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RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 12/2/2016 12:12:27 AM   
Commander Cody


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From: Seoul, Korea
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bomccarthy


The real monster was to be the V-1710-E27 turbocompound engine. Developed for the stillborn P-63H, this had an exhaust-driven turbine which fed power directly back to the crankshaft. The single example built by Allison developed 2,800 hp on the test stand. Turbocompounding was later used by Wright in the R-3350 radial, which developed 3,700 hp in most applications. GM offered an Allison turbocompound diesel in some of its long-haul truck applications until about 3-4 years ago.

Turbo-compounding was a reliability nightmare for airliners in the 50s. One reason why the DC-6 was doing Caribbean narco runs long after the DC-7 was retired was the Double Wasp engine was far more reliable than the Wright Turbo Compound.

Cheers,
CC

_____________________________

Beer, because barley makes lousy bread.

(in reply to bomccarthy)
Post #: 31
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 12/2/2016 9:07:10 AM   
Denniss

 

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I consider the basic Allison V1710 design to be superior to the Merlin, just the supercharging became an issue in latewar. Probably due to US fixation of Turbocharging Allison was neither ordered nor had intention to develop a Higher-alt supercharging system until it was too late.
Considering some comments from warbird maintainers the Merlin engines are not easy to maintain whereas the Allison is rather easy to do so.

(in reply to Commander Cody)
Post #: 32
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 12/2/2016 8:57:04 PM   
bomccarthy


Posts: 232
Joined: 9/6/2013
From: L.A.
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Commander Cody


quote:

ORIGINAL: bomccarthy


The real monster was to be the V-1710-E27 turbocompound engine. Developed for the stillborn P-63H, this had an exhaust-driven turbine which fed power directly back to the crankshaft. The single example built by Allison developed 2,800 hp on the test stand. Turbocompounding was later used by Wright in the R-3350 radial, which developed 3,700 hp in most applications. GM offered an Allison turbocompound diesel in some of its long-haul truck applications until about 3-4 years ago.

Turbo-compounding was a reliability nightmare for airliners in the 50s. One reason why the DC-6 was doing Caribbean narco runs long after the DC-7 was retired was the Double Wasp engine was far more reliable than the Wright Turbo Compound.

Cheers,
CC


Turbo compounding was a reliability nightmare, but it was more feasible than the P&W R-4360 (long-distance route Stratocruisers often arrived at their destinations with one or more engines shut down). The smaller DC-6 didn't carry as many passengers and couldn't handle many of the transcontinental routes flown by the DC-7 and Super Constellation, which were replaced by the 707 and DC-8. One irony - the DC-7's range was dictated by the capacity of its engine oil reservoirs, not its full capacity. The R-3350 burned so much oil that the DC-7 ran out of lubricant before it ran out of fuel. Yet, it was still the longest-ranged airliner until jets took over.

(in reply to Commander Cody)
Post #: 33
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 12/2/2016 9:38:37 PM   
bomccarthy


Posts: 232
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From: L.A.
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Commander Cody


quote:

ORIGINAL: bomccarthy

A lot of veteran pilots liked the P-39, including Chuck Yeager, who said he would have willingly gone to battle in one. More inexperienced pilots feared the light touch of its controls (a feature that veteran pilots really liked). In addition to its adverse spin characteristics, one handling problem was tied to the cannon - as its ammo was used up, the plane's c.g. shifted to the rear, until it eventually went past 1/4 MAC (mean aerodynamic chord), which seriously affected stability in most maneuvers. Some aviation historians attribute this as one source of the legends that the P-39 could flip end-over-end if pushed too far. This points to one advantage of locating guns and ammunition in the wings - the c.g. remains within 1/4 MAC as the ammunition is expended.

The P-51 had a similar problem when the 85-gallon fuel tank was added behind the cockpit early in the production of the P-51B. Until at least half that fuel was burned, the c.g. was behind 1/4 MAC. This made the plane difficult to fly early in a mission and a number of green pilots found out the hard way that the plane needed to be treated with extra respect. However, these losses were considered a necessary price for the ability to reach Berlin from English bases.

Do you have any books you can recommend that discuss these issues? I love that stuff.

