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RE: Soviets Activated....

 
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RE: Soviets Activated.... - 10/16/2018 2:29:03 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo




I beleive this accurate. Even if he had been prepared for the incursion (which he wasn't), it was too soon. Maybe, and it really is a maybe, IJ could take on the bear in mid-42 successfully. Never been done n a PBEM that I know of, so we have no evidence. I think it would be extremely difficult to pull off against a competent allied player, but maybe.
Maybe if you got CK early and then turned tot he bear, maybe. Clearly, if you take both China and SOV out of the game early, then '45 looks completely different.



NJP has done some work here (scen 2), in activating the Bear...Japan simply doesn't have the infrastructure to launch an early attack on the Bear, and Japan desperately needs to inflict substantial losses in the SRA and Burma and China before any attack.

Since this is a scenario one style game well enough said there.

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RE: Soviets Activated.... - 10/17/2018 10:08:15 AM   
PaxMondo


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Lost 2 attempts, will try again later.

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Pax

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RE: Soviets Activated.... - 10/17/2018 3:06:04 PM   
GetAssista

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo
Maybe if you got CK early and then turned tot he bear, maybe. Clearly, if you take both China and SOV out of the game early, then '45 looks completely different.

Only after CK taking, cause Japan would really need all the Chinese divisions to bottle up Soviets in the Vlad pocket and also restrict the Mongolia/Blagoveschensk groups. Soviets are the most potent Allied ground force up to maybe 44, and their artillery is simply the best. They can chew through a lot of stuff when concentrated. Goes without saying that timing to cut all the border RRs at start is also essential

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RE: Soviets Activated.... - 10/18/2018 12:57:39 PM   
PaxMondo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo
Maybe if you got CK early and then turned tot he bear, maybe. Clearly, if you take both China and SOV out of the game early, then '45 looks completely different.

Only after CK taking, cause Japan would really need all the Chinese divisions to bottle up Soviets in the Vlad pocket and also restrict the Mongolia/Blagoveschensk groups. Soviets are the most potent Allied ground force up to maybe 44, and their artillery is simply the best. They can chew through a lot of stuff when concentrated. Goes without saying that timing to cut all the border RRs at start is also essential

Exactly.
IJ Air force will be the determinant, it has to negate the SOV arty.
I have little doubt that tactically, this is achievable (taking the SOV out of the game like the CHI). BUT strategically will it work?
The supply cost is going to be enormous. The supply cost for CHI is already a huge burden on IJ. This is what will determine if this really works or not.

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RE: Soviets Activated.... - 10/18/2018 1:17:10 PM   
ITAKLinus

 

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Of course it doesn't


Urss can be a funny campaign but it doesn't provide precious oil to the jap.

What's even worse is that everything has a cost opportunity in this game and attacking Russia I think it's the very worse ration someone could achieve

India is, by far, the best place a Japanese can conquer. Economically speaking it's a sort of heaven, but it's horribly hard to capture.

Australia is the second best with respect to India. It doesn't provide huge economic strategic benefits but it's relatively easy to conquer.


Russia is terribly hard to capture and it doesn't provide economical benefits, so... what are we talking about?


Regarding China I am currently pursuing a different path. I have conquered everything out of CK plains and I am defending q line roughly at Kweyiang.
It much cheaper than attacking CK plains and it provides almost the same benefits.

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Francesco

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RE: Soviets Activated.... - 10/18/2018 2:26:38 PM   
adarbrauner

 

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Well actually in "my" mod Russian Siberian locations shall receive a very great boost of VP points, to try simulating the huge strategical and political effect of a successful Japanese intervention in the Russian war, and to make the endeavor more palatable and rewarding for the Japanese player;

however, I still hardly think I would take on Russia; all the resources and reserves, of the Army in particular, are needed to
try
winning the Western Allies (yes...believe it...yeah...);

but still... if and when the stalemate is reached in the Pacific and Indian Ocean...so I may think to use aptly the Manchurian army to try turning things to the Axis side, globally ;

< Message edited by adarbrauner -- 10/18/2018 2:29:28 PM >

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RE: Soviets Activated.... - 10/19/2018 1:29:57 AM   
PaxMondo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ITAKLinus

Of course it doesn't


Urss can be a funny campaign but it doesn't provide precious oil to the jap.

