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Optimum training percent

 
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Optimum training percent - 5/20/2013 5:58:00 PM   
Jim Stevens

 

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What is the best percentage to use for training assuming no other mission is required? I am trying to hurry training as best I can but not at the expense of equipment or men.
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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/20/2013 6:09:23 PM   
Nemo121


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100% training of the skill you want but range set to 0.

That way everyone trains and the risk of operational losses while training ( due to fatigue ) is minimised.

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/20/2013 6:17:13 PM   
geofflambert


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70. First train to 70 on their first mission priority, then the second if and when you can afford further training, then the third. LBs : ground attack, then search (or vice versa), then transport. Navy DBs: Naval attack, search (or vice versa), then recon. If you really have the luxury, then ground attack. TBs: naval attack with torps, then bombs, then ASW, then ground attack. Army DBs: your choice, naval attack and ground attack. Any aircraft type you have a surplus of, train for what you need the most, early on search is a biggie.

Oops, misunderstood the question. Nemo is correct.

< Message edited by geofflambert -- 5/20/2013 6:20:11 PM >


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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/20/2013 6:24:50 PM   
geofflambert


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If they're front line and you want to keep them tuned up so to speak 20% is often what I use. If it's a new skill and the need is urgent, 30/30 or 30/40 is good but keep an eye on fatigue and morale. Best thing though is to cycle your pilots back to training squadrons and replace them with more completely trained pilots. Crews in training squadrons even at 100% tend to have very high morale. Front line crews need as much rest as they can get.

< Message edited by geofflambert -- 5/20/2013 6:28:27 PM >


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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/20/2013 6:29:36 PM   
Nemo121


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While everyone's entitled to an opinion I'd counsel against the sort of splitting geofflambert posits.

If a unit is in the front-line then it should be dedicated to combat while other units are pulled out of the front and dedicated to training. This habit some people have of splitting within a squadron so a portion trains while the rest is ready to fight results in:
a) higher casualties during enemy assaults - as training elements get caught by enemy sweeps etc
b) decreased efficiency in training outcomes
c) a muddling of roles

It also speaks to a muddling in the mind of their commander. How clear can their strategic intent and operations plan be if they cannot even commit themselves to a single stance within squadrons?

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/20/2013 6:39:10 PM   
Chickenboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim Stevens

What is the best percentage to use for training assuming no other mission is required? I am trying to hurry training as best I can but not at the expense of equipment or men.


Settings I use:

90-100% training. Rest =0-10%%. Range=0. Altitude 6-10,000 feet (unless training low nav for example). Max out available pilots.

What are you training for, or is this just training in general?

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/20/2013 6:57:14 PM   
Jim Stevens

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

Settings I use:

90-100% training. Rest =0-10%%. Range=0. Altitude 6-10,000 feet (unless training low nav for example). Max out available pilots.

What are you training for, or is this just training in general?


Training in general.

Thanks everyone for the feedback. I would have not changed range without your guys help...

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/20/2013 7:25:25 PM   
dr.hal


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An important point that Chichenboy makes but is often overlooked is to MAX out the number of pilots the squadron can take so that at 100 percent training they don't tire.

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/20/2013 7:40:43 PM   
Sredni

 

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Max your pilots, and also max the airplanes (when possible) in the squadron. It's still useful to train like normal (100%, 10k alt (depending on mission), 0 range, maximum number of pilots), even if you only have 1 or 2 planes, but they won't train as fast. Having a fully equipped squadron will give the best training results.

Ops losses from training at 100%/0 range are negligible. Like 1 or 2 a year (out of your entire airforce set to training) sort of levels.

< Message edited by Sredni -- 5/20/2013 7:42:14 PM >

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/20/2013 10:22:12 PM   
jmalter

 

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a severely-understrength airgroup will efficiently train the group max (133%) of newb pilots (from the Replacement) up to about the mid-40s in the selected skill, after which they'll train better w/ add'l planes.

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/21/2013 6:38:19 AM   
obvert


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Hey guys, a related but divergent question on training.

In 44 as the Empire I've experienced groups no longer letting me max out extra pilots to the usual, about 1/4 more on top of the total group size. Instead when I empty the trained pilots I can only add 2-4 extra pilots depending on group size. Then later, about 4-7 days after this, the option again opens to add the rest of the extra pits up to the usual levels.

This causes a lot of extra checking and results in slower training as I forget to check ALL groups later. Has anyone else seen this?

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/21/2013 7:10:06 AM   
Commander Cody


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Obvert: I've that as Allies playing late game. Would be good to know what's going on.

Cheers,
CC

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/21/2013 9:18:01 AM   
Alfred

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

Hey guys, a related but divergent question on training.

In 44 as the Empire I've experienced groups no longer letting me max out extra pilots to the usual, about 1/4 more on top of the total group size. Instead when I empty the trained pilots I can only add 2-4 extra pilots depending on group size. Then later, about 4-7 days after this, the option again opens to add the rest of the extra pits up to the usual levels.

This causes a lot of extra checking and results in slower training as I forget to check ALL groups later. Has anyone else seen this?


Not enough data but IIRC your PBEM has experienced heavy aircraft losses/production and commensurately witnessed a large named pilot database. You therefore might be coming up against the pilot array limits. Michaelm increased the pilot array and also improved the culling of superfluous pilots but there is no guarantee that the ramifications will be completely avoided.

