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I want a (new) Medieval Game.

 
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I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/24/2013 8:21:20 PM   
Vasquez


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Anything in the Pipeline Matrix/Slitherine? Crusader Kings II gave me a blast last year (not to mention the insane sales this game got).

I also liked your "History: Great Battles Medieval". Played through three campaigns. But I think it was not a huge success. But thats your fault. Who cares about Jeanne d´Arc? German Knights ftw ;)

I could imagine AGEOD would be able to do a good medieval Game. Or maybe WCS with a completely revamped and renewed COG/FoF engine (Strategy map with turn based tactical combats).

I know my fellow US wargamer friends do prefer WWII, Cold War, Vietnam and their ACW stuff. But (good) medieval games do pretty well in good old europe.

< Message edited by Vasquez -- 4/25/2013 12:40:43 AM >


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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/24/2013 9:02:52 PM   
warspite1


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Is the title of this thread an Oxymoron?

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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/24/2013 9:11:35 PM   
Vasquez


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Cause of "new" and "medieval"? Hmm good catch (but wasnt intended) 

< Message edited by Vasquez -- 4/24/2013 9:12:14 PM >


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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/24/2013 9:18:37 PM   
wodin


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I also would like to see a good wargame covering that era.

Not even sure one has even been released..not a hex and counter one anyway..



quote:

ORIGINAL: Vasquez

Anything in the Pipeline Matrix/Slitherine? Crusader Kings II gave me a blast last year (not to mention the insane sales this game got).

I also liked your "History: Greta Battles Medieval". Played through three campaigns. But I think it was not a huge success. But thats your fault. Who cares about Jeanne d´Arc? German Knights ftw ;)

I could imagine AGEOD would be able to do a good medieval Game. Or maybe WCS with a completely revamped and renewed COG/FoF engine (Strategy map with turn based tactical combats).

I know my fellow US wargamer friends do prefer WWII, Cold War, Vietnam and their ACW stuff. But (good) medieval games do pretty well in good old europe.



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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 12:24:51 AM   
sulla05

 

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There were two wargames Medieval and Medieval 2 that were hex wargames. They both had a bunch of different battles from the time and were hex wargames. Nothing to write home about but the only game in town if you wanted to play a Hastings game.

< Message edited by sulla05 -- 4/25/2013 12:25:27 AM >


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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 12:31:52 AM   
grogmaster


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Its difficult to represent medieval warfare at a strategic level or operational level. But I think total war games did it quite well. But for hexes, no way. It just doesn't work that way. And Great Battles Medieval was a flop no matter how you suger-coat it.

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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 12:34:11 AM   
wodin


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Well there are plenty of boardgames that manage to do it fine...so I wouldn't say it can't be done..I just think it would have to have some unique game mechanics aswell...

Obviously though I'm talking more tactical..though some area movement type games have done that period in a grander scale..so it would take some unique thinking..

< Message edited by wodin -- 4/25/2013 12:35:27 AM >


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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 12:38:55 AM   
Vasquez


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It does not need hexes. A map like Alea Iacta Est would be nice. Regarding Total War Medieval I/II. I own them. But Iam not a big Fan of their realtime battles. The only Total War I would like to see would be a ACW but they are stuck in a loop with their "Rome 5" and "Shogun 19" policy. 

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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 12:41:46 AM   
sulla05

 

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Some of my all time favorite games are the SPI series of tactical wargames Legion and Yeoman etc. I think they would be great games to port. I also think that GMTs Great Battles of History would also be a good computer games.

I wasn't talking about the Sega Total War Medieval games. They are very far away from what I consider wargaming. I cut my wargaming teeth on SPIs monster board wargames. Some of them were harder to play than Matrix's Pacific War.

Unfortunately I cannot come up with the game company that did medieval I-II all that comes up is total war.

The company came out in the mid 90s with a few wargames. Custer's last stand the two medievals and a few more. I believe they can be run in DosBox.

