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RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/15/2014 9:46:31 PM   
Scott_WAR

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: paulderynck

quote:

ORIGINAL: Scott_WAR

A quick look at the prices of physical and download only games here will show you a difference in price. Download only are less expensive.


Like this?






You realize how stupid you look right now?

(in reply to paulderynck)
Post #: 31
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/15/2014 9:54:32 PM   
Scott_WAR

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: paulderynck


quote:

ORIGINAL: Scott_WAR

So far no answer has been given why the download version with just the game costs the same as the game and three hardback books. I am aware of how the game was released and how some claimed they would be happy with just downloading the game at the same price,...but as far as I am aware those people in no way speak for everyone.


The answer is immediately above in post #27. The fact you don't like the answer doesn't mean there's no answer.



The question is why is this one game the same price for the physical and download version. All other games that offer a physical and download version have the download version at a lower price than the physical version. This game has three hardbound books in the physical version which has to be a factor in cost....why do download only people have to pay for the books they don't want? Shipping and custom costs are NOT the cost of the books themselves.

(in reply to paulderynck)
Post #: 32
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/15/2014 10:15:57 PM   
paulderynck


Posts: 7503
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Once again - you misunderstand.

Matrix offered the game with the manuals - only. Go through and check the discussion threads.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3476048

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3444898

You'll see all those who suggested giving fake shipping addresses, or refusing the physical goods when they came to the door. They made it very clear they did not want the manuals. They asked over and over again for a download only version of the game. They claimed over and over again that they were happy to pay the price asked but not happy to pay FedEx (et al) additional money for hard copy manuals they did not want. They did not ask for a less expensive version of the game without the manuals. It is Matrix's right and their decision alone as to what they are selling for what price. They accommodated all those people. They are selling them the game in the form Matrix planned to sell it in. They are simply allowing all those who complained to have their wish.

If the game costs more because it contains the manuals then so what? That's how Matrix chose to market it. They are not offering the game as a download without the manuals, they are offering the game as a download with the option to not ship the manuals.



_____________________________

Paul

(in reply to Scott_WAR)
Post #: 33
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/15/2014 10:34:13 PM   
Scott_WAR

 

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Show me one of those people who is the spokesperson for everyone?

So....for the rest of the world that DIDNT say that,....whats the answer?
quote:

ORIGINAL: paulderynck

That's how Matrix chose to market it. They are not offering the game as a download without the manuals, they are offering the game as a download with the option to not ship the manuals.




Whats the reason they chose to market it that way, when its different than every other game they sell? Its a fair question.


As for "They are not offering the game as a download without the manuals, they are offering the game as a download with the option to not ship the manuals.
" that's about as silly a comment as I have seen in a while. The result of not shipping the manuals is THAT YOU DONT GET THE MANUALS. So you are BUYING THE DOWNLOAD WITHOUT THE MANUALS.

Trying to call a garbage collector a sanitation engineer doesn't change the fact that he collects garbage.

< Message edited by Scott_WAR -- 1/15/2014 11:42:58 PM >

(in reply to paulderynck)
Post #: 34
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 5:26:08 AM   
rbutters


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Considering that probably a good 60-70% of that $99 actually goes towards paying for the books (if not more like 80-90%), it's absolutely nuts to charge $99 for a "computer game" that is basically a database & ruleset (no AI). The value in the original product WAS the books, according to most of you. Take the books away and you have something MUCH LESS. You have a database and ruleset, with no application outside hotseat or the most likely small player community. It's insane to charge $99 for a digital ruleset.

When I saw the front page note that a digital product was being offered I clicked right to it. Not because I would actually play it with another live human (I wouldn't), and not because it would give me years of single player enjoyment (no AI), but because I thought it would simply be fun to explore. I'd have made an immediate purchase at $40-60. But $99? Without the addons that actually warrant that price? Not a chance.

I'm sure I'll be flamed relentlessly, but it's a certainty I'm not the only one who thinks this way. Lost opportunity, Matrix. Very silly price.

(in reply to Scott_WAR)
Post #: 35
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 6:00:28 AM   
warspite1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: rbutters

Considering that probably a good 60-70% of that $99 actually goes towards paying for the books (if not more like 80-90%), it's absolutely nuts to charge $99 for a "computer game" that is basically a database & ruleset (no AI). The value in the original product WAS the books, according to most of you. Take the books away and you have something MUCH LESS. You have a database and ruleset, with no application outside hotseat or the most likely small player community. It's insane to charge $99 for a digital ruleset.

When I saw the front page note that a digital product was being offered I clicked right to it. Not because I would actually play it with another live human (I wouldn't), and not because it would give me years of single player enjoyment (no AI), but because I thought it would simply be fun to explore. I'd have made an immediate purchase at $40-60. But $99? Without the addons that actually warrant that price? Not a chance.

