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WITE mod to exclude war with USA

 
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WITE mod to exclude war with USA - 6/25/2014 3:57:55 PM   
davesnoke

 

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I hadn't played WITE in more than a year, and was really pleased to discover the substantial update that was done in late 2013. I was especially happy to see the option for Germany to suspend offensive operations earlier in 1941, and better prepare for the winter, thereby reducing losses.

I accomplished the same result with a jury-rig approach when I last played the game, but despite the Wehrmacht being much better prepared to conduct offensive operations in 1942, I came to the conclusion by the 2nd half of 1943 that the war was still unwinnable -- an ever-increasing number of Germany's resources were being siphoned from the east to counter the Anglo-American offensives.

I've come to believe that Germany could not have won the war against the USSR once Hitler declared war on the US. Had he not done so, and had the Germans taken no actions that might have given Roosevelt the basis for a unilateral declaration of war on Germany (probably something to do with unrestricted submarine warfare), Germany might well have defeated Russia. With all due respect to the UK, Britain did not alone represent a strategic threat to the Reich.

To anyone's knowledge, has a mod been developed (or is one being developed) that would provide an option to the 41-45 campaign scenario which assumed neither Germany nor the USA declared war on each other? I understand this would be a pretty significant task, but I think it could be VERY intriguing -- I just don't think Britain alone could have provided the aid and support necessary to save the USSR.

Does such a mod exist?
Post #: 1
RE: WITE mod to exclude war with USA - 6/25/2014 8:05:48 PM   
Omat


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Hello

Not that I'm aware of.

Omat

_____________________________

"All changes, even the most longed for, have their melancholy; for what we leave behind us is part of ourselves; we must die to one life before we can enter another."
Anatole France

(in reply to davesnoke)
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RE: WITE mod to exclude war with USA - 12/16/2014 3:27:13 AM   
DHRedge

 

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Joined: 1/18/2010
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The entire discussion starts and ends with nukes, once they are developed, and only one side has them, that sets the end of the war. So if Germany would have waited, and USA would have still done a Manhattan project, it would not have helped. Since even with the USA not at war, they would have supplied nukes to England.


Germany would have also had to taken England, although with Russian and Mideast oil, and a capitulated Russia that would be possible. The thing is, the Russians were not fighting for a Monarchy, they were fighting for a 'new country' they had just won that was supporting workers and peasants, with some of the first democratic selection of local party officials they had ever had from each town, and then they get attacked by another 'corporate controlled' puppet put into power in Germany, so the motivation to defend 'Mother Russia' gave them a large percent of the population as devoted fighters, in contrast, Italy was never much into the war idea, since they were not defending there ideas, as much as that same old fighting for some rich guy idea. You can see a definite difference in motivation, that really makes a difference in the Eastern war.

Propaganda and Charisma often motivate large enlistments, nationalism is instilled from an early age in most people, however the difference in the support of foreign wars against non enemies to the people of a nation is a significant factor in how many troops are volunteers and how many are conscripts. Also why so much of USA media works so closely with the Military, nationalism is required to fight unjust wars, and to suppress a countries own populations.

Although the destruction that increased demand over production, postponed the demise of capitalism till at least the late 1970s, where then deficit spending and military build ups take over to provide the needed demand capitalism needs to maintain the scarcity of products it requires in a society. So the war still served Fascism, even if they lost technically, by its destruction of 80% of European production capabilities. (also planned obsolescence, consumerism, and a few other factors tries to keep demand over production so that capitalism is possible)

(in reply to Omat)
Post #: 3
RE: WITE mod to exclude war with USA - 12/16/2014 4:31:40 AM   
charlie0311

 

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Hmm, "no politics". Where is the moderator? We all know the song, how about giving it a rest. These forums are for fun.

(in reply to DHRedge)
Post #: 4
RE: WITE mod to exclude war with USA - 12/16/2014 5:58:51 AM   
morvael


Posts: 5037
Joined: 9/8/2006
From: Poland
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In order to do such mod there should exist the ability to turn off lend-lease delivery of vehicles and supplies (ground elements and aircraft can be "turned off" by erasing factories in the editor). As anyone playing the Reds will know without the LL trucks the Red Army would not reach Berlin by 1945. Of course having no LL the Soviets would have probably built or converted some tank factories to produce vehicles instead, so this should be factored in. Unfortunately there is no such option in the game now to turn off LL.

(in reply to charlie0311)
Post #: 5
RE: WITE mod to exclude war with USA - 12/16/2014 8:46:14 AM   
phoenix

 

Posts: 1974
Joined: 9/28/2010
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It is fun, Charlie. lol. Let's not have censorship instead. That would only prove some point, no?

< Message edited by phoenix -- 12/16/2014 9:47:39 AM >

(in reply to morvael)
Post #: 6
RE: WITE mod to exclude war with USA - 12/16/2014 10:08:47 AM   
Denniss

 

Posts: 2702
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From: Germany, Hannover (region)
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I assume GAZ would have been converted to produce trucks instead of T-60/-70, BA-64 and SU-76. Soviets may drop heavy tanks in 42 to build more T-34.

(in reply to phoenix)
Post #: 7
RE: WITE mod to exclude war with USA - 12/16/2014 1:47:18 PM   
DHRedge

 

Posts: 166
Joined: 1/18/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: charlie0311

Hmm, "no politics". Where is the moderator? We all know the song, how about giving it a rest. These forums are for fun.

Translation, suppression of dissenting opinions, even if they are thought out with supporting evidence.

If I advocated for support of some system that supports the status quo, you would not have made such a comment.
You don't have to agree, but saying that others should not see it makes the point. And it was within the context of other historical, and possible other paths that could have lead from other implementations of ww2

And actually most people will go there entire lives listening to songs, never having heard or thought about the lyrics, although that is a different topic.

Over The Rhine - Give Me Strength
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVbl0CulcZg

Partisans hitting the rail lines!!!!!!!!!

Thunderstruck
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2AC41dglnM

Fire Lions of Mount Thunder!!!!!

< Message edited by DHRedge -- 12/16/2014 2:57:32 PM >

(in reply to charlie0311)
Post #: 8
RE: WITE mod to exclude war with USA - 12/17/2014 2:09:36 AM   
charlie0311

 

Posts: 379
Joined: 12/20/2013
Status: offline
Gawd...Shoulda know "politically correct" is ok..

The forum policy is no politcs.. why don't you complaint to them.


(in reply to DHRedge)
Post #: 9
RE: WITE mod to exclude war with USA - 12/17/2014 3:52:13 AM   
Qwixt


Posts: 611
Joined: 6/19/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DHRedge

quote:

ORIGINAL: charlie0311

Hmm, "no politics". Where is the moderator? We all know the song, how about giving it a rest. These forums are for fun.

Translation, suppression of dissenting opinions, even if they are thought out with supporting evidence.

If I advocated for support of some system that supports the status quo, you would not have made such a comment.
You don't have to agree, but saying that others should not see it makes the point. And it was within the context of other historical, and possible other paths that could have lead from other implementations of ww2

And actually most people will go there entire lives listening to songs, never having heard or thought about the lyrics, although that is a different topic.

Over The Rhine - Give Me Strength
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVbl0CulcZg

Partisans hitting the rail lines!!!!!!!!!

Thunderstruck
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2AC41dglnM

Fire Lions of Mount Thunder!!!!!


The reason for no politics is because every idiot has an opinion that isn't wrong. So if someone wants to argue/discuss politics, there are bunch of forums out there to accommodate that wish.

(in reply to DHRedge)
Post #: 10
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