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The Accidental War Obvert vs Lowpe - 3/13/2017 8:53:59 PM   
Lowpe

 

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In blossom today, then scattered;

Life is so like a delicate flower.

How can one expect the fragrance to last forever?


Admiral Onishi Takijiro (1891-1945)






HR:


Night bombing port/airfield:

50 planes/target for the entire war.

First turn:

No restrictions on port strikes for IJ
No new TFs for Allies but existing may move
No air groups changing location, but can change CAP settings (Allies)
No crazy deep *TF moves (Mersing) (Japan)

PP for borders:

Minus Thai and Burmese units

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 6/23/2017 3:06:39 PM >
Post #: 1
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/13/2017 9:23:07 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 13716
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: online
The Cactus Airforce
will be in business soon
****ly business!

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 2
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/13/2017 9:23:32 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 13716
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: online
Dang it, that aint a dirty word!

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 3
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/13/2017 9:24:21 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 13716
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
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P*r*I*c*k*l*y

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 4
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/13/2017 9:24:27 PM   
Drakanel

 

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I will be following this side as well XD

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 5
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/13/2017 10:45:27 PM   
obvert


Posts: 10211
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From: PDX (and now) London, UK
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Looking forward to seeing your plan develop from the beginning this time!

Bowing out now. Let the logistics and R & D begin. Sorry to have to miss it!

_____________________________


"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm." - Winston Churchill

(in reply to Drakanel)
Post #: 6
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 12:36:15 AM   
Lowpe

 

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Reduced cargo capacities in this mod. Let's take a look.

Aden and Lima are the primary resource haulers...and will need to pull 82,100 resources a day into the Home Islands. More than 35,000 a day from Hokkaido.

They will be up to the job. Those that don't haul, some will go to AKE and the rest idle.

Yusen will all convert to AK-t or AK when available.

Husimi and Kyushu will all convert to AR/AS/AV. None will be left for hauling.

Of the other cargo ships most will be mothballed, some will go AKE/AD/AG/AGP. In fact, there will be a good number of AKE/AG/AD/AGP conversions.






Attachment (1)

(in reply to obvert)
Post #: 7
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 12:42:40 AM   
Lowpe

 

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In doing the first turn, ugh, I try to remember it is a long, long war. The first thing I try to do is protect my ships from needless loss.

Ships without escorts like those that start at Saigon usually are easy prey for the Dutch subs. And they are really good ships, too doing pretty much meaningless work.

The other area, is to search the invasion forces and strip out the loaded tankers! No need to hit the beaches with tankers loaded with fuel especially when the Dutch have CD guns!




Attachment (1)

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 8
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 12:50:22 AM   
Lowpe

 

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xAKLs.

The most important are the Kiso which turn into 3 point ASW PB's and the Tosu that become ACM. Other can become PB in 1943, and AG or AGP or AMc etc now.

These ships, are from from junks, and usually it is easy to get their VP back over the course of the war.






Attachment (1)

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 9
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 1:45:04 AM   
MakeeLearn

 

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You're welcome, and good luck.




Attachment (1)

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 10
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 1:54:29 AM   
Jorge_Stanbury


Posts: 3082
Joined: 2/29/2012
From: Lima and Toronto
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Looking forward to see your aircraft production plans

Aden: How many are you planning to convert to xAK-t ?
I think it shine in this role, just big enough to carry a battalion, small enough to fit in a level 1 port

AK/ AK-t are not needed yet, I like to keep them safe until the end of the amphibious bonus.. I mean I won't unload troops already embarked, but after their 1st use, they go into hiding until needed

Do you plan to use your Kisos as escort? or just ASW?
Ansyu-C?

< Message edited by Jorge_Stanbury -- 3/14/2017 1:58:50 AM >

(in reply to MakeeLearn)
Post #: 11
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 3:35:30 AM   
Lowpe

 

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Great graphic Makee!

Jorge: Ansyu go PB. Kiso ASW in choke points in shallows and slow escorts.

Adens: not many to xak-t. The Yusen will carry that burden primarily. They can't convert to AK for quite a while yet, but that will be their focus.

Tankers: Most are going to Fusan or Formosa for the first part of the expansion.








