Just out of interest.....

World in Flames is the computer version of Australian Design Group classic board game. World In Flames is a highly detailed game covering the both Europe and Pacific Theaters of Operations during World War II. If you want grand strategy this game is for you.

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warspite1
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Just out of interest.....

Post by warspite1 »

Interested to know a bit about those that play (M)WIF in terms of their appetite for WWII history.

I assumed that everyone that plays a game like this or WITP-AE or WITE must be WWII / history buffs who, if they are not playing and planning, are reading military books. But from reading various forums over the years I do not think that is necessarily the case, and for every gamer that can tell you the precise wingspan of any aircraft that ever flew, there are those whose knowledge is "light" at best. Absolutely nothing wrong in the latter - I assume that its the gaming that is the important factor for these people, rather than the history.

So if you fancy it, would be interested to know:

- what is your key driver for playing (M)WIF - game or history?
- what is your level of WWII knowledge?
- Main interest in WWII - e.g. land, air, naval, high level strategy, battles, personalities, economics.
- what started your interest in WWII history
Now Maitland, now's your time!

Duke of Wellington to 1st Guards Brigade - Waterloo 18 June 1815
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AxelNL
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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by AxelNL »

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Interested to know a bit about those that play (M)WIF in terms of their appetite for WWII history.

I assumed that everyone that plays a game like this or WITP-AE or WITE must be WWII / history buffs who, if they are not playing and planning, are reading military books. But from reading various forums over the years I do not think that is necessarily the case, and for every gamer that can tell you the precise wingspan of any aircraft that ever flew, there are those whose knowledge is "light" at best. Absolutely nothing wrong in the latter - I assume that its the gaming that is the important factor for these people, rather than the history.

So if you fancy it, would be interested to know:

- what is your key driver for playing (M)WIF - game or history?
- what is your level of WWII knowledge?
- Main interest in WWII - e.g. land, air, naval, high level strategy, battles, personalities, economics.
- what started your interest in WWII history

1- game and simulation of geopolitic/economic constraints/interactions for how things went as they did
2- compared to some of the posters not that good, but I know enough to stand my ground at any party
3- high level strat and the side stories showing through the chrome (Pursuit of Glory is one of my favorites in that respect)
4- reading Churchill's memoires as a 16-year old.

Cheers,
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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by Centuur »

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Interested to know a bit about those that play (M)WIF in terms of their appetite for WWII history.

I assumed that everyone that plays a game like this or WITP-AE or WITE must be WWII / history buffs who, if they are not playing and planning, are reading military books. But from reading various forums over the years I do not think that is necessarily the case, and for every gamer that can tell you the precise wingspan of any aircraft that ever flew, there are those whose knowledge is "light" at best. Absolutely nothing wrong in the latter - I assume that its the gaming that is the important factor for these people, rather than the history.

So if you fancy it, would be interested to know:

- what is your key driver for playing (M)WIF - game or history?
- what is your level of WWII knowledge?
- Main interest in WWII - e.g. land, air, naval, high level strategy, battles, personalities, economics.
- what started your interest in WWII history

1. Both. I enjoy games and am interested in history in general. I'm also interested in Fortresses and Castles.
2. Same as AxelNL.
3. High level strategy, mainly, but also the political madness which appeared in the time before WW II too (going all the way back to the time before WW I, which for me was the main reason WW II started. The way the Germans were dealt with in the peace treaty was asking for another war...
4. The books of the Dutch writer K. Norel. They were written for boys and contained quite interesting stories of how WW II happened out of the Dutch perspective.
One was about a couple of fishermen sons who were 17 when war started and went over to an escape to England, entered the Dutch navy and than later got into the Dutch underground when dropped out of England.
One was about the Dutch navy and the Dutch merchant fleet.
And the last one was about the Dutch flying corps in the war and later in England.
For a 12 year old, those books were real adventures...
Peter
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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by Empire101 »

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Interested to know a bit about those that play (M)WIF in terms of their appetite for WWII history.

I assumed that everyone that plays a game like this or WITP-AE or WITE must be WWII / history buffs who, if they are not playing and planning, are reading military books. But from reading various forums over the years I do not think that is necessarily the case, and for every gamer that can tell you the precise wingspan of any aircraft that ever flew, there are those whose knowledge is "light" at best. Absolutely nothing wrong in the latter - I assume that its the gaming that is the important factor for these people, rather than the history.

