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Version 1.20 - 2/22/2014 6:14:20 PM   
Marshall Ellis


Posts: 5626
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Dallas
Status: offline
Hello all:

I wanted to let you know that we have submitted a new release candidate (1.20) for the Beta testers!
If you are a Beta tester then go to the prviate forum and download now! We have included several fixes but the main change will be how we deal with larger screens. We are now taking advantage of the extra space!

Also, we are looking at ways to bring online play into the game!

Stay tuned...

Thank you



_____________________________

Thank you

Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games


Post #: 1
RE: Version 1.20 - 2/22/2014 7:31:23 PM   
Kai

 

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This is great news. Can't wait.

(in reply to Marshall Ellis)
Post #: 2
RE: Version 1.20 - 2/23/2014 5:11:38 PM   
Pans


Posts: 83
Joined: 11/22/2004
From: Germany
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great to hear from you, Marshall.

I am really excited to see this new version. If you need more testers let me know.

Andreas

(in reply to Kai)
Post #: 3
RE: Version 1.20 - 2/24/2014 11:57:44 AM   
Marshall Ellis


Posts: 5626
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Dallas
Status: offline
Great to be back guys! I still play a bit when I can and we have still been coding a bit here and there. REALLY want to take a look at Online play HOPEFULLY this year and essentially speedup PBEM!

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Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



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Post #: 4
RE: Version 1.20 - 2/24/2014 8:16:04 PM   
PISA.inWar


Posts: 15
Joined: 12/18/2013
From: ITALY (Pisa)
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Marshall Ellis

Hello all:

I wanted to let you know that we have submitted a new release candidate (1.20) for the Beta testers!
If you are a Beta tester then go to the prviate forum and download now! We have included several fixes but the main change will be how we deal with larger screens. We are now taking advantage of the extra space!

Also, we are looking at ways to bring online play into the game!

Stay tuned...

Thank you



Finally some good news. Although it is desirable to have a greater participation in the forum.


(in reply to Marshall Ellis)
Post #: 5
RE: Version 1.20 - 2/24/2014 10:00:13 PM   
Marshall Ellis


Posts: 5626
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Dallas
Status: offline
Cannot disagree with ya PISA.inWar! I'm in a very circular development world where I rotate in and out of project areas over a period of time much like a comet :-) No exceuse it simply is what it is! Good news is that I"m still above ground and still LOVE EiANW so it is not abandoned and will not be if I can help it! I'm thankful that we made some VERY good decisions in our source code for longevity that keeps this game moving and compatible with all O/Ss from W98SE all the way to Win7! Not a small feat in development terms!

_____________________________

Thank you

Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



(in reply to PISA.inWar)
Post #: 6
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/3/2014 3:27:52 PM   
damieiro

 

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Very good news this game is still in development.

I love the big screen... I wanna more modding tools (or use of some config file with oobs, leaders, etc..) than online play, but big screen is really needed...

< Message edited by damieiro -- 3/3/2014 4:40:04 PM >

(in reply to Marshall Ellis)
Post #: 7
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/4/2014 1:05:59 AM   
Marshall Ellis


Posts: 5626
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Dallas
Status: offline
Yea, I hear ya! We would love to add more moding tools but our hope is to really re-kindle the fires with an online play option!

Thank you


_____________________________

Thank you

Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



(in reply to damieiro)
Post #: 8
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/4/2014 1:24:23 AM   
damieiro

 

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I think both things will be handy. EIA is a game that can be very long (if desired), even very very long (1792 campaing and french revolution :D) or a scenario. Without modding, we have a powerhorse that can only go forward in the same speed by the same road

But if you play a Solo game, the modding is a must like a decent AI.

And as a developer i think that a Load Scenario Data from text file is really faster to implement than a multiplayer option (INMHO).

And i would really like the many "optional countries" found in Empires in Harm could be implemented (Even some of EIA like Westphalia) or Dominance Status (like Russia being a dominating power) or things like that.

If i would have a load scenario from text i promise that i will upload a lot of scenarios ^_^

< Message edited by damieiro -- 3/4/2014 2:32:29 AM >

(in reply to Marshall Ellis)
Post #: 9
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/4/2014 4:47:37 AM   
gazfun


Posts: 850
Joined: 7/1/2004
From: Brisbane, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Marshall Ellis

Hello all:

I wanted to let you know that we have submitted a new release candidate (1.20) for the Beta testers!
If you are a Beta tester then go to the prviate forum and download now! We have included several fixes but the main change will be how we deal with larger screens. We are now taking advantage of the extra space!