Cheers,
CC


I think the best single source for US fighters is Francis H. Dean, America's One Hundred Thousand (U.S. Production of Fighters of World War Two). Dean received his engineering degree from MIT and worked for Curtiss-Wright and Boeing for more than 30 years; he is also a member of the American Aviation Historical Society. The book is somewhat pricey ($60-70), but it is very thorough and relies on primary sources (flight test results, especially from military and manufacturers flight test data, and fighter conferences at Patuxent River in 1944 (attended by USN and USAAF pilots)). It is also great for comparing manufacturing and operational timelines, and has a lot of detail on design and construction of each plane. Dean discusses the issue of the c.g. outside 1/4 MAC in the P-39 and P-51 (it also may have affected the P-63). Keeping the c.g. within 1/4 MAC was the reason for Chance Vought moving the F4U cockpit rearward when the Navy wanted the fuel tanks moved from the wings to the fuselage.

A good source for P-39 information is John Stanaway and George Miller, P-39 Airacobra Aces of World War 2 (Osprey Publishing).

The best single source for Allied piston engine information is Graham White, Allied Aircraft Piston Engines of World War II (SAE International). This is written from an engineer's perspective, but even someone with a liberal arts and law degree who was a minor automotive gearhead in his youth (me) could follow it. It breaks down each engine used and also describes the engines that didn't make it (especially the US "hyper" engines).

A broader source is Bill Gunston, The Development of Piston Aero Engines. Gunston is probably well-known to many as a British aviation historian and he delves into the overall evolution of aircraft piston engines from the Wright Brothers to the early 1990s. I think Gunston does a better job than White in describing the technical problems facing engine designers and how they were overcome (or not). Both Gunston and White go into some detail as to why Rolls Royce rejected the application of turbo supercharging, even though it was more efficient than mechanical supercharging (which has pretty much died in the automotive world, except for drag racing).

I have heard of LJK Setright's The Power to Fly, but never read it. Gunston takes issue with some of Setright's assertions and opinions, but Setright was an opinionated UK automotive journalist in the 60s and 70s who wasn't afraid to stick his chin out, or put his foot in his mouth. I remember him writing his early 80s February Car and Driver columns in stream of consciousness, in tribute to James Joyce's birthday. He apparently thought he was showing up his American readers, but most literature students will tell you don't try writing in stream of consciousness unless your talent rivals that of Joyce or Faulkner. Think of Setright as the Jeremy Clarkson of the 1970s.

(in reply to Commander Cody)
Post #: 34
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 12/2/2016 9:46:01 PM   
bomccarthy


Posts: 232
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From: L.A.
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Denniss

I consider the basic Allison V1710 design to be superior to the Merlin, just the supercharging became an issue in latewar. Probably due to US fixation of Turbocharging Allison was neither ordered nor had intention to develop a Higher-alt supercharging system until it was too late.
Considering some comments from warbird maintainers the Merlin engines are not easy to maintain whereas the Allison is rather easy to do so.


Agreed. Since the 1950s, the first thing done to a Merlin intended for racing is to swap out the Rolls Royce connecting rods with V-1710 connecting rods, which are stronger and lighter (the engines shared a 6.0 inch stroke).

< Message edited by bomccarthy -- 12/2/2016 9:52:32 PM >

(in reply to Denniss)
Post #: 35
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 12/3/2016 4:17:57 AM   
wdolson

 

Posts: 10152
Joined: 6/28/2006
From: Near Portland, OR
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Denniss

I consider the basic Allison V1710 design to be superior to the Merlin, just the supercharging became an issue in latewar. Probably due to US fixation of Turbocharging Allison was neither ordered nor had intention to develop a Higher-alt supercharging system until it was too late.
Considering some comments from warbird maintainers the Merlin engines are not easy to maintain whereas the Allison is rather easy to do so.


Were they talking about Rolls Royce Merlins or Packard Merlins? The standard British practice for airplane manufacturing was to hand build everything. Mechanics always had files in their tool kits because spares were never the same dimensions as the parts taken out and usually some reshaping was needed to make the part fit. This was true of British built engines as well as the rest of the airframe.