I'm sure I'll be flamed relentlessly, but it's a certainty I'm not the only one who thinks this way. Lost opportunity, Matrix. Very silly price.
warspite1

And that is fair enough - you won't get flamed for the decision not to purchase as you have clearly (based on what you say) made the right choice. To spend $100 on something you just want the chance to explore does not make any sense, unless $100 is inconsequential to you.

You probably will get picked up on the comment about the price generally. I do not know why people - who have no money, no commitment tied up in Matrix, - think they can dictate price and that they know how to price better. The number of times I have seen on these forums "I have a background in retail/marketing/whatever and I know for a fact that if they sold their products cheaper they would make more profits". Really? Perhaps they could apply that thinking to the real world and tell me why, if life was that simple, any business EVER goes bust. After all, declining sales? Shrinking Market? Don't worry, just reduce you price and everything will be all right....

If Matrix have their price policy wrong they will not be around much longer - that is the law of the free market. Do you honestly believe that whatever price Matrix offered this game at, there would not be cries of too expensive - silly price - missed opportunity?

Moreover, do you really think that if Matrix knew how long this game would take to develop and that having done so they could only sell at $40 they would ever have authorised the project? or that any sane programmer would have taken it on? Not a chance.

Perhaps when Matrix are out of business and these type of games are no longer made you will be happy?

_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



(in reply to rbutters)
Post #: 36
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 6:05:08 AM   
JudgeDredd


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quote:

ORIGINAL: paulderynck


quote:

ORIGINAL: Scott_WAR

So far no answer has been given why the download version with just the game costs the same as the game and three hardback books. I am aware of how the game was released and how some claimed they would be happy with just downloading the game at the same price,...but as far as I am aware those people in no way speak for everyone.


The answer is immediately above in post #27. The fact you don't like the answer doesn't mean there's no answer.

He's looking for an answer from Matrix Games - like an official answer - not an answer from some pseudo spokesman or self assigned forum policeman.

He's entitled to ask - you can answer if you want, but he can choose to ignore your answer because he wants to know officially.

And as he said - the people who were willing to pay the same price without the books were not spokespeople for everyone. You probably only saw those answers in those threads because the rest couldn't be arsed to say that wasn't acceptable to them because of the hostility in this place.

If you don't like the "whining" and "carping" and "complaining" then don't read. Go play the game. And those terms used themselves are inflammatory.

HTF did you think this thread was going to go with that statement?

_____________________________

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I AM the Law!

(in reply to paulderynck)
Post #: 37
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 6:26:46 AM   
warspite1


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Joined: 2/2/2008
From: England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd


quote:

ORIGINAL: paulderynck


quote:

ORIGINAL: Scott_WAR

So far no answer has been given why the download version with just the game costs the same as the game and three hardback books. I am aware of how the game was released and how some claimed they would be happy with just downloading the game at the same price,...but as far as I am aware those people in no way speak for everyone.


The answer is immediately above in post #27. The fact you don't like the answer doesn't mean there's no answer.

He's looking for an answer from Matrix Games - like an official answer - not an answer from some pseudo spokesman or self assigned forum policeman.

He's entitled to ask - you can answer if you want, but he can choose to ignore your answer because he wants to know officially.

And as he said - the people who were willing to pay the same price without the books were not spokespeople for everyone. You probably only saw those answers in those threads because the rest couldn't be arsed to say that wasn't acceptable to them because of the hostility in this place.

If you don't like the "whining" and "carping" and "complaining" then don't read. Go play the game. And those terms used themselves are inflammatory.

HTF did you think this thread was going to go with that statement?
warspite1

No they were not spokespeople for everyone, but its slightly strange that not one person - not one - refuted that statement (which was made many times loud and clear) and said that NO, they would want a cheaper version.

As for the "probable" reason you gave for people not stating they expected it to be cheaper.... I don't really think so do you, not when this was such a hot topic at the time?

_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



(in reply to JudgeDredd)
Post #: 38
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 6:33:17 AM   
JudgeDredd


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quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1
No they were not spokespeople for everyone, but its slightly strange that not one person - not one - refuted that statement (which was made many times loud and clear) and said that NO, they would want a cheaper version.

As for the "probable" reason you gave for people not stating they expected it to be cheaper.... I don't really think so do you, not when this was such a hot topic at the time?

Given the hostility in this place and (further) any price thread for any game, I don't see why that is strange at all. And yes - I do think that was an aspect.

This place is full of unofficial forum police. Whenever anyone brings up a price topic, it goes to hell in a hand basket.

There was a statement made by Erik that a statement would be made and everything went pretty quiet. I believe that was because people thought he was on the case.

I also believe, along with the hostility, that people didn't think for a split second that Matrix would select one product in their entire arsenal of games to set the DD version at the same price as the physical product. Especially as you lot were pointing out how important the books were and how big a part of the purchase it was.