I had forgot that GMTs Great Battles was ported to the computer in the late 90s. There were three games Alexander, Hannibla and Caesar. They also run in DosBox I believe.

But the above redone with 2013 tech would be much welcomed.

< Message edited by sulla05 -- 4/25/2013 12:52:57 AM >


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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 12:45:34 AM   
wodin


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There have been plenty of RTS games that cover that period..I want to see a proper wargame..be it tactical or operational like the crusades...or 100 years war etc IGOUGO or WEGO. I can see it in my minds eye it's a game design idea I've had for awhile which is about formation shapes and obviously the weapon used within the shape..followed by moral and leaders. Quite a stylised look to the game but full of gameplay and chrome and thematic. Also siege warfare would be very indepth.

< Message edited by wodin -- 4/25/2013 12:47:03 AM >


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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 12:53:11 AM   
grogmaster


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I'd like to see a strategic game with a tactical element, and none of this AGEOD crap with the same old Rise of Prussia engine. I mean tactical dispositions.

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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 12:55:23 AM   
The Gray Mouser

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sulla05

There were two wargames Medieval and Medieval 2 that were hex wargames. They both had a bunch of different battles from the time and were hex wargames. Nothing to write home about but the only game in town if you wanted to play a Hastings game.


Are you refering to the games from J Lapkoff @ Incedible Simulations? If so it appears he is working on Medieval 3 :)

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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 12:57:28 AM   
sulla05

 

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Yes by Jove, that is it.

I finally found the name and was coming back to post it when I saw your post.

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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 1:01:04 AM   
wodin


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Off to check out this Medieval 3 game..

Thanks Gray Mouser and Sulla

Sulla some of GMT's offerings where what I had in mind when talking about boardgames..

some downloads for medieval 2..

http://www.trenck-dragoner.de/_sgg/m1_1.htm

< Message edited by wodin -- 4/25/2013 1:07:18 AM >


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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 1:04:00 AM   
The Gray Mouser

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: grogmaster

Its difficult to represent medieval warfare at a strategic level or operational level. But I think total war games did it quite well. But for hexes, no way. It just doesn't work that way. And Great Battles Medieval was a flop no matter how you suger-coat it.



As long as there was a suitably realistic and playble way of recruiting armies and keeping them in the field, then I dont see why it would be un-doable

Its my dream to see a game incorporate strategic, operational and tactical all the way thru :) (premodern of course, no way you could do that for WW2) The problem is we would be asking for three games in one and many players would demand it be for the price of one...

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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 1:13:00 AM   
grogmaster


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You could take out the operational POS from the get go. Medieval warfare had few if any operational command structures. Strategic and tactical of a wargamer's like. Kind of like total war, but more strategic on the strategic side, and a top down or angle view for the tactical.

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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 1:19:32 AM   
wodin


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There is away around that issue..

First you create a sandbox tactical medieval game..with map builder.. a random map builder...plus all units nations and leaders etc etc..

You then create the Grand Strat game but do it at so it's bordering on operational (not sure if thats the right term for this sort of warfare). Anyway in this game you can either play out combat using a similar mechanic some of the indepth wargame use like WITE or you have an option that allows you if you own the tactical game to input your results be it through some sort of text file or it just asks you to input the result so I suppose you fill in an AAR..which could be shown at the end of the tactical battle...the Tactical wargame would be built in away you can state what terrain..the size of forces and troop types involved, weather, moral state experience etc etc..what leaders are involved..the type of engagement etc etc..and the game will then create the scenario for you to then battle against.


That way you've created two separate games but they can work in conjunction with each other...maybe it would be possible to merge them..but that might take an awful amount of coding genius. The tactical game would have been designed with the strategic game in mind..but still be a superb game in it's own right with historical scenarios and figures from history..and campaign etc.