The Americans mass produced everything and all parts were within the same tolerances. Because they were mass produced rather than hand fitted, the American engines didn't run as smoothly, but they had less downtime when they needed repair. I recall reading an account of an RAF mechanic who had worked on a number of British built planes and his unit converted to lend-lease aircraft made in the US. The factory rep was there to help with the transition. When the mechanic had to replace a part somewhere and grabbed his file, the factory rep asked why he needed that. The mechanic replied that you always needed to file something to get parts to fit. The rep assured him that wouldn't be the case here and the mechanic was flummoxed when the part fit with no fuss.

Bill Dunn who was an Eagle Squadron pilot who later flew P-47s in the 9th AF got a chance to fly just about every one of the USAAF and British fighters. He had a run down in the appendix of his book comparing and contrasting. He said the Rolls built Merlins ran much smoother than the Packard Merlins. He didn't like flying the P-51 because of the vibrations from the engine, but he did admit that the P-51 was probably the best long range escort fighter the Allies had.

I think the Packard Merlins were about as easy to maintain as Allisons, though I don't know for sure.

Bill

_____________________________

WitP AE - Test team lead, programmer

(in reply to Denniss)
Post #: 36
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 1/7/2017 3:25:56 AM   
Reg


Posts: 2611
Joined: 5/26/2000
From: Victoria, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Commander Cody


quote:

ORIGINAL: bomccarthy

A lot of veteran pilots liked the P-39, including Chuck Yeager, who said he would have willingly gone to battle in one. More inexperienced pilots feared the light touch of its controls (a feature that veteran pilots really liked). In addition to its adverse spin characteristics, one handling problem was tied to the cannon - as its ammo was used up, the plane's c.g. shifted to the rear, until it eventually went past 1/4 MAC (mean aerodynamic chord), which seriously affected stability in most maneuvers. Some aviation historians attribute this as one source of the legends that the P-39 could flip end-over-end if pushed too far. This points to one advantage of locating guns and ammunition in the wings - the c.g. remains within 1/4 MAC as the ammunition is expended.

The P-51 had a similar problem when the 85-gallon fuel tank was added behind the cockpit early in the production of the P-51B. Until at least half that fuel was burned, the c.g. was behind 1/4 MAC. This made the plane difficult to fly early in a mission and a number of green pilots found out the hard way that the plane needed to be treated with extra respect. However, these losses were considered a necessary price for the ability to reach Berlin from English bases.

Do you have any books you can recommend that discuss these issues? I love that stuff.

Cheers,
CC


This is a very readable biography by a P-39 pilot. As part of the very interesting narrative he writes about the characteristics and limitations of his much loved mount.

He also contrasts this to the P-38 operated by his sister squadron and the P-47 which he converted to in 1944.

Recommended if only for an entertaining read.

ISBN: 0-7022-2555-X





Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Reg -- 1/7/2017 8:56:31 AM >


_____________________________

Cheers,
Reg.

(One day I will learn to spell - or check before posting....)
Uh oh, Firefox has a spell checker!! What excuse can I use now!!!

(in reply to Commander Cody)
Post #: 37
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 1/9/2017 3:00:44 AM   
bradfordkay

 

Posts: 8554
Joined: 3/24/2002
From: Olympia, WA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Reg

quote:

ORIGINAL: Commander Cody


quote:

ORIGINAL: bomccarthy

A lot of veteran pilots liked the P-39, including Chuck Yeager, who said he would have willingly gone to battle in one. More inexperienced pilots feared the light touch of its controls (a feature that veteran pilots really liked). In addition to its adverse spin characteristics, one handling problem was tied to the cannon - as its ammo was used up, the plane's c.g. shifted to the rear, until it eventually went past 1/4 MAC (mean aerodynamic chord), which seriously affected stability in most maneuvers. Some aviation historians attribute this as one source of the legends that the P-39 could flip end-over-end if pushed too far. This points to one advantage of locating guns and ammunition in the wings - the c.g. remains within 1/4 MAC as the ammunition is expended.