Regardless - they were asking Matrix - not anyone else. For anyone else to answer, without an official answering, just means this thread goes round and round like all the others. I thought I explained this to you before.

< Message edited by JudgeDredd -- 1/16/2014 7:34:19 AM >


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(in reply to warspite1)
Post #: 39
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 6:52:38 AM   
warspite1


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From: England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1
No they were not spokespeople for everyone, but its slightly strange that not one person - not one - refuted that statement (which was made many times loud and clear) and said that NO, they would want a cheaper version.

As for the "probable" reason you gave for people not stating they expected it to be cheaper.... I don't really think so do you, not when this was such a hot topic at the time?

Given the hostility in this place and (further) any price thread for any game, I don't see why that is strange at all. And yes - I do think that was an aspect.

This place is full of unofficial forum police. Whenever anyone brings up a price topic, it goes to hell in a hand basket.

There was a statement made by Erik that a statement would be made and everything went pretty quiet. I believe that was because people thought he was on the case.

I also believe, along with the hostility, that people didn't think for a split second that Matrix would select one product in their entire arsenal of games to set the DD version at the same price as the physical product. Especially as you lot were pointing out how important the books were and how big a part of the purchase it was.

Regardless - they were asking Matrix - not anyone else. For anyone else to answer, without an official answering, just means this thread goes round and round like all the others. I thought I explained this to you before.
warspite1

You turn up from time to time to have a go (at whoever) - and in your posts complain that threads go round and round - but cannot see the irony that that, by posting, you are part of that process that you profess to be so fed up of. I thought I had explained this to you before?





_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



(in reply to JudgeDredd)
Post #: 40
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 7:07:20 AM   
JudgeDredd


Posts: 8551
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From: Scotland
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oh - so it's only regular posters that can post?

I am merely pointing out that you are keeping the thread in perpetual motion.

He asked a question of Matrix and as usual the pseudo employees show up.

For the record - the reason I only "turn up from time to time" is certain individuals made this place pretty uninhabitable. Matrix is a fantastic company. Their decisions seem ludicrous from time to time - but it's their business. That doesn't mean people can't ask questions of them.

I am not fed up of any process. You are. Look at your first post in this thread (and any other one that dares to ask Matrix a question that doesn't come under your fictional list of "acceptable questions"). You have repeatedly stated these threads get on your bloody nerves and yet you post in them. I pointed this out to you last time. You keep it at the forefront of the forum (though in this case you have a free ride on that because it's a sticky).

I'm not fed up with these threads popping up. Nor am I fed up with them being kept in a vicious circle - doesn't bother me one bit. I'm just a voice that says "He is asking Matrix - NOT YOU!".

And I'm not "complaining" about the thread going round and round - I'm simply pointing out the irony (seems we both like that word) of you posting in a thread you dislike so vehemently.

Anyway - carry on - but he IS asking the question of Matrix and he IS wanting an answer from them...not anyone else.

< Message edited by JudgeDredd -- 1/16/2014 8:09:05 AM >


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(in reply to warspite1)
Post #: 41
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 7:34:32 AM   
Aurelian

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1


quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1
No they were not spokespeople for everyone, but its slightly strange that not one person - not one - refuted that statement (which was made many times loud and clear) and said that NO, they would want a cheaper version.

As for the "probable" reason you gave for people not stating they expected it to be cheaper.... I don't really think so do you, not when this was such a hot topic at the time?

Given the hostility in this place and (further) any price thread for any game, I don't see why that is strange at all. And yes - I do think that was an aspect.

This place is full of unofficial forum police. Whenever anyone brings up a price topic, it goes to hell in a hand basket.

There was a statement made by Erik that a statement would be made and everything went pretty quiet. I believe that was because people thought he was on the case.

I also believe, along with the hostility, that people didn't think for a split second that Matrix would select one product in their entire arsenal of games to set the DD version at the same price as the physical product. Especially as you lot were pointing out how important the books were and how big a part of the purchase it was.

Regardless - they were asking Matrix - not anyone else. For anyone else to answer, without an official answering, just means this thread goes round and round like all the others. I thought I explained this to you before.
warspite1

You turn up from time to time to have a go (at whoever) - and in your posts complain that threads go round and round - but cannot see the irony that that, by posting, you are part of that process that you profess to be so fed up of. I thought I had explained this to you before?






The green button works wonders for the blood pressure :)

And it's all the same nonsense. "I don't like the price!! Drop it so I can buy it."

Really, if they can't buy a *game*, they need a long, hard, look in the mirror to see what the problem is.

And being a private company, they don't *have* to explain their pricing decisions to anyone here. Don't know why there are those who think they're entitled to it.

CwiE, a computer port of an old game, sells for $60. For those who don't know what that is, it's SPI/DG's War in Europe. Fore about $40 more, you get the whole bleeping WW2. And in more detail.

