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Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes

 
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Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/27/2016 8:39:12 PM   
Matti Kuokkanen

 

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On my short Christmas vacation (3 days) I've marathoned through XCOM: Enemy Unknown. I'm now on last mission which I hope to get through tomorrow. I have totally enjoyed of the ride. Now I have a question: what game do I play next? I know there are whole bunch of clones, and original X-COM series still rocks hard. I call on your opinions on the matter: what do you recommend me to play? I myself am considering the following:

UFO: Enemy Unknown (original title), aka X-COM: UFO Defense
Friend handed me a (illegitimate) copy and I used to play heck out of it on my father's computer with 40 MHz 386 processor. If I get back to it, I'll reinforce it with OpenXcom. I could go straight to mod X-PirateZ (practically a sequel starting in year 2600 or so).

UFO: Extraterrestrials
Bought it from Steam and I have played it a bit. I got frustrated when aliens seem to spot & kill my troops from outside of visual range. I gave up on it, but I still consider trying it again. But there are other games to consider.

UFO: Alien Invasion
I used to play this one through (I think) many years ago. At the time it was pretty much linear run of predetermined scenarios in linear order (presumably) without any variation. I tried new version some years ago, and it had come a way. In version of that time I got one certain small map (with a small house & garage) several times over, and in one large map I spent probably over a hour looking for the last surviving alien hiding somewhere in the tunnels underground. I didn't have enough patience with it. Has it got better since then?

Xenonauts
I've seen this mentioned more often than aforementioned UFO games, but haven't played it yet. Would this game be the winner?

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RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/27/2016 9:09:06 PM   
jcjordan

 

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To me the original XCOM Terror from the Deep is best version. Xenonauts is a pretty good redo overall of the system though there are some things I don't like about it

(in reply to Matti Kuokkanen)
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RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/27/2016 9:13:23 PM   
Walloc

 

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U dont mention the follow up to XCOM: Enemy Unknown. XCOM2 that came out in feb and have huge amount of mods made by the fan base and dedicated studios since. Was wondering if that was on purpose you dont mention this title or if you werent aware of it.

Futher there is a expansion to XCOM: Enemy Unknown, called Enemy within.
Add to that, that there is a mod to Enemy within, called Long War. It has a devoted fan base and the mod totally overhaul the game. Notice, its not some thing that can be completed in 3 day. You litterally have to play hundres of mission to complete it.

Just wondering if u were aware of this,
Rasmus

(in reply to Matti Kuokkanen)
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RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/27/2016 10:09:56 PM   
Matti Kuokkanen

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jcjordan

XCOM Terror from the Deep

You've got a typo there. What you mean is X-COM: Terror From the Deep. There is a difference between spelling of X-COM and XCOM: one has - and other does not. I know: grammar nazism, but that - (or lack thereof) helps us to make difference between the 2 series. Something to keep in mind.

And yes, Walloc, I have Enemy Within, but I thought it is a sequel. Just yesterday I had read it is more like what Beyond the Sword is to the Civilization IV. I should have played Enemy Within instead of Enemy Unknown. I have a vague idea about The Long War mod (months to build a Firestorm). I know about XCOM 2, I have read a review about it, and I have read reviews about its mods. So yes, I left those intentionally out. XCOM: Enemy Unknown is fun & entertaining, but I'm looking for some variety now, not a sequel. Otherwise XCOM looks to me as simple & straightforward as Battle Academy while X-COM, UFO, and Xenonauts are closer to complexity of Steel Panthers.

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RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/27/2016 10:30:20 PM   
Walloc

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Matti Kuokkanen

I have a vague idea about The Long War mod (months to build a Firestorm). I know about XCOM 2, I have read a review about it, and I have read reviews about its mods. So yes, I left those intentionally out. XCOM: Enemy Unknown is fun & entertaining, but I'm looking for some variety now, not a sequel. Otherwise XCOM looks to me as simple & straightforward as Battle Academy while X-COM, UFO, and Xenonauts are closer to complexity of Steel Panthers.


Ok, just so u know that IMO XCOM2 is a bigger leap from Xcom/Enemy Within in many ways than IMO from the original to XCOM.

XCOM2 introduce a timer in most missions tho not all. That makes the tactical game feel very different. You'r under another kinda pressure that makes u hafta think much more offensivly than in XCOM. U cant rely on waiting for overwatch traps and most seem to do in XCOM1, unless u get a timer extending mod(which i dont recommend).

Just saying,
Rasmus

(in reply to Matti Kuokkanen)
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RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/27/2016 11:25:09 PM   
VPaulus

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Matti Kuokkanen

Xenonauts
I've seen this mentioned more often than aforementioned UFO games, but haven't played it yet. Would this game be the winner?

It's the closer you will get to the original game.

(in reply to Matti Kuokkanen)
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RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/28/2016 3:18:28 AM   
aaatoysandmore

 

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quote:

Xenonauts
I've seen this mentioned more often than aforementioned UFO games, but haven't played it yet. Would this game be the winner?