The P-51 had a similar problem when the 85-gallon fuel tank was added behind the cockpit early in the production of the P-51B. Until at least half that fuel was burned, the c.g. was behind 1/4 MAC. This made the plane difficult to fly early in a mission and a number of green pilots found out the hard way that the plane needed to be treated with extra respect. However, these losses were considered a necessary price for the ability to reach Berlin from English bases.

Do you have any books you can recommend that discuss these issues? I love that stuff.

Cheers,
CC


This is a very readable biography by a P-39 pilot. As part of the very interesting narrative he writes about the characteristics and limitations of his much loved mount.

He also contrasts this to the P-38 operated by his sister squadron and the P-47 which he converted to in 1944.

Recommended if only for an entertaining read.

ISBN: 0-7022-2555-X







Thanks, Reg... I just ordered a used copy of this book.

_____________________________

fair winds,
Brad

(in reply to Reg)
Post #: 38
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 1/11/2017 9:24:53 AM   
Reg


Posts: 2611
Joined: 5/26/2000
From: Victoria, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

Thanks, Reg... I just ordered a used copy of this book.


Hi Brad, I hope you enjoy it. I certainly did.

Please let us all know what you think when you have finished reading it.

I have attached a review for anyone else thinking of having a look at this book as well.

quote:

Review "Angels Twenty" on Amazon.com by John Hernandez on October 20, 1999

Back in 1977, Edwards Park published the sparkling "Nanette", a fictionalized account of his days as a neophyte P-39 pilot in New Guinea. "Angels Twenty" could almost be considered the non-fiction companion volume. There is no shortage of action-packed fighter combat oral histories on today's shelves, and readers interested in combat anecdotes of the P-39 and P-47 may be appeased by this book, if not sated. Yet Mr. Parks offers something more, well, soulful -and wrly humorous. The author is a gifted story-teller, and the perspective he offers may be one unfamiliar to the public: The anti-hero fighter pilot. The author's adventurous journey from uncertain tyro to capable veteran is refreshing and memorable (an underlying theme seems to reflect a great truth: In the flying business, there is little that is more satisfying than earning the respect of your peers). I was completely absorbed by the mirthy and genuine "Angels Twenty". I was left feeling as though I'd just finished hearing Mr Parks recount his tale fireside. I was also reminded of the closing words to the introduction to "Nanette": "That was the way we were". Mr. Parks' work is eminently enjoyable, and could perhaps offer insight to my largely untried generation.


Ted Parks subtitled his earlier novel "Nanette: An Exaggeration" and though it covers much the same material as a fiction novel, it focuses on his relationship with his aircraft. It has good reviews so I thought I would order a copy and read it as well.

An extract of Ted's writing is in the review below and shows he really is an entertaining author.

quote:

Review "Nanette" on Amazon.com by A Customer on February 15, 1997

As an avid reader of WWII fighter pilot first-hand accounts, especially from the Pacific Theatre, this is one of the very best available. Edward is concise, a powerful wordsmith, and you will be hooked after reading just the Introduction (one-third page) and the first couple pages of the first paragraph. He was the typical WWII Army Aviation cadet, and fell in love with his Bell P-39 Aircobra.

He starts, "Nanette was an airplane. That should be made clear right at the start. She was not a very good plane; actually she stank. But she did a lot for me, I realize, as I look back on her. All the planes of that old war had distinguishing looks and personalities. The P-40, the Warhawk, was knobby and arrogant, a tomboy. The P-38, the Lightning, was lean and coltish, a rich debunte. The P-47, the Thunderbolt, was massive and dull, a peasant girl. The bombers had their distinctions, too, but I didn't know much about them. Of all the fighters, two could really excite a flyer. One was the P-51, Mustang, lovely to look at, honest, efficient, hard working and dependable. In those days she was thought of as a wife, and I know men who married her, back then, and are still in love with her. The other was the P-39, the Aircobra. It was slim, with a gently curved tail section, a smoothly faired in air intake, and a perfectly rounded nose cone with its ugly, protruding cannon. But the Aircobra was lazy and slovenly and given to fits of vicious temper. It was a sexy machine, and rotten. Nanette was like that, and I was a little queer for her."

You can find a lot of books by fighter pilots, but you won't find many better to read than this one.