Also, we are looking at ways to bring online play into the game!

Stay tuned...

Thank you



Hi Marshall
This version takes far far too long to play, everyone submitting 28 files per month plus an economic Turn. Even if everyone puts in a file daily it takes 28days to do a month by PBEM. You know Ive was with you at the begginning, and we never imagined this would occur.
But this has to change, to be viable.
Gaming in a year maybe 18 months to finish a game, this is what should be the goal, not 7 years.
There HAS to be a rethink here Marshall


< Message edited by gazfun -- 3/4/2014 5:49:52 AM >


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Post #: 10
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/4/2014 11:43:05 AM   
Marshall Ellis


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From: Dallas
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Gazfun:

You were there with us at the start and you helped create the very system that we are in (Thank you). I think I might agree but the mechanics of this would require some pretty massive rewrites. Tell me some streamlining ideas? On line play?

Thank you

_____________________________

Thank you

Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



(in reply to gazfun)
Post #: 11
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/5/2014 5:01:21 AM   
gazfun


Posts: 850
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The PBEM game has this main problem I believe, after 7 years of trial and gaming.

The issues are this. Instead of people using the Skip functions that should occur it is not happening, the system is geared around the lazy players who don’t bother to use the skip functions at all, and consequently waste time getting the files returned, where the GM has to act. Mainly in the Diplomacy and Reinforcement, Naval phases, especially where there is no Navy.

The system should be geared around a proactive and a forward thinking player, which increases immersion in the game. The system should make a player more proactive, by the system simply asking questions at the right time, rather than people having to remember each time, which often means they don’t remember.

I think the system should have it so that players should be asked in the current land phase, do they want to skip the next month’s Diplomacy turn yes or no. If yes (error changed from no) then the system skips that player.
Once a Major Power has his Diplomatic situation set, its less likely that he will want to change it, only in cases of war or surrender etc. or some other Diplomatic shift in the game, which comes around now and again. As the system is now, everyone still waits in order and not many will put there Diplomacy until France does his first , which shouldn't make any difference at all of course.

The same for the reinforcement phase. Mostly a player would only want to do reinforcements is when they have troops coming out of the barracks. Or when to change leaders or adjust corps strengths, with other corps etc. People 80% of the time will not skip this phase. At the moment war or reinforcements has been the only criteria that will change the auto skip settings.
Otherwise the player should asked by the game YES or NO. No one will bother to remember to skip even when there are no reinforcements for sometimes up to 2 months in row. A waste of time.

The naval Phase is another phase where countries are blockaded, and not worth risking combat because of expected high losses, or that player has no navy. If no navy the question by the system shouldn't be asked at all. If a country has a navy then 80% of the time especially if blockaded by a bigger navy won’t move out of the Harbor and most of the time won’t move any navy. The system should ask if the player wishes to move their navy next month if not the Naval phase is skipped. Reset for that next month if DOW on.

turn off that month only the month they were DOW on, until at the next land phase where they can reset the skip function by the system asking the questions as mentioned before.

To sum it up, for the Diplomacy, Reinforcement phase, and naval phases included. The system should ask at the end of their Land Phase, YES or NO, for the next month (February), the system should default to no so they have to actually click on the yes response… If a DOW then all phases for that player have to be reset, and that player will have to go through all phase manually for that month he has been DOW on only. At the end of that same month (Land Phase) the system should then ask for each phase for (March) etc.

The other reason, no one uses the skip function is due to bugs associated with that in the past. In Diplomacy and Reinforcements. When the GM has to use AI has to act due to a slow player, doing an AI move temporarily in the Land phase causes that players VP total go to zero.

A lot of waste if time is spent waiting for a file where nothing has been changed or done by the player concerned in his turn. Only when there is need to change things should there be a delay, not both reasons.
This way the GM only has to supervise the Land phase file be returned mostly, and not all four phases each month.
I don’t know exactly what involved with coding here, but it is the least way I can think of.
Otherwise all 4 phases should be in the one turn this would save even more time. But I realize this would be a major rewrite.