Most of the XCom series is a bunch of repeats with better graphics now but, the old school is still my favorite because you get more to play with in the form of men and tanks. "Terror from the Deep" has always been my favorite. I liked the underwater stuff. "Enemy Unknown" comes in a close second, but, when I got "Enemy Within" I was sorely disappointed because it's "Enemy Unknown" with a few perks and the same mission line. It's more DLC than an expansion to me. XCom 2 I am not a fan of because they basically make Xcom Unknown with timed missions and different graphics. Same game, same game on rails and not much different from 1.

I think you'll like Xenonauts better.

EDIT: In relation to the timed missons in Xcom 2. Most of us play games to "relax" the last thing I want to do is be rushed in a turn based game because then it begins to feel like an RTS game.

< Message edited by aaatoysandmore -- 12/28/2016 3:20:50 AM >

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RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/28/2016 4:30:59 AM   
Ranger33

 

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Xenonauts is the winner if you want to play something like the original, but not actually deal with the clunky UI and tedious bits.

There is a community overhaul mod that you can switch to on the Steam version (Right click, properties, betas, pick Community from the list) which improves the game in a lot of ways (quality of life improvements, more maps, better balance, AI, loading times, etc). Official development has mostly ended because they are working on Xenonauts 2, but the devs are nice enough to semi-officially support this community version which is still actively updated.

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RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/28/2016 3:50:57 PM   
Walloc

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: aaatoysandmore
XCom 2 I am not a fan of because they basically make Xcom Unknown with timed missions and different graphics. Same game, same game on rails and not much different from 1.

EDIT: In relation to the timed missons in Xcom 2. Most of us play games to "relax" the last thing I want to do is be rushed in a turn based game because then it begins to feel like an RTS game.


We will just hafta disagree :-). I dont get the feeling XCOM2 forums that its mostly players wanting to "relax". In XCOM1 the best tactics was to overwatch camp, 99% of the time. Just press overwatch and go away for 5 mins to come back to see what happen. Tedious to me. I find XCOM2 much more fun. The timer forces u to come up with tactics and idea's to deal with the tactical side of the game.

I agree that the stategical side is very much on rails as with XCOM1.


Kind regards,
Rasmus

(in reply to aaatoysandmore)
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RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/28/2016 4:56:36 PM   
Jim D Burns


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I always liked X-com Apocalypse best of all the old titles. The ability to change combat to be turn based or real time made the issue of searching the multi deck ships in Terror from the Deep (would be my second choice) for that last alien hiding in a closet less painful as you didn't have to constantly hit end turn over and over to finish a map.

The story was also good and the factions had a lot of work put into their lore to help the games immersion.

Jim

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RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/28/2016 5:19:02 PM   
Matti Kuokkanen

 

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Why nobody hasn't said anything about OpenXcom and UFO: Extraterrestrials by now?

[edit]
I just got through the last deployment of XCOM: Enemy Unknown. Zhang got mind controlled and I just killed him. Also I had at least 2 deployments with turn limits: train job (the beacons thing) and disarming a bomb on the bridge.

< Message edited by Matti Kuokkanen -- 12/28/2016 5:21:42 PM >


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You know what they say, don't you? About how us MechWarriors are the modern knights, how warfare has become civilized now that we have to abide by conventions and rules of war. Don't believe it.

MekWars

(in reply to Jim D Burns)
Post #: 11
RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/28/2016 7:31:23 PM   
Matti Kuokkanen

 

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I just fired up UFO: Extraterrestrials for a change. I started on easy, and it is... easy: aliens don't shoot at my troops from outside of LOS anymore. However I've also watched let's play videos of Xenonauts and that seems to have some interesting features: better weapon and equipment selection (machine gun, sniper rifle, riot shield...), radius of radars are visible, tactical aerial combat with better detail (and realism) than in any other game (within this category), soldiers can take cover with colour coding for quality of cover, and soldiers seem to have bit more LOS. So it looks like my choice is between Xenonauts and OpenXcom & mods. Mods like X-PirateZ. What? It looks fun!

If I go for OpenXcom without X-PirateZ, what mods do you recommend?

_____________________________

You know what they say, don't you? About how us MechWarriors are the modern knights, how warfare has become civilized now that we have to abide by conventions and rules of war. Don't believe it.

MekWars

(in reply to Matti Kuokkanen)
Post #: 12
RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/28/2016 8:52:49 PM   
stormbringer3

 

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XCOM2 is my most recent purchase and it is a really tough game. I really like it. I still have the origional XCOM. If you want a challenge I recommend it.

(in reply to Matti Kuokkanen)
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RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/29/2016 2:31:30 AM   
Agathosdaimon


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the original xcom - i have tried this, i really want to get into it, and the UFO games too but i am not sure really what i am supposed to be doing - there is so much to do in these games

also incidentally, has anyone here and experience with the old games Breach 2 and Breach 3? were these any good? they sound similar to Xcom yes?