< Message edited by Aurelian -- 1/16/2014 9:08:59 AM >


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(in reply to warspite1)
Post #: 42
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 8:28:18 AM   
JudgeDredd


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aurelian
The green button works wonders for the blood pressure :)

And it's all the same nonsense. "I don't like the price!! Drop it so I can buy it."

Really, if they can't buy a *game*, they need a long, hard, look in the mirror to see what the problem is.

And being a private company, they don't *have* to explain their pricing decisions to anyone here. Don't know why there are those who think they're entitled to it.

CwiE, a computer port of an old game, sells for $60. For those who don't know what that is, it's SPI/DG's War in Europe. Fore about $40 more, you get the whole bleeping WW2. And in more detail.

I don't recall anyone demanding anything from Matrix, anyone suggesting Matrix HAVE to explain their position or suggesting they (as the potential customer) are entitled anything.

Nonsense? Really? So your posts contain more valid points than anyone else's here right? Wrong!

"if they can't buy a game" - I don't see anyone posting they "can't" buy the game. The question asked, the original question, was why is DD the same price as a physical copy for a) a lesser product and b) that isn't the way Matrix have operated in the past. It could be a change in policy...who knows. Point is, they don't want an answer from me or you - do they?

The question was asked and as usual, the usual suspects jumped on the board to piss fuel all over some tinder wood whilst bitching about a thread being created "again".

I was merely pointing out he can ask the question if he wants. For you, the self appointed forum policemen or Matrix spokesperson (choose whichever one you wish), you are more than entitled to answer - but be aware he asked the question of Matrix - not you lot - and as such will likely continue asking until he gets an answer (not that he's entitled one nor should necessarily expect one) or gets bored.

On top of that - it's not only what was posted in the responses, but the tone in which those responses were posted. In an extremely condescending manner.

_____________________________

JudgeDredd
I AM the Law!

(in reply to Aurelian)
Post #: 43
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 10:13:28 AM   
JiminyJickers


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From: New Zealand
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Even though I am okay with paying the price, I agree with JudgeDredd.

The hostility in these threads have put me off this game a bit, maybe I need to wait for the AI expansion or play solo.

I thought we had a good community on Matrix but it seems to have changed. Some game threads are good and friendly, but I am noticing a lot more hostility and no tolerance for people with different views.

Hopefully we can one day go back to a friendly helpful community like we had in the past.

(in reply to JudgeDredd)
Post #: 44
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 11:49:47 AM   
Manstein63


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When the WIF was first released you were given a Free Download along with the physical copy so it seem reasonable to me that if you just want the download version you should pay the same price. after all you are getting the exact same game with the same support you just don't have the free CD & Books. BTW how many people have had to pay an additional cost I'm interested because I only paid retail.
Manstein63

(in reply to paulderynck)
Post #: 45
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 5:34:56 PM   
Centuur


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From: Hoorn (NED).
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JiminyJickers

Even though I am okay with paying the price, I agree with JudgeDredd.

The hostility in these threads have put me off this game a bit, maybe I need to wait for the AI expansion or play solo.

I thought we had a good community on Matrix but it seems to have changed. Some game threads are good and friendly, but I am noticing a lot more hostility and no tolerance for people with different views.

Hopefully we can one day go back to a friendly helpful community like we had in the past.


The hostility occurs due to a couple of things:
1. MWIF isn't at this moment what people demand it to be. They are right on that account.
2. Some people didn't read the product discription before buying it and therefore more disappointed than those which did. That doesn't improve things too
3. The very high transport costs to get the books (which I would advise anyone to buy, since they are very helpful during play, especially when you don't have at least two screens) for some area's of the world...
4. The way some people are behaving on this forum (only critizising, not contributing).
5. The continuing (also in this topic) question for the price to go down
6. The continuous asking for "when is this or that ready"...

Now, all this isn't contributing to a nice friendly and helpful community at this moment. You are right about that. However, there are a lot of people trying to be nice and helpful. It's only sometimes very difficult to stay polite if someone keeps asking and asking if a certain bug is fixed or not.

There are times when I really become angry behind my laptop and have to count to ten before replying. Sometimes a get so angry that I already have pressed the OK button on a reaction (this is not one of them)...

But I think MWIF will become a great game, if we give Steve the time to fix things. Patience, patience (and I'm an impatient man, just like a lot of us here).






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Post #: 46
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 6:23:55 PM   
Scott_WAR

 

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Almost every game sold by matrix has a physical version and a download version....with the download version costing $10 less because the download version costs less to produce.

This games physical version has even more than the other physical versions with the 3 hardbound books,..common sense would dictate that the download version for this game would get an even larger discount because of the lack of the cost of the hardbound books.