< Message edited by gazfun -- 4/13/2014 5:39:00 AM >


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(in reply to Marshall Ellis)
Post #: 12
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/5/2014 12:06:29 PM   
Marshall Ellis


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Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Dallas
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Gazfun:

That's ALL good stuff! So am I correct in saying that the skip settings do not work in PBEM? If they did would that do? Also, tell me more about the VPs to zero issue?

Thank you

_____________________________

Thank you

Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



(in reply to gazfun)
Post #: 13
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/5/2014 2:51:38 PM   
pzgndr

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marshall Ellis
So am I correct in saying that the skip settings do not work in PBEM? If they did would that do?


I think Gaz's point is that the skip settings work fine, it's just that players do not always use them when they could/should. So a simple query feature to ask them at the end of the Land Phase would help implement more skips and speed up play.



(in reply to Marshall Ellis)
Post #: 14
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/5/2014 6:58:00 PM   
bongina

 

Posts: 124
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From: Columbia, SC
Status: offline
Actually, skip turn does not always work. Likewise, once set it can sometimes get stuck in skip mode.

Other very annoying PBEM bugs:

1) A DOW on a Major does not bring its minor allies into the War, causing horrendous headaches for the GM. In fact we have a current game where Persia (which was a Turkish ALLY) did not become a Turkish Free state when France DOW'ed Turkey. Even worse was the fact that Turkey had been at war with Russia at the time and really could have used those Persian corps in the Caucasus. I was able to change Persian status vs France and Russia to "at war" but not vice-versa! As there any way you can fix this for us, Marshall?

2) Turn order change not recognized. In the same game as above, England went to war with Russia and changed its move order from 7th to 1st so that it could attack the Russian navy in Italy. The game did not recognize this change. We went back to UK reinforcement and asked the UK player to redo it, and it STILL did not recognize the change. Only on the following or some subsequent turn did it let finally do it.

3) Leaders wounded return prematurely.

4) Option to change a minor's status from Conquered to Free does not work sometimes. It likewise does not always work in the editor.

Not sure if these are in mantis, because I have not been able to log on there for some time.

Sincerely,
Bart B.

(in reply to pzgndr)
Post #: 15
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/5/2014 7:59:11 PM   
gazfun


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From: Brisbane, Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marshall Ellis

Gazfun:

That's ALL good stuff! So am I correct in saying that the skip settings do not work in PBEM? If they did would that do? Also, tell me more about the VPs to zero issue?

Thank you

Im saying as pzgndr has stated that the skip setting work fine, its just that players need to be reminded to use it more frequently as I suggested at the end of every Land Phase by asking the players each time for the next month. At the moment as I stated they forget to even use it. and time is wasted. The skip setting should be "YES" by default, and changed each time by the player, for Diplomacy Reinforcement, and Naval.
That would effectively reduce the number of files to be submitted because players would not need to. Its a case of the above three phases be only of use if needed, not in the case they are needed all the time, which they are not, due to my reasons Ive mentioned before.

By the way the skip setting are buggy as well.

VP's to zero issue.
This occurs when the GM has to put a Player on Temp AI to complete the Land Phase because of a slow player or a player being away. That players accumulated VP is reduce to zero percent, when that is used.



< Message edited by gazfun -- 3/5/2014 9:05:18 PM >


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Post #: 16
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/5/2014 11:39:26 PM   
Marshall Ellis


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From: Dallas
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Thanks Gazfun!
Good point on the skip item. PErhaps we may look to do this.
Can you tell me in the VP issue is it immediate?


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Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



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Post #: 17
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/6/2014 12:40:54 AM   
Marshall Ellis


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From: Dallas
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and BTW...

The current game skips will be erased in case of forces ready or a DOW. Still want that?

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Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



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Post #: 18
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/6/2014 4:24:21 AM   
gazfun


Posts: 850
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From: Brisbane, Australia
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Yes thats right in case of war, automatically or when asked the question Skip Yes or No

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Post #: 19
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/6/2014 9:37:19 PM   
Marshall Ellis


Posts: 5626
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Dallas
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Gazfun:

Can you tell me in the VP issue is it immediate?


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Thank you

Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



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Post #: 20
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/9/2014 4:29:40 AM   
gazfun


Posts: 850
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From: Brisbane, Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marshall Ellis

Gazfun:

Can you tell me in the VP issue is it immediate?


