quote:Thanks for the info! Most of my understand (or misunderstanding) on this comes from an episode in the BBC series, The World at War, which I love. In it there's an interview from the early 70's with PM Chamberlain's private secretary and I found it really enlightening to why things happened in Norway the way they did. During the phony war, the hope by the western allies was that WW2 wouldn't be a repeat of the first war. And that it would / could be fought on distant battlefields, such as in Norway, and far away from Western Europe. He also goes on to discuss the fiasco in Norway, the fall of the Chamberlain government and how Churchill came to power. I'm sure you know this history better than me but it was between Winston and some other chap (who's name I can't remember).
I've been toying with the following, and will give it a try in my solitary play. At first I didn't think they were linked as I have them linked, but after some thought they could be linked historically. Away, here's my first cut.
If the Soviets claim the Finnish borderlands then the Germans must invade Norway within a year. If the Germans deny the claim then both the CW and France can send land and air units to Norway assuming Norway is aligned to one of the allied powers. If the Germans allow the claim by the Soviets, then the CW or France may still align Norway, but neither can send land or air units to Norway. Failure by the Germans to invade Norway within one year of the Soviets claim, allows the CW, or French, player to DOW Norway without Norway aligning to any power and resulting in the immediate conquest of Norway by the allies.
One of Churchill's main motivation for intervening in Norway was to establish a supply path to send aid, and possibly troops, to the Finns in the winter war against the Soviets. This plan was only stopped a few days before it was suppose to start by the Finns agreeing to a cease fire with the Soviets. So in game terms if the Germans had allowed the claim then that would have removed one of the main incentives for the British intervention into Norway. From a WMiF game perspective, the Soviet player can gain an extra resource, some Finnish territory, and force the Germans to invade Norway by making the claim. If the German player wants to make it hard on the Soviet player; i.e., by denying it, then in return the Germany player's life is made harder in Norway. Or, Norway and one their victory points (i.e., Oslo) is handed over for free to the CW if the Germans decide not to invade Norway.
rkr1958, interesting idea - and the following does not invalidate your idea, but is just for historical accuracy.
Churchill had absolutely no intention of sending troops to aid Finland. His ahem..."plan" was to stop iron ore getting to Germany - and in his usual inimitable style, he wanted action this day! Chamberlain - fortunately in this case - was a brake on this madcap idea.
Having landed in Norway with a small, ill-equipped (sound familiar ) force, elements would then march into Sweden (conveniently via the iron ore fields) apparently "on the way to Finland" - which they would never reach....but they would remain on Swedish soil! The Swedes would obviously be only to happy with this state of affairs.... right
The deliberations went on so long that Finland surrendered before any action was taken - thus the pretext for landing was gone.
Despite this, this brain-dead idea would not go away though and a landing in Norway was about to happen* when - this time it was the Germans that beat them to it.
* The idea was to mine Norwegian waters - something that was bound to see Germany react - and when they did, the British would land
I have read a couple of books on this - and the way the British and French governments conducted matters in the first year of war was a complete and utter joke. If it wasn't so serious it would be laughable the way they carried on. France were happy for any plan that involved the British taking the lead - and vice-versa - so each could blame the other if it went wrong....
And that was just one episode - don't get me started on Gamelin's spiffing wheeze - bombing the Soviet oilfields
By the way, the British landed in Norway without snow shoes. The French had snow shoes but forgot to load the lashing for binding them to their feet. In effect, British and French movement in northern Norway was constrained to roads. Also, the British in their foray into Norway learned the lesson that naval power without air power is highly vulnerable to enemy air power.
The World At War Sheer Quality!
Yes, this was all part of the bizarre way the British / French went about things in the early months of the war. Hence Gamelin wanting to bomb the Caucasus from Syria, and not wanting the British to mine the Rhine - as it might mean the Germans retaliating on French soil. These are two French examples - but the British were equally as clueless .
The Norwegian Campaign started badly, got steadily worse (through Admiralty interference) and just kept getting more and more amateurish as things "progressed". The Allies had no fighter cover (except a few Gladiators that flew from a frozen lake - (and were quickly destroyed)), the troops had little by way of AA, the troops were largely territorial battalions as the small regular army was in France, as you say, some of the troops did not have the right equipment because plans were made on the hoof and shipping was diverted elsewhere....the whole thing was just a shambles.
The other chap was Lord Halifax. Good job he didn't get the job - and frankly I'm not sure he wanted it in any case.
Fortunately the Germans did not have the expertise they were soon to gain and so could not take advantage of their air supremacy against the RN. One of the saddest episodes of the campaign was the loss of the carrier Glorious - and that was nothing to do with air power - she was sunk by the ugly sisters, while sailing back to the UK alone (just 2 destroyers as escort - and for reasons that are not completely known) through a war zone with no CAP fighter protection What made her loss even worse was the loss of many RAF fighter pilots who had landed their Hurricanes on deck in a magnificent display of skill just a few hours before. What a waste..
< Message edited by warspite1 -- 2/1/2015 8:20:39 PM >
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