I do not want the books. By paying the same price for the game without the books I would in essence STILL be buying the books,...but just not getting them. Who thought this would be a good idea? If I didn't think the original purchase of the books and game was worth it because I do not want to pay for books I do not want....why on earth would I want an even worse deal of still buying the books but just not getting them?




< Message edited by Scott_WAR -- 1/16/2014 7:28:20 PM >

(in reply to Centuur)
Post #: 47
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 6:39:25 PM   
markb50k

 

Posts: 1145
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From: Spring, TX
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Kinda simple, really.

On day 1, the primary complaint was NOT the price of $99 (many were hoping for around $100, but estimates as high as $150-200 were being assumed by many prior to release).  The complaint was that due to shipping etc the cost was:

(game + books) = $99 + tacked on shipping + customs

now it is:

game = $99


The other side of the argument really stops right there.

But, I would add, that despite all of the above details, lets not ignore the basic fact that $99 for a game of this magnitude is a good price, and is comparable in value to games even within Matrix.  WITP-AE for $80, for example. 

Your argument to the casual observer seems a no-brainer, but the real history of this is anything but casual.






< Message edited by markb50k -- 1/16/2014 7:43:17 PM >

(in reply to Scott_WAR)
Post #: 48
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 8:07:50 PM   
Centuur


Posts: 7879
Joined: 6/3/2011
From: Hoorn (NED).
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Scott_WAR

Almost every game sold by matrix has a physical version and a download version....with the download version costing $10 less because the download version costs less to produce.

This games physical version has even more than the other physical versions with the 3 hardbound books,..common sense would dictate that the download version for this game would get an even larger discount because of the lack of the cost of the hardbound books.


I do not want the books. By paying the same price for the game without the books I would in essence STILL be buying the books,...but just not getting them. Who thought this would be a good idea? If I didn't think the original purchase of the books and game was worth it because I do not want to pay for books I do not want....why on earth would I want an even worse deal of still buying the books but just not getting them?





That policy don't seem to be the case with MWIF. Why? Who knows? Perhaps ADG has defined a minimum price for the game... Perhaps the contract with Steve has a minimum price in it... Perhaps Matrix don't want to do so with MWIF, as they think they have done enough to satisfy the consumer. Anyhow, that shouldn't be our concern. You either buy the game for this price or not.
Or you can wait for a lower price in the future. However, if there is a minimum price agreed on in contract, you may have to wait forever...

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Post #: 49
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 8:27:49 PM   
Mike Parker

 

Posts: 583
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From: Houston TX
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quote:

ORIGINAL: markb50k

Kinda simple, really.

On day 1, the primary complaint was NOT the price of $99 (many were hoping for around $100, but estimates as high as $150-200 were being assumed by many prior to release).  The complaint was that due to shipping etc the cost was:

(game + books) = $99 + tacked on shipping + customs

now it is:

game = $99


The other side of the argument really stops right there.

But, I would add, that despite all of the above details, lets not ignore the basic fact that $99 for a game of this magnitude is a good price, and is comparable in value to games even within Matrix.  WITP-AE for $80, for example. 

Your argument to the casual observer seems a no-brainer, but the real history of this is anything but casual.


Markb50k hit the nail on the head. I really honestly did not think Matrix would release a DD only version. I am glad they did because some folks (mostly European it seemed) were complaining of some VERY stout shipping fees and in some cases import tariffs that were sometimes make I believe a 75ish Euro purchase cost them 130ish Euros. I think Matrix really went the extra mile to get a DD offering in this case and did so to help out those fans that were really punished by the extra fees.

I do understand why some folks would think... wow this doesn't make sense, but if you had been reading from the start (not that you neccessarily should have) you would have seen the development, and maybe not be so bewildered (or upset).

I am not trying to be hostile I swear... just maybe shaking my head saying "Oh I knew this was gonna happen" and I assume the folks at Matrix did too.. which makes it even a bolder decision to make purely in an effort to satisfy some of their customers.

(in reply to markb50k)
Post #: 50
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 8:37:38 PM   
warspite1


Posts: 37547
Joined: 2/2/2008
From: England
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

oh - so it's only regular posters that can post?

I am merely pointing out that you are keeping the thread in perpetual motion.

He asked a question of Matrix and as usual the pseudo employees show up.

For the record - the reason I only "turn up from time to time" is certain individuals made this place pretty uninhabitable. Matrix is a fantastic company. Their decisions seem ludicrous from time to time - but it's their business. That doesn't mean people can't ask questions of them.

I am not fed up of any process. You are. Look at your first post in this thread (and any other one that dares to ask Matrix a question that doesn't come under your fictional list of "acceptable questions"). You have repeatedly stated these threads get on your bloody nerves and yet you post in them. I pointed this out to you last time. You keep it at the forefront of the forum (though in this case you have a free ride on that because it's a sticky).

