (i.e. occupation of Norwegian ports with garrisons, capture of Oslo, installation of Quisling).
So, is the manual incorrect, or is there something I'm missing?

2. DE126 (Operation Fork--British occupation of Iceland). Event fires on April 25th, but the actual occupation doesn't happen until the following turn. All well and good, but in a recent game I slipped a German Garrison into Reykjavik in the Axis turn after April 25, thainking I would beat the Royal marines to the punch.
Alas no, the event went ahead, my unit got thrown out (oddly, it wasn't destroyed, instead it popped back up in Norway).
Maybe there's a certain logic to this chain of events--simulating a "race to Reykjavik" that the Allied force wins by a whisker, forcing the German force to turn back.
But as the Axis player, I got hit with the US mobilization penalty for a one-turn stint in sunny Iceland. I guess I won't do that again, but why have the gap between the British decision and its execution?

I don't mean to sound like a "Sea lawyer" but the online version of the Manual may need an overhaul to catch these and other mistakes.

LW
Post #: 1
RE: DE oddities - 9/11/2017 5:33:01 PM   
oxford_guy


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From: Oxford, United Kingdom
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Also I think the advertised date for the appearance of the Indian Corps in Iraq is wrong, says 1941 I think

(in reply to Leadwieght)
Post #: 2
RE: DE oddities - 9/11/2017 6:54:19 PM   
Bill Runacre

 

Posts: 1813
Joined: 7/22/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Leadwieght

Hi,

I've noticed a few more places where the either the Manual mis-describes the conditions for a Decision Event or I don't understand it:

1. DE643 (Norway invasion by Germany)--the Manual says "Event fires: on March 23rd 1940 when Norway is neutral and pro-Axis..."
I took that to mean that if the Allied player used diplo early in the war to swing Norway away from its 0% pre-Axis Mobilization level, then the Axis player would NOT be presented with this DE in March, 1940 (or ever for that matter).
So in a recent PBEM game, I spent some MPPs on French and British diplo chits and got lucky; Norway switched to 9% pro-British mobilization. The level was still at 7% pro-Britain in March of 1940 (I inadvertrantly lowered it myself by sending a British sub too cloe to Norway for one turn).
Much to my surprise, my opponent took Norway in April via the DE with full benefits (i.e. occupation of Norwegian ports with garrisons, capture of Oslo, installation of Quisling).
So, is the manual incorrect, or is there something I'm missing?


Yes, DE 644, which fires when Norway is neutral but pro-Allied.

quote:

2. DE126 (Operation Fork--British occupation of Iceland). Event fires on April 25th, but the actual occupation doesn't happen until the following turn. All well and good, but in a recent game I slipped a German Garrison into Reykjavik in the Axis turn after April 25, thainking I would beat the Royal marines to the punch.
Alas no, the event went ahead, my unit got thrown out (oddly, it wasn't destroyed, instead it popped back up in Norway).
Maybe there's a certain logic to this chain of events--simulating a "race to Reykjavik" that the Allied force wins by a whisker, forcing the German force to turn back.
But as the Axis player, I got hit with the US mobilization penalty for a one-turn stint in sunny Iceland. I guess I won't do that again, but why have the gap between the British decision and its execution?

I don't mean to sound like a "Sea lawyer" but the online version of the Manual may need an overhaul to catch these and other mistakes.

LW


Operation Fork was carried out on the 10th May 1940, so this matches the historical timetable, which is an Axis turn, but the Allied decision has to be taken in the previous turn as they can't make a decision in the Axis turn.

Looking at the scripts, you must have landed in the exact same Axis turn as the script fires. If you'd landed in the previous Axis turn then Operation Fork wouldn't even have been an option. While perhaps not ideal, one could rationalize it as the Allies beating your force and kicking it out.

Bill



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Post #: 3
RE: DE oddities - 9/11/2017 6:58:32 PM   
Bill Runacre

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: oxford_guy

Also I think the advertised date for the appearance of the Indian Corps in Iraq is wrong, says 1941 I think


Do you mean the unit arriving at Basra as part of DE 106 - UK: Impose Economic Sanctions On Iraq?

I can't see any dates mentioned either in the Decision script text or the Manual for this.

Any idea where you might have seen a date, assuming we're talking about that Decision and its related scripts?

Bill

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Post #: 4
RE: DE oddities - 9/11/2017 8:35:28 PM   
oxford_guy


Posts: 445
Joined: 7/1/2012
From: Oxford, United Kingdom
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bill Runacre


quote:

ORIGINAL: oxford_guy

Also I think the advertised date for the appearance of the Indian Corps in Iraq is wrong, says 1941 I think


Do you mean the unit arriving at Basra as part of DE 106 - UK: Impose Economic Sanctions On Iraq?

I can't see any dates mentioned either in the Decision script text or the Manual for this.

Any idea where you might have seen a date, assuming we're talking about that Decision and its related scripts?

Bill


Sorry, I'm getting confused with 1.13 - "From May 1941, after the pro-Axis coup in Iraq, the British 10th Army will be formed in Jerusalem.", my mistake.

(in reply to Bill Runacre)
Post #: 5
RE: DE oddities - 9/12/2017 5:28:55 AM   
Amadeus

 

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Bill Runacre:
fires when Norway is neutral but pro-Allied
Leadwieght:
fires when Norway is neutral and pro-Axis

Does this mean Norway Decision comes anyway???


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Post #: 6
RE: DE oddities - 9/12/2017 1:23:39 PM   
Leadwieght

 

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Joined: 2/23/2017
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Hi Bill,
Thanks for pointing out DE644, which I had missed. So is the only difference b/t DE643 and DE644 the date when the invasion actually happens? And it's just a few days earlier when Norway is Allied-leaning?
Curious as to the rationale.
LW

(in reply to Amadeus)
Post #: 7
RE: DE oddities - 9/13/2017 1:56:36 PM   
Bill Runacre

 

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Joined: 7/22/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Amadeus

Bill Runacre:
fires when Norway is neutral but pro-Allied
Leadwieght:
fires when Norway is neutral and pro-Axis

Does this mean Norway Decision comes anyway???



Yes, as long as Norway is neutral, it will be presented as an option.

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Post #: 8
RE: DE oddities - 9/13/2017 2:00:10 PM   
Bill Runacre

 

Posts: 1813
Joined: 7/22/2013
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leadwieght

Hi Bill,
Thanks for pointing out DE644, which I had missed. So is the only difference b/t DE643 and DE644 the date when the invasion actually happens? And it's just a few days earlier when Norway is Allied-leaning?
Curious as to the rationale.
LW


They both take place on the same date (the problem with making changes to the game is remembering to update every place where the details are mentioned).

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Post #: 9
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