Alfred

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/21/2013 4:05:44 PM   
Lokasenna


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quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

Hey guys, a related but divergent question on training.

In 44 as the Empire I've experienced groups no longer letting me max out extra pilots to the usual, about 1/4 more on top of the total group size. Instead when I empty the trained pilots I can only add 2-4 extra pilots depending on group size. Then later, about 4-7 days after this, the option again opens to add the rest of the extra pits up to the usual levels.

This causes a lot of extra checking and results in slower training as I forget to check ALL groups later. Has anyone else seen this?


I'm getting something somewhat similar in my most recent AI game. When I am pulling pilots into a combat unit manually. Let's say the size of the unit is 25. The unit will have 23 (0) pilots in it, plus a separate commander (who seems to count as a pilot for the purposes of unit size), yet the interface will behave as if there is a total of 25 and say "Get 8 new pilots" instead of "Get 1 new pilot". Or if I've suffered losses and am down to 17 pilots, it will say "Get 6 new pilots" instead of "Get 8 new pilots". It doesn't affect anything really (yet...) except that I will have to go back into the Request Veteran screen because I'm only able to select 6 the first time, and to get the 24th and 25th pilot I have to go back in.

I have some units for which this is off by more than one pilot - a couple are off by three. This isn't terribly concerning, but if I ever downgrade the units to training status or they go on a break, I would want to fill them out as completely as possible to train more recruits. I think it might have something to do with pilots that are WIA? Are such pilots still "attached" to the unit, in that when they recover from being wounded they automatically rejoin (or do they go to the general reserve pool?)?

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/21/2013 7:06:40 PM   
JocMeister

 

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Erik, I get the same thing and have been for some time!

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/21/2013 7:52:15 PM   
Canoerebel


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I must confess that I split squads contrary to what Nemo counsels, but I think it's important to do so. Some rear-area bases might be prone to deep strikes, so I usually maintain a certain percentage of CAP and a small percentage to training. I haven't tested this, but I've wondered for a long time if that kind of split isn't as effective at training as 100% commitment to training. Certainly, my "split" units make satisfactory progress, so training this way appears effective. Similarly, it's often worthwhile to set some rear area squadrons between training and ASW/Search/Naval Strike. That gives you some covering in those capacities while also furthering training (as best I can tell).

But in a hot or potentially hot front area it would never be a good idea to split roles by having a squadron partially training.

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/21/2013 8:57:20 PM   
Lokasenna


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I like to do that for rear area squadrons as well. Places like San Diego or San Francisco for the Allies, or the central HI as Japan, where I have squadrons I'm training for Nav Search and ASW... I will split the squadron into 40% mission/40% training. With 18 and 36 plane units, this gives adequate coverage will still providing training capacity.

Why do that instead of just have one 18-plane unit do the Search/ASW duties and another 18-plane unit train exclusively? Because this way I can train up pilots a bit faster (they will accrue some skill while flying the mission, as I understand it, yes?). Also, two squadrons can cover two areas while one squadron can only cover one... No need for excessively large search arcs when you only need to cover your SLOC route.

That's the only place I do it on a regular basis.

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/21/2013 11:16:25 PM   
Sredni

 

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Nav Search and ASW pilots don't seem to gain skill appreciably while conducting nav search and asw, so I wouldn't count on that.

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/22/2013 3:03:39 AM   
Lokasenna


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sredni

Nav Search and ASW pilots don't seem to gain skill appreciably while conducting nav search and asw, so I wouldn't count on that.


The ASW goes up slowly, for sure, if at all (probably needs live "practice" against real targets, the existence of which is why I have them on partial mission/partial training in the first place). I doubt Nav Search goes up at all, but who knows. That's why I like to train them at the same time!

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/22/2013 2:11:29 PM   
pompack


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sredni

Nav Search and ASW pilots don't seem to gain skill appreciably while conducting nav search and asw, so I wouldn't count on that.


The ASW goes up slowly, for sure, if at all (probably needs live "practice" against real targets, the existence of which is why I have them on partial mission/partial training in the first place). I doubt Nav Search goes up at all, but who knows. That's why I like to train them at the same time!


yes

I have found that ASW experience goes up VERY slowly for long boring ASW missions. It takes a small jump (i.e. sometimes) when you THINK you saw something. It takes a small jump when you attack something. It takes a bigger jump when you THINK you hit something. I have been unable to tell if it takes a bigger jump when you actually hit something. That is if you really do hit something which is really hard to tell

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/22/2013 5:57:28 PM   
jmalter

 

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i've found there's only 1 case where a sqn can usefully be split between ops & training - that's for Fighter sqns.

When a Fighter sqn has reached a basic competence, say Air skill>60, you can put it on Escort mission, say 50%CAP, 50%train (keep range at 0). The pilots will continue to gain air skill, & their Exp will increase as well.

I don't find that search/ASW sqns get similar benefits when set to 50/50.

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/23/2013 5:02:13 AM   
geofflambert


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I've been slaving away at my keyboard trying to educate the forumites to the things that are important in life. As a result, I'm a bit bleary eyed, so please forgive me. But you're asking about Opium training percent. I was unaware that any training was required for opium. I will do my best though, first clamp your lips on the mouthpiece of the hookah, suck vigorously, then, when you can stand it no more, blow. I hope this was helpful.

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RE: Optimum training percent - 5/23/2013 5:39:27 AM   
Aces8


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I thought this threads topic said opium training I think its time to go to bed

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