I'm not fed up with these threads popping up. Nor am I fed up with them being kept in a vicious circle - doesn't bother me one bit. I'm just a voice that says "He is asking Matrix - NOT YOU!".

And I'm not "complaining" about the thread going round and round - I'm simply pointing out the irony (seems we both like that word) of you posting in a thread you dislike so vehemently.

Anyway - carry on - but he IS asking the question of Matrix and he IS wanting an answer from them...not anyone else.
warspite1

Its only regular posters that can post? Where the hell did that come from??? Why do you consistently miss the point???

Yes he asked a question of Matrix, and given what has gone on before, supporters of the game got a tad vexed by said question.

No This place is not "pretty uninhabitable". Its a forum, it is what you make it - it can be fun if people have a sense of humour, it can be a learning centre if people want it to be, or it can be a slug fest. It is what it is...

Yes you are. I have not repeatedly stated any such thing and you know it - you are trying to win points by stating blatant untruths - shame on you.

Yes you are. You were a regular on the forum when I joined and then you turned all weird - for what reason I do not know - and just show up from time to time to throw a hand grenade in.

Yes you are - but you don't seem to grasp the reality.

Yes we will carry on - thank-you. And btw, could the real JudgeDredd, the one that was here when I first joined the forum, please come back,


_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



(in reply to JudgeDredd)
Post #: 51
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 8:39:05 PM   
Scott_WAR

 

Posts: 1023
Joined: 2/24/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur


quote:

ORIGINAL: Scott_WAR

Almost every game sold by matrix has a physical version and a download version....with the download version costing $10 less because the download version costs less to produce.

This games physical version has even more than the other physical versions with the 3 hardbound books,..common sense would dictate that the download version for this game would get an even larger discount because of the lack of the cost of the hardbound books.


I do not want the books. By paying the same price for the game without the books I would in essence STILL be buying the books,...but just not getting them. Who thought this would be a good idea? If I didn't think the original purchase of the books and game was worth it because I do not want to pay for books I do not want....why on earth would I want an even worse deal of still buying the books but just not getting them?





That policy don't seem to be the case with MWIF. Why? Who knows? Perhaps ADG has defined a minimum price for the game... Perhaps the contract with Steve has a minimum price in it... Perhaps Matrix don't want to do so with MWIF, as they think they have done enough to satisfy the consumer. Anyhow, that shouldn't be our concern. You either buy the game for this price or not.
Or you can wait for a lower price in the future. However, if there is a minimum price agreed on in contract, you may have to wait forever...


And that's the reason we ask the question.....because there is an answer that's better than "Who knows?" So let them answer the question.

As for the post above about the appearance to the casual gamer......you mean the way it appears to the majority of gamers......as in all of them who don't frequent this forum regularly.

you would think most would realize that if you only get the people who frequent this forum to buy the game,...the game will be a huge financial failure...so you might want to have an answer for those "other" gamers.

(in reply to Centuur)
Post #: 52
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 8:39:59 PM   
warspite1


Posts: 37547
Joined: 2/2/2008
From: England
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aurelian

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1


quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1
No they were not spokespeople for everyone, but its slightly strange that not one person - not one - refuted that statement (which was made many times loud and clear) and said that NO, they would want a cheaper version.

As for the "probable" reason you gave for people not stating they expected it to be cheaper.... I don't really think so do you, not when this was such a hot topic at the time?

Given the hostility in this place and (further) any price thread for any game, I don't see why that is strange at all. And yes - I do think that was an aspect.

This place is full of unofficial forum police. Whenever anyone brings up a price topic, it goes to hell in a hand basket.

There was a statement made by Erik that a statement would be made and everything went pretty quiet. I believe that was because people thought he was on the case.

I also believe, along with the hostility, that people didn't think for a split second that Matrix would select one product in their entire arsenal of games to set the DD version at the same price as the physical product. Especially as you lot were pointing out how important the books were and how big a part of the purchase it was.

Regardless - they were asking Matrix - not anyone else. For anyone else to answer, without an official answering, just means this thread goes round and round like all the others. I thought I explained this to you before.
warspite1

You turn up from time to time to have a go (at whoever) - and in your posts complain that threads go round and round - but cannot see the irony that that, by posting, you are part of that process that you profess to be so fed up of. I thought I had explained this to you before?






The green button works wonders for the blood pressure :)

And it's all the same nonsense. "I don't like the price!! Drop it so I can buy it."

Really, if they can't buy a *game*, they need a long, hard, look in the mirror to see what the problem is.

And being a private company, they don't *have* to explain their pricing decisions to anyone here. Don't know why there are those who think they're entitled to it.

CwiE, a computer port of an old game, sells for $60. For those who don't know what that is, it's SPI/DG's War in Europe. Fore about $40 more, you get the whole bleeping WW2. And in more detail.
warspite1

Sorry Aurelian, probably my stupidity, but I do not use the green button - EVER. It just seems so undemocratic....