You could even model actual castles and have them in the strategic game and also in the tactical game so when it comes to sieges in the tactical game the actual castle will be shown..I stick with either counters or some abstract method for troops rather than 3D rts style..as some battles would be huge..put all the effort into the gameplay..still make it look great but great for a 2D top down game.


quote:

ORIGINAL: The Gray Mouser


quote:

ORIGINAL: grogmaster

Its difficult to represent medieval warfare at a strategic level or operational level. But I think total war games did it quite well. But for hexes, no way. It just doesn't work that way. And Great Battles Medieval was a flop no matter how you suger-coat it.



As long as there was a suitably realistic and playble way of recruiting armies and keeping them in the field, then I dont see why it would be un-doable

Its my dream to see a game incorporate strategic, operational and tactical all the way thru :) (premodern of course, no way you could do that for WW2) The problem is we would be asking for three games in one and many players would demand it be for the price of one...


< Message edited by wodin -- 4/25/2013 1:25:06 AM >


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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 2:21:12 AM   
Missouri_Rebel


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Vasquez

The only Total War I would like to see would be a ACW but they are stuck in a loop with their "Rome 5" and "Shogun 19" policy. 


Are you familiar with this? American Civil War -- The Blue and the Grey


http://www.moddb.com/mods/american-civil-war-the-blue-and-the-grey

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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 3:06:42 AM   
Perturabo


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A turn-based skirmish mediaval wargame with a detailed realistic combat system would be awesome.

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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 1:07:08 PM   
Iain McNeil


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Field of Glory covers the Medieval period as well as ancients but only does single battles, no campaign layer. The army designer and multiplayer are very popular though and there are player managed campaigns for the game.

Other than that the only Medieval game we have is Great Battles Medieval which is more of an RPG/strategy hybrid for PC, X360 and PS3. iOS will be submitting to the app store very soon too.

Developers don't seem to like the period very much as other than these internal games we've got nothing that really covers it.

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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 2:52:29 PM   
Rtwfreak

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Is the title of this thread an Oxymoron?


Who you callin a moron? Moderator! MODerator!! MODERATOR!!!!

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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 10:59:03 PM   
warspite1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rtwfreak


quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Is the title of this thread an Oxymoron?


Who you callin a moron? Moderator! MODerator!! MODERATOR!!!!
warspite1



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RE: I want a (new) Medieval Game. - 4/25/2013 11:56:04 PM   
The Gray Mouser

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: grogmaster

You could take out the operational POS from the get go. Medieval warfare had few if any operational command structures. Strategic and tactical of a wargamer's like. Kind of like total war, but more strategic on the strategic side, and a top down or angle view for the tactical.



Hmm, I dont think "command structures" has anything to do with it. ALOT happens between the strategic decision to , say invade province x from province y, to the actual tactical battle.... The problem with ignoring "operations" means your stuck with the TW MEdieval 1 mindset of stack up an army in an "area", move into enemy area and have a random battle field drawn. YOu miss out on ambushes , rear guard actions, cutting off isolated detachments, turning movements, cutting supply lines, threatening important towns ...... Allthese things were the REASON why a battle was fought in a specific area/with less than ideal troops or #'s. There was a failure in the operational side...
Look at Agincourt Henry's Strategy: capitalize on his tenous claim to the French Crown by invading with an Army to force a battle and gain concessions
Operation : move army into France threatan Paris and entice the French to attack by basically conducting a giant chevachee which they would have to respond to. The Flaw: the army Henry had, had no ability to threaton such a large city as Paris, and the army that came after him was very much bigger... Change plan, maneuver back to safety and when forced to halt, make sure your in a good defensive position.
Possible French operational decision: continue to harry the army but not engage, possibly causing supply and morale issue, be patient enough and you might catch the English army off guard:) . Bad opertational decision by French : Attack Asap, which leads to the tactical battle of Agincourt...

Without something in between strategy and a tactical battle the flavour of any period is completely missed out on, imho
BTW not saying it would be even remotely easy to design such a game but I can dream.

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