P.S. Edward Parks flew in the South Pacific with the 35th Fighter Group, 41st Fighter Squadron, known as the "Flying Buzz-saws".


< Message edited by Reg -- 1/11/2017 9:41:14 AM >


_____________________________

Cheers,
Reg.

(One day I will learn to spell - or check before posting....)
Uh oh, Firefox has a spell checker!! What excuse can I use now!!!

(in reply to bradfordkay)
Post #: 39
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 1/11/2017 3:17:11 PM   
bradfordkay

 

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It arrived yesterday so I started reading it last night. So far very good, though he must have been on a very slow train from Townsville to Charters Towers as he claimed that the trip was 250 miles. His description of his reception into the 41st and his first mission out of Port Moresby were delightful.

_____________________________

fair winds,
Brad

(in reply to Reg)
Post #: 40
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 1/11/2017 3:22:37 PM   
bradfordkay

 

Posts: 8554
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From: Olympia, WA
Status: offline
That review of Nanette might scare away some readers: "you will be hooked after reading....the first couple pages of the first paragraph."

After reading several chapters of Angels Twenty, I can assure those who read that review that he does not have run on paragraphs - that the reviewer confused paragraph with chapter.

_____________________________

fair winds,
Brad

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Post #: 41
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 1/11/2017 3:41:10 PM   
Chickenboy


Posts: 21786
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From: San Antonio, TX
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The P39 gun configurations firing

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EP5aqAC8PPY

and the 'official' introduction to the P39, complete with several strafing runs (including cannon). On a barge too (@6:20 mark)!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sf9mfAnkUxE

_____________________________


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Post #: 42
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 1/11/2017 4:43:15 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 8185
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

It arrived yesterday so I started reading it last night. So far very good, though he must have been on a very slow train from Townsville to Charters Towers as he claimed that the trip was 250 miles. His description of his reception into the 41st and his first mission out of Port Moresby were delightful.

I read/saw somewhere that in the 1940s Australia had mostly narrow-gauge railways in the northern part and was in the process of replacing a lot with standard-gauge to meet the needs of wartime transport. If it took the author a long time to cover the 250 miles to Townsville, it could just be that the rail system was overcrowded and there was a lot of waiting on sidings for oncoming trains to clear the tracks.

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to bradfordkay)
Post #: 43
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 1/11/2017 4:44:42 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 8185
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

The P39 gun configurations firing

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EP5aqAC8PPY

and the 'official' introduction to the P39, complete with several strafing runs (including cannon). On a barge too (@6:20 mark)!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sf9mfAnkUxE

Nice! That barge just disintegrated. Would have been interesting to know how big it was and what it was made of to help illustrate the power of the cannon.

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to Chickenboy)
Post #: 44
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 1/12/2017 2:53:12 AM   
bradfordkay

 

Posts: 8554
Joined: 3/24/2002
From: Olympia, WA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

It arrived yesterday so I started reading it last night. So far very good, though he must have been on a very slow train from Townsville to Charters Towers as he claimed that the trip was 250 miles. His description of his reception into the 41st and his first mission out of Port Moresby were delightful.

I read/saw somewhere that in the 1940s Australia had mostly narrow-gauge railways in the northern part and was in the process of replacing a lot with standard-gauge to meet the needs of wartime transport. If it took the author a long time to cover the 250 miles to Townsville, it could just be that the rail system was overcrowded and there was a lot of waiting on sidings for oncoming trains to clear the tracks.


I have no doubt that it took his train a long time to cover the distance, and he did make a comment about the narrow gauge train (though not using those words) - but the distance from Townsville to Charters Towers is less than 90 miles. It probably felt like 250 miles to him with numerous stops at small townships and waits on sidings...

_____________________________

fair winds,
Brad

(in reply to BBfanboy)
Post #: 45
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 1/12/2017 6:34:27 AM   
Reg


Posts: 2611
Joined: 5/26/2000
From: Victoria, Australia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

I read/saw somewhere that in the 1940s Australia had mostly narrow-gauge railways in the northern part and was in the process of replacing a lot with standard-gauge to meet the needs of wartime transport. If it took the author a long time to cover the 250 miles to Townsville, it could just be that the rail system was overcrowded and there was a lot of waiting on sidings for oncoming trains to clear the tracks.