So if you fancy it, would be interested to know:

- what is your key driver for playing (M)WIF - game or history?
- what is your level of WWII knowledge?
- Main interest in WWII - e.g. land, air, naval, high level strategy, battles, personalities, economics.
- what started your interest in WWII history

1. MWIF ( and WiF FE ) is in my opinion THE WWII strategy that encompasses the whole conflict in the most comprehensive and complete package. That said, the period from the end of WWI to the end of WWII is one of the most fascinating and truly horrible periods of human history, from technological advance, social change, political upheavals, great military triumphs and reverses, and the very pinnacle of human courage, bravery and stoicism vs the very depths of human depravity and brutality.

2. Level of WWII knowledge is very high, in most aspects of the period.

3. Main interest really covers all aspects, and have read extensively on the subjects.

4. Reading Enemy at the Gates: The Battle for Stalingrad, a book written by William Craig and published in 1974 by Penguin Publishing, and also purchasing SPI's ( may they live forever in Valhalla ), War in the East.

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[font="Tahoma"]Our lives may be more boring than those who lived in apocalyptic times,
but being bored is greatly preferable to being prematurely dead because of some ideological fantasy.
[/font] - Michael Burleigh

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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by AxelNL »

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Interested to know a bit about those that play (M)WIF in terms of their appetite for WWII history.

I assumed that everyone that plays a game like this or WITP-AE or WITE must be WWII / history buffs who, if they are not playing and planning, are reading military books. But from reading various forums over the years I do not think that is necessarily the case, and for every gamer that can tell you the precise wingspan of any aircraft that ever flew, there are those whose knowledge is "light" at best. Absolutely nothing wrong in the latter - I assume that its the gaming that is the important factor for these people, rather than the history.

So if you fancy it, would be interested to know:

- what is your key driver for playing (M)WIF - game or history?
- what is your level of WWII knowledge?
- Main interest in WWII - e.g. land, air, naval, high level strategy, battles, personalities, economics.
- what started your interest in WWII history

Warspite1 - just read the appendixes of volume 2 of the manuals because of another thread, and stumbled upon the sources from the unit write-ups. I must say that some of the people who helped in this area have very respectable libraries. Very impressive if that is all read. [&o]
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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by warspite1 »

Thanks for your answers guys - I think this sort of thing is good to help build a thread community - they are relatively common in the WITP-AE forum.

For my part I love history generally (inherited from my mum).

1. I do not know exactly, I guess its a case of what came first the chicken or the egg!? I have always loved playing games, and I developed an interest in history - I think its a case of one constantly feeding the other. If I find a game I like I want to learn about the history - the more I learn about the history the more I want to game it.

2. WWII knowledge level (particularly naval) has grown a lot over the last 5-years. I started off as a kid looking at the cool pictures of battleships and carriers in my big brothers books and the maps of Barbarossa and Case Yellow and the Desert War in my dad's Purnells History of the Second World War (I rarely bothered reading the text - that was too boring). As I got older, so the actual reading started, and it was another game - Desert Rats for the old Spectrum! - that really got me reading about the war.

Since joining the forum I have had a lot of good tips for books I would probably never have read e.g. Empire101 suggested Nomonhan 1939. Yeah right.. But it came with his recommendation so I thought, having had my interest picqued by having just read about the Japanese at Guadalcanal (Frank) (another recommendation by one of the guys in the WITP-AE forum) I would give it a go. What a couple of great books!

Now, playing the Germans on the Eastern Front I have got hold of a book on the Romanians in WWII and will read this as soon as I have finished The Gathering Storm.

3. Main interest surprise surprise is the naval war, although have an interest in most things. Less interested perhaps in individual stories and detail at squad or battalion level (prefer bigger picture).

4. Interest in the period came from my parents (dad was in the army before being invalided out in June 1940 and mum was an auxilliary nurse sent to Australia near the end of the war). As said above, there was lots of books on the period in the house, and in the 70's watching a big war film on TV with your family was a big occasion! - Dambusters, Battle of Britain etc.

Anyway that's my background.
Now Maitland, now's your time!

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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by Centuur »

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Thanks for your answers guys - I think this sort of thing is good to help build a thread community - they are relatively common in the WITP-AE forum.

For my part I love history generally (inherited from my mum).

1. I do not know exactly, I guess its a case of what came first the chicken or the egg!? I have always loved playing games, and I developed an interest in history - I think its a case of one constantly feeding the other. If I find a game I like I want to learn about the history - the more I learn about the history the more I want to game it.