(in reply to Jorge_Stanbury)
Post #: 12
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 3:42:16 AM   
Lowpe

 

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Plane builds:

I am going to play a very Oscar & Tojo Lite game. Going to shoot for Tony and Frank primary Army fighters. Zero/Sam for the KB; Jack 70% and George 30%.

Strong Nick and Randy FB program.

Still mulling endgame fighter planes. I figure I can afford one to r&d and there are at least two great choices in the Shinden and Ki94II.

Kamikaze: Ki115a and Ki115b for the Army. For the Navy I am still mulling over my choices.

I am going to play with the spreadsheet some and see what I need to achieve...




(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 13
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 7:16:13 AM   
Aurorus

 

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Good luck to both of you. How are you going to play a "Tojo and Oscar lite" game? Those are your only options for fighters in 1942. Or do you mean Tojo and Oscar lite R&D?

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 14
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 12:22:35 PM   
Lowpe

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aurorus

Good luck to both of you. How are you going to play a "Tojo and Oscar lite" game? Those are your only options for fighters in 1942. Or do you mean Tojo and Oscar lite R&D?



Correct, research lite for Oscar and Tojo. I have other plans I think. I have gone thru and done a pretty standard r&d for fighters, night fighters, Judy and Jill. Now I have slightly over 30 factories to ponder on.


(in reply to Aurorus)
Post #: 15
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 12:46:08 PM   
Andav

 

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Looking forward to this one as well.

quote:

Strong Nick and Randy FB program


I read this as "Strong Nick and Randy Fan Boy program". It took a minute for my brain to convert it to Fighter Bomber. I need more coffee.


Wa

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 16
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 1:16:19 PM   
Lowpe

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Andav


Looking forward to this one as well.

quote:

Strong Nick and Randy FB program


I read this as "Strong Nick and Randy Fan Boy program". It took a minute for my brain to convert it to Fighter Bomber. I need more coffee.


Wa



Either works. I have three size 30 factories going after Randy which is a huge investment. I plan on converting quite a few of the Light Bomber sentai over to fighter bombers.



(in reply to Andav)
Post #: 17
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 2:23:19 PM   
mind_messing

 

Posts: 1677
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From: Glasgow, Scotland
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Plane builds:

I am going to play a very Oscar & Tojo Lite game. Going to shoot for Tony and Frank primary Army fighters. Zero/Sam for the KB; Jack 70% and George 30%.

Strong Nick and Randy FB program.

Still mulling endgame fighter planes. I figure I can afford one to r&d and there are at least two great choices in the Shinden and Ki94II.

Kamikaze: Ki115a and Ki115b for the Army. For the Navy I am still mulling over my choices.

I am going to play with the spreadsheet some and see what I need to achieve...






My two cents:

Minimal Oscar and Tojo is a good call. They have some value later in the war, but not much.

Tony and Frank is a great combination.

Regarding the Zero, I'd try to push the Zero line to the M8 model ASAP then shift everything to the Sam. Sam is the best multi-role the IJN gets IMO.

Is the performance increase between the Nick and Randy fighter bomber worth the supply? I always felt that there was little to choose between the Randy B and Nick models.

The Randy fighter (A model) is a much better candidate IMO, as you can convert regular fighter squadrons to the Randy A for sqaudrons that are in effect fighter-bomber squadrons.

Shinden and Ki-94 are the only two viable late-war fighter airframes IMO. The jets are vanity.

For kami purposes: Ki-115a and b are huge. Prepare a massive production line. For the IJN, it has to be the Toka - this is one of the hidden jewels of the IJN lineup, and arguably one of the most important non-fighter airframes. Bringing it as far forward is possible is absolutely key, as otherwise your IJN kami squadrons (which are bigger and hold more pilots than the IJA ones) will be stuck with the crappy trainers. Again, massive production lines. The only other option is the Kikka, but that's too late to be of any use. Any other airframe uses PP's to convert.



(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 18
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 2:38:37 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 21683
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: online
Just popping in (without reading) to say I am going to be reading Obvert's side on this one and maybe offering some bad advice there. I figure he'll need all he can get!

Good luck!!!

_____________________________


(in reply to mind_messing)
Post #: 19
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 3:28:09 PM   
Lowpe

 

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Joined: 2/25/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Plane builds:

I am going to play a very Oscar & Tojo Lite game. Going to shoot for Tony and Frank primary Army fighters. Zero/Sam for the KB; Jack 70% and George 30%.