Good guess BBfanboy though the distance wasn't quite that far.

quote:

"Angels Twenty" pg. 11.

"As it happened, the next was Charters Towers. A day-long train trip inched us the hundred or so kilometres, moving with painful deliberation, making long, unexplained stops at tiny depots with nothing around them but empty land. Bored to the verge of madness, we took to swarming out of the stiflingly hot carriages at every stop, having a cold beer at the station bar (the train crew was always there), and then jogging beside the train to the next depot stop. One way or another, all three hundred of us managed to reach Charters Towers at more or less the same time."


_____________________________

Cheers,
Reg.

(One day I will learn to spell - or check before posting....)
Uh oh, Firefox has a spell checker!! What excuse can I use now!!!

(in reply to bradfordkay)
Post #: 46
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 1/12/2017 1:04:20 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 8185
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Reg


quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

I read/saw somewhere that in the 1940s Australia had mostly narrow-gauge railways in the northern part and was in the process of replacing a lot with standard-gauge to meet the needs of wartime transport. If it took the author a long time to cover the 250 miles to Townsville, it could just be that the rail system was overcrowded and there was a lot of waiting on sidings for oncoming trains to clear the tracks.


Good guess BBfanboy though the distance wasn't quite that far.

quote:

"Angels Twenty" pg. 11.

"As it happened, the next was Charters Towers. A day-long train trip inched us the hundred or so kilometres, moving with painful deliberation, making long, unexplained stops at tiny depots with nothing around them but empty land. Bored to the verge of madness, we took to swarming out of the stiflingly hot carriages at every stop, having a cold beer at the station bar (the train crew was always there), and then jogging beside the train to the next depot stop. One way or another, all three hundred of us managed to reach Charters Towers at more or less the same time."


Of course! I should have guessed that the Aussie "Beer time" was the real reason for the slow trip!

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to Reg)
Post #: 47
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 1/12/2017 3:29:01 PM   
bradfordkay

 

Posts: 8554
Joined: 3/24/2002
From: Olympia, WA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Reg


quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

I read/saw somewhere that in the 1940s Australia had mostly narrow-gauge railways in the northern part and was in the process of replacing a lot with standard-gauge to meet the needs of wartime transport. If it took the author a long time to cover the 250 miles to Townsville, it could just be that the rail system was overcrowded and there was a lot of waiting on sidings for oncoming trains to clear the tracks.


Good guess BBfanboy though the distance wasn't quite that far.

quote:

"Angels Twenty" pg. 11.

"As it happened, the next was Charters Towers. A day-long train trip inched us the hundred or so kilometres, moving with painful deliberation, making long, unexplained stops at tiny depots with nothing around them but empty land. Bored to the verge of madness, we took to swarming out of the stiflingly hot carriages at every stop, having a cold beer at the station bar (the train crew was always there), and then jogging beside the train to the next depot stop. One way or another, all three hundred of us managed to reach Charters Towers at more or less the same time."




That is strange - but correct. My copy, published by McGraw Hill 1997, has it this way: "A daylong train trip inched us the 250 miles, the train moving with painful deliberation..."

In this case I will apologize to Edwards Park and accuse McGraw Hill of a bad editing and conversion job for the US market.


_____________________________

fair winds,
Brad

(in reply to Reg)
Post #: 48
RE: P-400 Fighter Trainer - 1/12/2017 7:12:04 PM   
Reg


Posts: 2611
Joined: 5/26/2000
From: Victoria, Australia
Status: offline

Ahh, my copy is the 1994 edition by University of Queensland Press who obviously know how far it is from Townsville to Charts Towers...

The discrepancy may have also come from UQP correcting the author's original manuscript. (It probably seemed that far to him.}




< Message edited by Reg -- 1/12/2017 7:33:30 PM >


_____________________________

Cheers,
Reg.

(One day I will learn to spell - or check before posting....)
Uh oh, Firefox has a spell checker!! What excuse can I use now!!!

(in reply to bradfordkay)
Post #: 49
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