2. WWII knowledge level (particularly naval) has grown a lot over the last 5-years. I started off as a kid looking at the cool pictures of battleships and carriers in my big brothers books and the maps of Barbarossa and Case Yellow and the Desert War in my dad's Purnells History of the Second World War (I rarely bothered reading the text - that was too boring). As I got older, so the actual reading started, and it was another game - Desert Rats for the old Spectrum! - that really got me reading about the war.

Since joining the forum I have had a lot of good tips for books I would probably never have read e.g. Empire101 suggested Nomonhan 1939. Yeah right.. But it came with his recommendation so I thought, having had my interest picqued by having just read about the Japanese at Guadalcanal (Frank) (another recommendation by one of the guys in the WITP-AE forum) I would give it a go. What a couple of great books!

Now, playing the Germans on the Eastern Front I have got hold of a book on the Romanians in WWII and will read this as soon as I have finished The Gathering Storm.

3. Main interest surprise surprise is the naval war, although have an interest in most things. Less interested perhaps in individual stories and detail at squad or battalion level (prefer bigger picture).

4. Interest in the period came from my parents (dad was in the army before being invalided out in June 1940 and mum was an auxilliary nurse sent to Australia near the end of the war). As said above, there was lots of books on the period in the house, and in the 70's watching a big war film on TV with your family was a big occasion! - Dambusters, Battle of Britain etc.

Anyway that's my background.

Now, those are two nice movies about WW II you've mentioned here. I don't know if you are interested in European films of WW II but if so, I think you will be interested in the film Soldier of Orange.
Peter
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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by Klydon »

Good thread!

1. Both. I think WiF is the best grand strategic game of WW2 and it isn't close. Game gives a lot of latitude in terms of "what if". I am looking forward to when they come out with the "Days of Decision" aspect of it, although I am afraid that is likely years away yet.

2. I would like to think my knowledge of WW2 is pretty good. I know there are a lot that are better at it, but I think I can hold my own in a conversation. I am more of a generalist in that I know the nuts and bolts for the most part of much of the equipment, be it tanks, ships or planes and I also know about the battles and also the leaders/personalities.

3. Pretty much everything. I think I started with more interest in naval stuff and it grew from there.

4. Hard to say. I have always been interested in history since I can remember, especially military history and especially WW2. I have branched out from there in both directions. Most of it started from a naval perspective, but has grown to other spheres. I enjoy reading stories from the perspective of 1 person (Rudel, Saburo Sakai, Erik Hartmann, etc), about battles, and about campaigns. I also enjoyed reading military fiction as well.

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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by Shellshock »

ORIGINAL: Centuur


I think you will be interested in the film Soldier of Orange.

I fondly recall being interested in Susan Penhaligon. [;)]

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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by warspite1 »

ORIGINAL: Centuur

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Thanks for your answers guys - I think this sort of thing is good to help build a thread community - they are relatively common in the WITP-AE forum.

For my part I love history generally (inherited from my mum).

1. I do not know exactly, I guess its a case of what came first the chicken or the egg!? I have always loved playing games, and I developed an interest in history - I think its a case of one constantly feeding the other. If I find a game I like I want to learn about the history - the more I learn about the history the more I want to game it.

2. WWII knowledge level (particularly naval) has grown a lot over the last 5-years. I started off as a kid looking at the cool pictures of battleships and carriers in my big brothers books and the maps of Barbarossa and Case Yellow and the Desert War in my dad's Purnells History of the Second World War (I rarely bothered reading the text - that was too boring). As I got older, so the actual reading started, and it was another game - Desert Rats for the old Spectrum! - that really got me reading about the war.

Since joining the forum I have had a lot of good tips for books I would probably never have read e.g. Empire101 suggested Nomonhan 1939. Yeah right.. But it came with his recommendation so I thought, having had my interest picqued by having just read about the Japanese at Guadalcanal (Frank) (another recommendation by one of the guys in the WITP-AE forum) I would give it a go. What a couple of great books!

Now, playing the Germans on the Eastern Front I have got hold of a book on the Romanians in WWII and will read this as soon as I have finished The Gathering Storm.

3. Main interest surprise surprise is the naval war, although have an interest in most things. Less interested perhaps in individual stories and detail at squad or battalion level (prefer bigger picture).