_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



(in reply to Aurelian)
Post #: 53
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 8:43:59 PM   
warspite1


Posts: 37547
Joined: 2/2/2008
From: England
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd


quote:

ORIGINAL: Aurelian
The green button works wonders for the blood pressure :)

And it's all the same nonsense. "I don't like the price!! Drop it so I can buy it."

Really, if they can't buy a *game*, they need a long, hard, look in the mirror to see what the problem is.

And being a private company, they don't *have* to explain their pricing decisions to anyone here. Don't know why there are those who think they're entitled to it.

CwiE, a computer port of an old game, sells for $60. For those who don't know what that is, it's SPI/DG's War in Europe. Fore about $40 more, you get the whole bleeping WW2. And in more detail.

I don't recall anyone demanding anything from Matrix, anyone suggesting Matrix HAVE to explain their position or suggesting they (as the potential customer) are entitled anything.

Nonsense? Really? So your posts contain more valid points than anyone else's here right? Wrong!

"if they can't buy a game" - I don't see anyone posting they "can't" buy the game. The question asked, the original question, was why is DD the same price as a physical copy for a) a lesser product and b) that isn't the way Matrix have operated in the past. It could be a change in policy...who knows. Point is, they don't want an answer from me or you - do they?

The question was asked and as usual, the usual suspects jumped on the board to piss fuel all over some tinder wood whilst bitching about a thread being created "again".

I was merely pointing out he can ask the question if he wants. For you, the self appointed forum policemen or Matrix spokesperson (choose whichever one you wish), you are more than entitled to answer - but be aware he asked the question of Matrix - not you lot - and as such will likely continue asking until he gets an answer (not that he's entitled one nor should necessarily expect one) or gets bored.

On top of that - it's not only what was posted in the responses, but the tone in which those responses were posted. In an extremely condescending manner.
warspite1

Well then re-read some of the pricing posts - you obviously missed the point of many.

And so typical - you complain at the tone of those that support the Matrix position - but not those that seek to rubbish it. How convenient....

Condescending??? "I thought I explained this to you before". Pot. Kettle. Black.


_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



(in reply to JudgeDredd)
Post #: 54
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 8:48:29 PM   
Aurelian

 

Posts: 3910
Joined: 2/26/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1


quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd


quote:

ORIGINAL: Aurelian
The green button works wonders for the blood pressure :)

And it's all the same nonsense. "I don't like the price!! Drop it so I can buy it."

Really, if they can't buy a *game*, they need a long, hard, look in the mirror to see what the problem is.

And being a private company, they don't *have* to explain their pricing decisions to anyone here. Don't know why there are those who think they're entitled to it.

CwiE, a computer port of an old game, sells for $60. For those who don't know what that is, it's SPI/DG's War in Europe. Fore about $40 more, you get the whole bleeping WW2. And in more detail.

I don't recall anyone demanding anything from Matrix, anyone suggesting Matrix HAVE to explain their position or suggesting they (as the potential customer) are entitled anything.

Nonsense? Really? So your posts contain more valid points than anyone else's here right? Wrong!

"if they can't buy a game" - I don't see anyone posting they "can't" buy the game. The question asked, the original question, was why is DD the same price as a physical copy for a) a lesser product and b) that isn't the way Matrix have operated in the past. It could be a change in policy...who knows. Point is, they don't want an answer from me or you - do they?

The question was asked and as usual, the usual suspects jumped on the board to piss fuel all over some tinder wood whilst bitching about a thread being created "again".

I was merely pointing out he can ask the question if he wants. For you, the self appointed forum policemen or Matrix spokesperson (choose whichever one you wish), you are more than entitled to answer - but be aware he asked the question of Matrix - not you lot - and as such will likely continue asking until he gets an answer (not that he's entitled one nor should necessarily expect one) or gets bored.

On top of that - it's not only what was posted in the responses, but the tone in which those responses were posted. In an extremely condescending manner.
warspite1

Well then re-read some of the pricing posts - you obviously missed the point of many.

And so typical - you complain at the tone of those that support the Matrix position - but not those that seek to rubbish it. How convenient....

Condescending??? "I thought I explained this to you before". Pot. Kettle. Black.



Ahhhh nuts, I have him green buttoned because I got tired of the constant blathering over how a successful company does business.

Thanks....

_____________________________

"I always take life with a grain of salt. Plus, a slice of lemon. And a shot of tequila."

(in reply to warspite1)
Post #: 55
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 8:48:32 PM   
warspite1


Posts: 37547
Joined: 2/2/2008
From: England
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: JiminyJickers

Even though I am okay with paying the price, I agree with JudgeDredd.

The hostility in these threads have put me off this game a bit, maybe I need to wait for the AI expansion or play solo.