Strong Nick and Randy FB program.

Still mulling endgame fighter planes. I figure I can afford one to r&d and there are at least two great choices in the Shinden and Ki94II.

Kamikaze: Ki115a and Ki115b for the Army. For the Navy I am still mulling over my choices.

I am going to play with the spreadsheet some and see what I need to achieve...






My two cents:

Minimal Oscar and Tojo is a good call. They have some value later in the war, but not much.

Tony and Frank is a great combination.

Regarding the Zero, I'd try to push the Zero line to the M8 model ASAP then shift everything to the Sam. Sam is the best multi-role the IJN gets IMO.

Is the performance increase between the Nick and Randy fighter bomber worth the supply? I always felt that there was little to choose between the Randy B and Nick models.

The Randy fighter (A model) is a much better candidate IMO, as you can convert regular fighter squadrons to the Randy A for sqaudrons that are in effect fighter-bomber squadrons.

Shinden and Ki-94 are the only two viable late-war fighter airframes IMO. The jets are vanity.

For kami purposes: Ki-115a and b are huge. Prepare a massive production line. For the IJN, it has to be the Toka - this is one of the hidden jewels of the IJN lineup, and arguably one of the most important non-fighter airframes. Bringing it as far forward is possible is absolutely key, as otherwise your IJN kami squadrons (which are bigger and hold more pilots than the IJA ones) will be stuck with the crappy trainers. Again, massive production lines. The only other option is the Kikka, but that's too late to be of any use. Any other airframe uses PP's to convert.





Thanks MM for the input.

The Ki1115a is getting a lot of research. The Kikka is interesting, and I wonder if it could get thru the deathstar cap, but in looking at the actual squadrons that upgrade to it, after only a quick look, it looks like there are only 3 until mid 45.

The Toka is very interesting.

I agree about the 94 and the Shinden, but I think the Shinden wins.

Randy Fighter...hm. Maybe, I have read bad things about it. The Randy FB will be my 2nd tier air defense.

Night Fighters I did put one factory on Myrt, but going with the standards Nick, Irving, Frances, and Peggy. Overall a big investment here to maximize my night fighters.







(in reply to mind_messing)
Post #: 20
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 3:30:01 PM   
Lowpe

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Just popping in (without reading) to say I am going to be reading Obvert's side on this one and maybe offering some bad advice there. I figure he'll need all he can get!

Good luck!!!


As long as the advice is bad!

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 21
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 3:31:10 PM   
Lowpe

 

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Status:

Putting the finishing touches on turn 1.

I have to examine engines.

But other than that pretty good to go.

Industry and ship builds for turn 2.


(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 22
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 3:47:52 PM   
mind_messing

 

Posts: 1677
Joined: 10/28/2013
From: Glasgow, Scotland
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe


quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Plane builds:

I am going to play a very Oscar & Tojo Lite game. Going to shoot for Tony and Frank primary Army fighters. Zero/Sam for the KB; Jack 70% and George 30%.

Strong Nick and Randy FB program.

Still mulling endgame fighter planes. I figure I can afford one to r&d and there are at least two great choices in the Shinden and Ki94II.

Kamikaze: Ki115a and Ki115b for the Army. For the Navy I am still mulling over my choices.

I am going to play with the spreadsheet some and see what I need to achieve...






My two cents:

Minimal Oscar and Tojo is a good call. They have some value later in the war, but not much.

Tony and Frank is a great combination.

Regarding the Zero, I'd try to push the Zero line to the M8 model ASAP then shift everything to the Sam. Sam is the best multi-role the IJN gets IMO.

Is the performance increase between the Nick and Randy fighter bomber worth the supply? I always felt that there was little to choose between the Randy B and Nick models.

The Randy fighter (A model) is a much better candidate IMO, as you can convert regular fighter squadrons to the Randy A for sqaudrons that are in effect fighter-bomber squadrons.

Shinden and Ki-94 are the only two viable late-war fighter airframes IMO. The jets are vanity.

For kami purposes: Ki-115a and b are huge. Prepare a massive production line. For the IJN, it has to be the Toka - this is one of the hidden jewels of the IJN lineup, and arguably one of the most important non-fighter airframes. Bringing it as far forward is possible is absolutely key, as otherwise your IJN kami squadrons (which are bigger and hold more pilots than the IJA ones) will be stuck with the crappy trainers. Again, massive production lines. The only other option is the Kikka, but that's too late to be of any use. Any other airframe uses PP's to convert.