4. Interest in the period came from my parents (dad was in the army before being invalided out in June 1940 and mum was an auxilliary nurse sent to Australia near the end of the war). As said above, there was lots of books on the period in the house, and in the 70's watching a big war film on TV with your family was a big occasion! - Dambusters, Battle of Britain etc.

Anyway that's my background.

Now, those are two nice movies about WW II you've mentioned here. I don't know if you are interested in European films of WW II but if so, I think you will be interested in the film Soldier of Orange.
warspite1

To the best of my knowledge this has not been shown in the UK - would certainly be keen to see it.
Now Maitland, now's your time!

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Extraneous
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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by Extraneous »

What is My key driver for playing (M)WIF - game or history? Both game and history. Considering that WiF is one of the few "Monster games" to encompass strategic combined arms and politics since Strategy I (Simulations Publications, Inc. (SPI) 1974).

What is My level of WWII knowledge? Not having published anything on WWII I will have to claim "Novice". Regardless of My work on the write-ups and researching units.

What is My main interest in WWII (e.g. land, air, naval, high level strategy, battles, personalities, economics)? All of them.

What started My interest in WWII history? Being a "Baby Boomer" it would be Stalingrad (Avalon Hill 1963 (I was 13 when this came out)) before that movies, books, and comic books. Being a voracious reader and reading above my level since third grade (when the school library was completed).
University of Science Music and Culture (USMC) class of 71 and 72 ~ Extraneous (AKA Mziln)
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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by Ur_Vile_WEdge »

ORIGINAL: warspite1


-what is your key driver for playing (M)WIF - game or history?
- what is your level of WWII knowledge?
- Main interest in WWII - e.g. land, air, naval, high level strategy, battles, personalities, economics.
- what started your interest in WWII history


Key driver: Game. I grew up with this thing in my basement, my Dad was a HUGE fan and went to WiFcons, and I played my first impulse (as the Chinese, because Dad didn't think I could break anything too badly) at the age of 7 or so. If anything, the game is what fueled my interest in history, not the other way around.


Level of knowledge?: Deeper than the average person, but I'm hardly a buff. I don't particularly know or care about the technical differences between different models of fighters, or which battleships fought in which actions, or quite abit of hat. I do have some interest in strategy in tactics in general, which WW2 is a sub-set of, but my interest is more about the leadership and the maneuvering, not about the war itself.
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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by WarHunter »

warspite1, Nice topic of discussion.

- what is your key driver for playing (M)WIF - game or history?
Both.
The game forms a framework to either mirror known history or embark on alternate history. The short span of human time the game takes place in is so full of war history. No one can know all of it. But each time i have played in the past, it motivated me to learn more. Even now it has rekindled that passion.

As a game its a rare blending of Air/Sea/Ground simulation in a board game. Now translated to the computer media. It compliments what i know and what i want to accomplish within a gaming framework. I'm lucky to live in a time where some game designers in Australia created this masterpiece. I'm doubly blessed to be looking forward to playing all of you because of Steve's dedication in coding the game for us and Matrix distribution.

- what is your level of WWII knowledge?
Better than some worst than others always learning

- Main interest in WWII - e.g. land, air, naval, high level strategy, battles, personalities, economics.
My interest is in the big picture. Like a woman. What appeals to me at first just makes me want to know her better with time. Unlike all the women I've known, WW2 history still keeps my interest. So, back off my gal!

Learning about the Personalities is the window from which all else is viewed. You could say its always been my main interest. i appreciate reading about the people at all levels of the spectrum.

Naval, Air, Ground forces are all a close second. These 3 death dealers are a fundamental source of learning WW2 history.

From knowledge of the above all else follows. Strategy, battles, economics, home-front, entertainment all factor into interest. Some days more than others.

- what started your interest in WWII history
My dad. He left a uniform and regimental book from the 45th "Thunderbird" Division. He was the 1st personality that opened the window to learning about ww2 history. Between my dad an avid pool and card player and my mom the expert puzzle solver. My life as a wargamer, soaking in history was sealed.
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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by lomyrin »

what is your key driver for playing (M)WIF - game or history?
- what is your level of WWII knowledge?
- Main interest in WWII - e.g. land, air, naval, high level strategy, battles, personalities, economics.
- what started your interest in WWII history

[/quote]

I like complicated strategy games.
I actually remember some events from the last parts of the war
Seeing, as a young man, the aftermath in Germany where even 10 years after the war in 55 there were lots of ruins and people living in their basements, large empty areas with streets and nothing else.
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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by Centuur »