No its not urgent


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Post #: 21
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/16/2014 9:30:13 PM   
Marshall Ellis


Posts: 5626
Joined: 10/2/2001
From: Dallas
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Sorry ... I meant does it happen right away when you give control?

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Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



(in reply to gazfun)
Post #: 22
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/17/2014 6:31:57 AM   
gazfun


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From: Brisbane, Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marshall Ellis

Sorry ... I meant does it happen right away when you give control?

Yes it does

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Post #: 23
RE: Version 1.20 - 3/24/2014 5:52:54 PM   
NeverMan

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: gazfun

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marshall Ellis

Hello all:

I wanted to let you know that we have submitted a new release candidate (1.20) for the Beta testers!
If you are a Beta tester then go to the prviate forum and download now! We have included several fixes but the main change will be how we deal with larger screens. We are now taking advantage of the extra space!

Also, we are looking at ways to bring online play into the game!

Stay tuned...

Thank you



Hi Marshall
This version takes far far too long to play, everyone submitting 28 files per month plus an economic Turn. Even if everyone puts in a file daily it takes 28days to do a month by PBEM. You know Ive was with you at the begginning, and we never imagined this would occur.
But this has to change, to be viable.
Gaming in a year maybe 18 months to finish a game, this is what should be the goal, not 7 years.
There HAS to be a rethink here Marshall



Who never imagined? Lots of us were telling you guys, and you specifically, that this was going to be a problem long term.

(in reply to gazfun)
Post #: 24
RE: Version 1.20 - 4/9/2014 9:20:05 PM   
DCWhitworth


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From: Norwich, England
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Well it's nice to see you back Marshall and improvements to the game are welcome, however there are a number of fundamental bugs/issues that need resolving. E.g. -

1. Money transfers between major powers do not work. Money is subtracted but never arrives.
2. Skipping does not work properly, the skipped nation cannot load their skipped turn file and a backup is required.
3. Turns cannot be skipped in diplomacy.
4. Backups cannot be made in diplomacy.

In my opinion simultaneous diplomacy was a mistake. Yes it probably speeds things up a bit at the start of the game, but in the later stages you are probably going to have a situation where only two or three nations want to play, the rest will be skipping. Now you have to have *all* the turns from all the players and if someone is late or forgets you can't skip the phase.

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David

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Post #: 25
RE: Version 1.20 - 4/22/2014 12:38:27 PM   
Marshall Ellis


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From: Dallas
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Thanks David!

Mantis is a bit messed up at this time. Can you help me with the details of these bugs? Save games? Examples, how to dupe, something?

I think I might agree with you on the simul dip. I resisted at first but fell prey. The simul dip conflicts with the core design but it is what it is!

_____________________________

Thank you

Marshall Ellis
Outflank Strategy War Games



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Post #: 26
RE: Version 1.20 - 5/15/2014 11:02:23 PM   
alex_van_d


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So good to see an update again!

Has the issue with lending $ between major powers been fixed? This bug stopped me from playing.

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Post #: 27
RE: Version 1.20 - 5/31/2014 7:27:42 AM   
Jadasong

 

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I posted a few comments in a thread above on the 1.20. beta if you are interested, this seems to be the active thread however.

I suspect the game would be a lot better and more accepted if the online Multiplayer option was available. I haven't tried the PBEM option yet but it sounds laborious so possibly putting effort into an online turn based MP is time better spent?

If you are still taking input before release I'll try documenting things better as they happen next game.

(in reply to alex_van_d)
Post #: 28
RE: Version 1.20 - 9/6/2014 11:38:21 AM   
athelas.loraiel

 

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Are you updating the game still? If so, can you release it patched and functional to steam? I know a lot of people wanting it.

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Post #: 29
RE: Version 1.20 - 9/13/2014 12:35:51 PM   
Sorta

 

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Gaz is spot on. The skip function combined with disorganised players made the game unplayable for me after many games hosting on Gaz's site. The annoyance of constantly sending out emails for a phase where nothing was helping requesting players to skip and then not doing it drove me mad. And the players who didn't skip were the ones with the late turns...it becomes like work.

So if skip is fied plus on-line file transfer then I'll jump back in - still check Gaz's site but am happy playing War in the East (which has a working multiplayer file transfer) with another ex- EIA player.

Great to see Marshal and Gaz still involved.

(in reply to gazfun)
Post #: 30
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