Thanks MM for the input.

The Ki1115a is getting a lot of research. The Kikka is interesting, and I wonder if it could get thru the deathstar cap, but in looking at the actual squadrons that upgrade to it, after only a quick look, it looks like there are only 3 until mid 45.

The Toka is very interesting.

I agree about the 94 and the Shinden, but I think the Shinden wins.

Randy Fighter...hm. Maybe, I have read bad things about it. The Randy FB will be my 2nd tier air defense.

Night Fighters I did put one factory on Myrt, but going with the standards Nick, Irving, Frances, and Peggy. Overall a big investment here to maximize my night fighters.



If it's PDU on then I think the IJN training squadrons can convert, though if you're using one of the Scens that modify upgrade paths then YMMV.

Toka I think is essential, if not more so than the Ki-115. Bigger IJN squadrons = more kamis flying. If you go for a big Kami game then you'll need it.

With the Ki-94 and the Shinden, I think you need both. The 93 is your fast, high altitude plane, while the Shinden works best down low. The two compliement each other really nicely. Ki-83 is a more expensive and less effective alternative, but has excellent offensive characteristics.

My line of thought regarding the Randy fighter is that you can convert regular fighter squadrons to use it without paying PP and pilot EXP decreases from the FB>F switch. The difference between the various Randy models is pretty minimal at any rate, and IIRC the Randy has the best armament loadout. Randy fighter has done alright by me, both in the day and at night against 4E's.

With NF, the jury is still out for me. I think in any future game I'll be considering durability and armour above anything else, as my NF's love dying in droves. I basically use my IJA FB squadrons as NF squadrons


(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 23
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 4:09:10 PM   
Andav

 

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Joined: 5/8/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe


quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Just popping in (without reading) to say I am going to be reading Obvert's side on this one and maybe offering some bad advice there. I figure he'll need all he can get!

Good luck!!!


As long as the advice is bad!



Looks like you will be able to leave CRB WIDE open! And Pegu of course ...

Wa

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 24
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 5:02:40 PM   
Lowpe

 

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First turn is away...

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 25
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 5:08:58 PM   
Aurorus

 

Posts: 763
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I agree almost ocmpletely with your R&D program, and to think that we debated this very topic on Xargun's thread. Yours is probably the R&D program that I would pursue in a PDU:ON game. You will outclass the allies in 43 when it counts the most. If you go Randy, Nick, et al, why not research the Frances night bomber? Randy and Nick research can produce a competent night-fighter force throughout 44.

< Message edited by Aurorus -- 3/14/2017 5:10:16 PM >

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 26
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 7:36:41 PM   
Zorch

 

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Is there a table/xls that allows easy comparison of planes and engines? Outside of the databases.

(in reply to Aurorus)
Post #: 27
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 7:42:44 PM   
Xargun

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorch

Is there a table/xls that allows easy comparison of planes and engines? Outside of the databases.


I always make my own. I have one for the Japanese side for DaIronBabes (30B) if anyone wants. You might be able to pull one out of Tracker as well.



< Message edited by Xargun -- 3/14/2017 7:43:12 PM >

(in reply to Zorch)
Post #: 28
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 7:44:26 PM   
Zorch

 

Posts: 2806
Joined: 3/7/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Xargun

quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorch

Is there a table/xls that allows easy comparison of planes and engines? Outside of the databases.


I always make my own. I have one for the Japanese side for DaIronBabes (30B) if anyone wants. You might be able to pull one out of Tracker as well.



Yes, that would be great...

(in reply to Xargun)
Post #: 29
RE: In blossom today, then scattered; Lowpe (J) vs Obve... - 3/14/2017 7:47:24 PM   
Xargun

 

Posts: 3365
Joined: 2/14/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorch


quote:

ORIGINAL: Xargun

quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorch

Is there a table/xls that allows easy comparison of planes and engines? Outside of the databases.


I always make my own. I have one for the Japanese side for DaIronBabes (30B) if anyone wants. You might be able to pull one out of Tracker as well.



Yes, that would be great...


PM me your email. I have IJA and IJN in separate spreadsheets

(in reply to Zorch)
Post #: 30
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