I thought we had a good community on Matrix but it seems to have changed. Some game threads are good and friendly, but I am noticing a lot more hostility and no tolerance for people with different views.

Hopefully we can one day go back to a friendly helpful community like we had in the past.
warspite1

Here we go again - "the hostility in these threads". Where the hell did that come from?

Yes, we have a core of a very good community at Matrix - no it has not changed. Look at the WITP-AE thread, look at the MWIF thread, look at the CTGW thread. There are people that want to play the game, help others to play the game, and there are people - in all forums - that want to trash everything. The core posters remain in each. The trash ultimately get bored and go away.


_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



(in reply to JiminyJickers)
Post #: 56
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 8:50:59 PM   
warspite1


Posts: 37547
Joined: 2/2/2008
From: England
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Manstein63

When the WIF was first released you were given a Free Download along with the physical copy so it seem reasonable to me that if you just want the download version you should pay the same price. after all you are getting the exact same game with the same support you just don't have the free CD & Books. BTW how many people have had to pay an additional cost I'm interested because I only paid retail.
Manstein63
warspite1

Yes, I paid additional cost from customs. But hey so what? I got a great game, and a great set of books and maps. Now people are getting this without that charge. Good luck to them. No BITCHING from me.

_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



(in reply to Manstein63)
Post #: 57
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 8:54:08 PM   
warspite1


Posts: 37547
Joined: 2/2/2008
From: England
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Scott_WAR

Almost every game sold by matrix has a physical version and a download version....with the download version costing $10 less because the download version costs less to produce.

This games physical version has even more than the other physical versions with the 3 hardbound books,..common sense would dictate that the download version for this game would get an even larger discount because of the lack of the cost of the hardbound books.


I do not want the books. By paying the same price for the game without the books I would in essence STILL be buying the books,...but just not getting them. Who thought this would be a good idea? If I didn't think the original purchase of the books and game was worth it because I do not want to pay for books I do not want....why on earth would I want an even worse deal of still buying the books but just not getting them?



warspite1

Fine. So vote with your feet and don't by the game. Who thought it was a good idea? Matrix obviously. If people do not purchase they will be proven wrong and you will be happy.


_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



(in reply to Scott_WAR)
Post #: 58
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 9:02:03 PM   
Aurelian

 

Posts: 3910
Joined: 2/26/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1


quote:

ORIGINAL: JiminyJickers

Even though I am okay with paying the price, I agree with JudgeDredd.

The hostility in these threads have put me off this game a bit, maybe I need to wait for the AI expansion or play solo.

I thought we had a good community on Matrix but it seems to have changed. Some game threads are good and friendly, but I am noticing a lot more hostility and no tolerance for people with different views.

Hopefully we can one day go back to a friendly helpful community like we had in the past.
warspite1

Here we go again - "the hostility in these threads". Where the hell did that come from?

Yes, we have a core of a very good community at Matrix - no it has not changed. Look at the WITP-AE thread, look at the MWIF thread, look at the CTGW thread. There are people that want to play the game, help others to play the game, and there are people - in all forums - that want to trash everything. The core posters remain in each. The trash ultimately get bored and go away.



It all stems from those who just won't be satisfied. A d/l only option was wanted, it was delivered. But no, it isn't good enough. No matter how you slice it, it's a bargin. I wish they could do the same thing with SPW's WW1 series. That would be a freaking bargin at $100.

_____________________________

"I always take life with a grain of salt. Plus, a slice of lemon. And a shot of tequila."

(in reply to warspite1)
Post #: 59
RE: World in Flames Download Version Now Available - 1/16/2014 9:04:39 PM   
warspite1


Posts: 37547
Joined: 2/2/2008
From: England
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aurelian


quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1


quote:

ORIGINAL: JiminyJickers

Even though I am okay with paying the price, I agree with JudgeDredd.

The hostility in these threads have put me off this game a bit, maybe I need to wait for the AI expansion or play solo.

I thought we had a good community on Matrix but it seems to have changed. Some game threads are good and friendly, but I am noticing a lot more hostility and no tolerance for people with different views.

Hopefully we can one day go back to a friendly helpful community like we had in the past.
warspite1

Here we go again - "the hostility in these threads". Where the hell did that come from?

Yes, we have a core of a very good community at Matrix - no it has not changed. Look at the WITP-AE thread, look at the MWIF thread, look at the CTGW thread. There are people that want to play the game, help others to play the game, and there are people - in all forums - that want to trash everything. The core posters remain in each. The trash ultimately get bored and go away.



It all stems from those who just won't be satisfied. A d/l only option was wanted, it was delivered. But no, it isn't good enough. No matter how you slice it, it's a bargin. I wish they could do the same thing with SPW's WW1 series. That would be a freaking bargin at $100.
warspite1

Correct - they are not satisfied and so bitch and moan, but its us that are hostile


_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



(in reply to Aurelian)
Post #: 60
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