(in reply to stormbringer3)
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RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/29/2016 4:20:43 AM   
Matti Kuokkanen

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Agathosdaimon

the original xcom - i have tried this, i really want to get into it, and the UFO games too but i am not sure really what i am supposed to be doing - there is so much to do in these games

Are you talking about X-COM or XCOM?

_____________________________

You know what they say, don't you? About how us MechWarriors are the modern knights, how warfare has become civilized now that we have to abide by conventions and rules of war. Don't believe it.

MekWars

(in reply to Agathosdaimon)
Post #: 15
RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/29/2016 9:07:54 AM   
Agathosdaimon


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oh my, i didnt know there is a hypenated and non-hyphenated version specifically. I am referring to the initial one, the one


(in reply to Matti Kuokkanen)
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RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/29/2016 2:24:12 PM   
Matti Kuokkanen

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Agathosdaimon

oh my, i didnt know there is a hypenated and non-hyphenated version specifically. I am referring to the initial one, the one

Yes, that is X-COM. If you don't have much experience about such games, I recommend you to start with XCOM: Enemy Unknown (or Enemy Within). It has good tutorial, less soldiers on the field (in X-COM: UFO Defense it can go up to 20, maybe even over), and probably less aliens per deployment. Cover system is easy to understand and soldiers & aliens can do some sensible stunts, like jump over small obstacles and open the door from the side where wall provides cover. Simply put: XCOM is beginner friendly while X-COM can be overwhelming. X-COM with all its faults is better game, and OpenXcom makes it even better (get it if you haven't already).

What comes to myself, it isn't easy to make a choice from good games. So I'll get them all. Xenonauts and X-COM collection are in sale over at Steam, so why shouldn't I grab them all for dirt-cheap while I still can? I'm gonna start with Xenonauts, then move on to X-COM series reinforced with OpenXcom and OpenTFTD. I'll get back to UFO: Alien Invasion when it is ready & done ( = isn't patched anymore). UFO: Extraterrestrials is said to be bottom performer, so I'll ditch it.

_____________________________

You know what they say, don't you? About how us MechWarriors are the modern knights, how warfare has become civilized now that we have to abide by conventions and rules of war. Don't believe it.

MekWars

(in reply to Agathosdaimon)
Post #: 17
RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 12/31/2016 12:06:51 PM   
gazdadude

 

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Xenonauts is awesome it has the feel of the origionals been enjoying the new xcom so far might try 2 aswel

(in reply to Matti Kuokkanen)
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RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 1/1/2017 8:01:35 AM   
Matti Kuokkanen

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: gazdadude

Xenonauts is awesome it has the feel of the origionals

Xenonauts has its issues. Let's see...

quote:

Played about 120 hours of it last November - was still broken then.

Here's a short list:
* Enemies outside of FoW didn't respact terrain obstacles.
* SO. MANY. MAP. BUGS. - That's the downside of an engine that isn't actually 3D, but 2D with dice-rolls.
* Enemies changed AI routines based on player unit proximity, regardless of whether or not player unit was ever spotted.
* Enemies had access to too much information:
* AI is aware of player unit FoV regardless of whether player units have ever been spotted.
* AI is aware of player unit reaction ability, often walking past units it knows can't react to shoot someone outside of its visible range.
* Everything related to enemy PSI - especially Dread. Dread might be the worst game design decision I have ever come across in my near 40 years of gaming.

He doesn't say is that in vanilla game or in Community Edition. Community Edition is a mod which is recommended even by the game's developers. If you enjoy of the game despite of its shortcomings (every game has some), you might be interested about X-Division mod:
quote:

Mod forum topic: http://www.goldhawkinteractive.com/forums/index.php?/topic/13414-165xce-v0342-x-division-099-beta/&page=1

Forum Steam page: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=741289983&searchtext=

Youtube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCCtS8rPsZAKtG5e-gn5n_pQ


_____________________________

You know what they say, don't you? About how us MechWarriors are the modern knights, how warfare has become civilized now that we have to abide by conventions and rules of war. Don't believe it.

MekWars

(in reply to gazdadude)
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RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 1/2/2017 10:46:59 PM   
Dorb


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I have Fantasy Flight XCOM the Board game, but have not had a chance to round up folks to play it yet. And the expansion just came out for it.

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RE: Best of X-COM, XCOM, and the likes - 1/4/2017 8:11:52 AM   
Agathosdaimon


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so much to try and so little time always! I have been vicariously enjoying some X-COM in the background on the youtube channel Yogscast Live

I quite like the gaming channels that take on old games and who converse and give commentary along the way.

Of course seeing someone else play it still makes me want to play it, the AI enemy certainly seems quite good

(in reply to Dorb)
Post #: 21
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