My mother has got pictures of the train journey they made from the Netherlands to Austria in 1951 when they went to visit the family there (She was 12 years old at the time). The journey took three days at that time with a lot of detours, due to bridges still not repaired. Those pictures are quite disturbing, seeing landmarks like the Cathedral of Cologne in a mass of ruins and stations where the only thing repaired were the railtracks through them. Not nice at all...
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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by warspite1 »

ORIGINAL: Centuur

My mother has got pictures of the train journey they made from the Netherlands to Austria in 1951 when they went to visit the family there (She was 12 years old at the time). The journey took three days at that time with a lot of detours, due to bridges still not repaired. Those pictures are quite disturbing, seeing landmarks like the Cathedral of Cologne in a mass of ruins and stations where the only thing repaired were the railtracks through them. Not nice at all...
warspite1

I thought the twin-towered cathedral survived (or am I thinking of a different city) - like our St Paul's it was a miracle when all around was destroyed. Isn't the cathedral on the football club's badge?

Edit: Yes - just checked it out. Took 14 hits but the towers survived.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cologne_Cathedral

http://www.fc-koeln.de/en/homepage/

Never knew they were the billy goats!!!
Now Maitland, now's your time!

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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by Orm »

1) Seeing if different strategies could work.
2) Hard to put a level of since I have no scale. I would think I know more than most but not as much as most that are members on this forum.
3) Now days I am interested in most aspects of history. But I am more interested of the European theatre of operations during WWII.
4) I was interested in WWII history from a young age. It probably begun with ESCI figures. But it could been that the WWII comics I read was first. When I was eight I read Biggles Sees It Through and I remember that I was very confused by the story. The German and Soviets worked together in the book [&:] while I thought they fought a war so my WWII interest must have begun before that.
Have a bit more patience with newbies. Of course some of them act dumb -- they're often students, for heaven's sake. - Terry Pratchett
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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by paulderynck »

- what is your key driver for playing (M)WIF - game or history?
- what is your level of WWII knowledge?
- Main interest in WWII - e.g. land, air, naval, high level strategy, battles, personalities, economics.
- what started your interest in WWII history

- the game

- I know a thing or two about a thing or two

- campaigns, naval, land, battles, personalities, diplomatic entanglements (order varies depending what I'm reading)

- When I was a kid, it was the Fiftieth anniversary of WWI. Life magazine had a series of installments that I was reading - mind you there were lots of pictures. I found an old trunk in the basement and while exploring it I discovered stuff about my grandfather - a picture of him in uniform, his medals and the notice that had come to my Dad's mom when he was killed at the battle of Amiens on August 8, 1918 - one of the "shock troops" of the Canadian Expeditionary Force, on the first day of "the hundred days".

Around the same time there were TV series like The Twentieth Century and Victory at Sea. I've been hooked on military history ever since. I'm always reading a book about military history. My favorite periods are WWII, the American Civil War, and the Roman Empire, but I'll read anything about anything if it's military history. My first wargame was AH's Battle of the Bulge, and I've been hooked on wargames ever since. The best one I've ever played is World in Flames.
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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by patchogue »

Soldier of Orange is available to stream on LoveFilm in the UK. Well worth watching.
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RE: Just out of interest.....

Post by bo »

Great thread.

75 years ago WW2 started, good lord and it is still the most read about talked about war in our nation and other nations history. I still play COD 2 at times just to get me back in that frame of mind of WW2. Of course if the Germans had some of the soldiers on COD 2 they would never have lost.

I am also a minor American Civil War buff, I found that very interesting but not in High school I hated the subject.

MWIF is to me without a doubt the most complete game of WW2 I have ever had the pleasure to study about it and play it, albeit not that well [:(] The reasons behind the rules in this game are marvelous, when something happens and you step back and think about it you have to say YEAH that must be how it was in this battle or that battle in WW2.

The other night I watched Tora Tora Tora again, one of my favorite movies. I think to myself how did those Japanese aviators feel when they heard that Pearl would be their target, what did they feel when they flew some 250 miles from their carriers to attack Pearl, the terrible mistakes that Naguma made not destroying the oil tanks on the island which would have forced the US carriers back to the mainland to refuel, and just maybe there would never have been a Midway or at least not in June of 1942.

The tides of war are mind numbing and I think this game brings that feeling out into the open unless your just someone who hates to move all those dreadful counters around [;)]

Bo
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