What's even worse is that everything has a cost opportunity in this game and attacking Russia I think it's the very worse ration someone could achieve

India is, by far, the best place a Japanese can conquer. Economically speaking it's a sort of heaven, but it's horribly hard to capture.

Australia is the second best with respect to India. It doesn't provide huge economic strategic benefits but it's relatively easy to conquer.


Russia is terribly hard to capture and it doesn't provide economical benefits, so... what are we talking about?


Regarding China I am currently pursuing a different path. I have conquered everything out of CK plains and I am defending q line roughly at Kweyiang.
It much cheaper than attacking CK plains and it provides almost the same benefits.

Its about fighting SOV in late 42 or in 45. In 42 they have little to no air force; IJ should be able to control the air in '42 if planned for.
Taking SOV out of the war by mid 43 … that means 2 of the largest AV armies assembled against IJ out of the picture.
I think that is quite a good reason to consider taking out the SOV.
Going for India after that? Yes, that might be a good idea … I agree, India has a lot of economic assets that can be seized.

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Post #: 3337
RE: Soviets Activated.... - 10/19/2018 1:32:17 AM   
PaxMondo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ITAKLinus
Regarding China I am currently pursuing a different path. I have conquered everything out of CK plains and I am defending q line roughly at Kweyiang.
It much cheaper than attacking CK plains and it provides almost the same benefits.

You may not have faced the CHI hordes in '44. Those +700 AV divs if they have supply are monsters. Coupled with SOV Armor and arty, they can smash through any defense IJ has.
So, you are not quite focused on the same aspects that I am ….

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Pax

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Post #: 3338
RE: Soviets Activated.... - 10/19/2018 1:48:35 AM   
adarbrauner

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo


Going for India after that? Yes, that might be a good idea … I agree, India has a lot of economic assets that can be seized.





You need a lot of PPs avaiable to do that, really a lot, depending on what mod and how large its pps allocation, nand on your set of HR regarding required expenditure of pps;
Me for myself, for example, play very conservatively, and require the expenditure of pps for any change of sector of competence, for both land and air units;

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Post #: 3339
RE: Soviets Activated.... - 10/19/2018 3:30:51 AM   
PaxMondo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: adarbrauner


quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo


Going for India after that? Yes, that might be a good idea … I agree, India has a lot of economic assets that can be seized.





You need a lot of PPs avaiable to do that, really a lot, depending on what mod and how large its pps allocation, nand on your set of HR regarding required expenditure of pps;
Me for myself, for example, play very conservatively, and require the expenditure of pps for any change of sector of competence, for both land and air units;

Yeah, but I'm talking about after both CHI and SOV have been taken out … 8/43 or later … by then you've had time to buy out pretty much what you want/need no matter what your rules are.
One advantage of going after SOV is that you don't need to buy out the CHI/MAN forces … you can focus for a while on the Gen Def HQ forces.
Then you can ask about do you need to pay PP's for MAN troops that go overland to India AFTER SOV is contained. The MAN assignment is no longer reasonable, discussion with players etc.


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Pax

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RE: Soviets Activated.... - 10/20/2018 2:46:39 PM   
Lowpe


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9/30/42

A few raids on Cam Ranh Bay generate several naval engagements, and the Allies swamp the route with subs...getting shots on two different carriers and missing. Soo many subs.




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Post #: 3341
RE: Soviets Activated.... - 10/20/2018 2:48:36 PM   
Lowpe


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Naval search...I knew there was PT boats, but was hoping the sweeping destroyers would catch them, and the big girl here would catch a cruiser force.

Not so, two engagements with massed PT boats and Yamato also puts the finishing touches on the AKE TF attacked earlier by the sweeping destroyer squadrons.




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Post #: 3342
RE: Soviets Activated.... - 10/20/2018 2:51:07 PM   
Lowpe


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Pakse falls to massed allied tanks shock attacking, Tourane holds barely (even with massed naval bombardments), and Temuloh fall (north of Singers).

Allied land strength is simply overwhelming.

Another good day in the inflicting losses on the Allies...

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Post #: 3343
RE: Soviets Activated.... - 10/22/2018 6:55:47 PM   
Miller


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Just skimmed over this for the first time. Kudos for going with the accidental Soviet activation, I don't think many others would have done so! Makes me feel better about the current position I am in in my game...

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