European Version of WiTP

This new stand alone release based on the legendary War in the Pacific from 2 by 3 Games adds significant improvements and changes to enhance game play, improve realism, and increase historical accuracy. With dozens of new features, new art, and engine improvements, War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition brings you the most realistic and immersive WWII Pacific Theater wargame ever!

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Gwaltney
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European Version of WiTP

Post by Gwaltney »

What game is the complexity or similar as WiTP for the European campaign?
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Terminus
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by Terminus »

None.
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by wdolson »

There isn't much. I've heard War in the East is pretty large scale, but it's also probably somewhat different. I don't have it, so I don't know for sure.

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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by Gwaltney »

That is what I thought reading the descriptions, etc.
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Terminus
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by Terminus »

WitE is a fine game, but it has no naval component, and therefore is not as complex.
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kevin_hx
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by kevin_hx »

There are 2 mods about European campiagn of WITP.
War in The Mediterranean
War in Russia

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Jorge_Stanbury
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by Jorge_Stanbury »

War in the East should be the closest, and to be fair, the naval component is not really needed for an Eastern front wargame.

I bought the game recently but I have never played it (yet) too busy with work, extended weeks of business travel and obviously WitP-AE to put any effort into it

For what I have skimmed from the manual, it seems to be a very high scale game, with obvious focus on land warfare and probably better land logistics (like railroads, etc).

It is the same author (Gary Grigsby) and therefore you can probably expect the same obsession with micro-management and details
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Terminus
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by Terminus »

Grigsby had nothing to do with AE.
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by Jorge_Stanbury »

he is credited for "uncommon valor" and the first WitP

that said, I have never played either game (only WitP-AE) so I cannot assess how much of it is originally coming from him
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Terminus
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by Terminus »

I repeat, Grigsby had no involvement in AE.
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Terminus
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by Terminus »

And a naval component is most certainly not "irrelevant" for the Eastern Front... *cough*Black Sea*cough*Baltic Sea*cough*
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by Speedysteve »

From playing both AE and WITE extensively I can say there isn't an equivalent European AE game. The combat details under the hood are complex in both but WITE lacks the logistical and air war detail
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by tigercub »

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Grigsby had nothing to do with AE.
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Jorge_Stanbury
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by Jorge_Stanbury »

ORIGINAL: Terminus

I repeat, Grigsby had no involvement in AE.

I was not implying he was part of AE; just that AE is an expansion, improvement of "his" game WitP/ uncommon valor.

Regarding naval war in the east front; maybe irrelevant was not the right word, but in game term perspectives, it is not the "meat" of the game, as long as it is abstracted somehow, I am fine with it.
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by m10bob »

I would also like to see the European theatre portrayed at this scale, but especially when including the African campaign it would be on a vastly smaller, less involved scale of activity until after D Day. I would still play it, but WITP-AE is full, rich, and involved from Pearl Harbor on...........
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by HansBolter »

ORIGINAL: Terminus

WitE is a fine game, but it has no naval component, and therefore is not as complex.


It isn't because it isn't as complex that causes it to fail to be a European Campaign equivalent of WITPAE.

It is the fact that it represents only a portion of the overall European theater that causes it to fail to be an equivalent.

Having cut my teeth on 20+ years of boardgaming before moving to computer games I played many grand strategic board games of both theaters.

I have yet to find a grand strategic computer game of the European theater with any real degree of complexity and detail. Almost all of them are oversimplified games with little appeal. I do truly long for a European theater game as complex and richly detailed as this game.
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by wdolson »

ORIGINAL: m10bob

I would also like to see the European theatre portrayed at this scale, but especially when including the African campaign it would be on a vastly smaller, less involved scale of activity until after D Day. I would still play it, but WITP-AE is full, rich, and involved from Pearl Harbor on...........

An AE scale game that focuses primarily on Western Europe would have to have very robust modeling of the strategic bombing campaign. Without it, the game has frenetic activity in 1940 followed by four years of very little as the Americans build up starting in 1942.

A complete game that covers from central Russia to Iceland and North Africa to the Arctic Circle would have something going on for most of the war, though the period of agony for the Allies would last longer. The North Africa campaign dragged on for around 2 years before El Alamein changed the balance in the Allies favor. The war in Russia turned pretty much permanently after Stalingrad, but they won a major fight during the first winter with the Battle of Moscow.

You could do an interesting triphibious game with the u-boat campaign modeled as well as the strategic air campaign and land war modeled. I think I'd want to start over with a new game engine though. I think the only way that's going to happen is paying a handful of programmers to do it. I have too many irons in the fire to do anything more than dream about it.

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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by gradenko2k »

WITE isn't that comparable to WITP, but the lack of a naval component is hardly a leading cause as to why.

On a different note, just because Gary Grigsby never actually worked on AE doesn't mean he had absolutely nothing to do with it. The name itself says that it's just another EDITION of Grigsby's War in the Pacific. I'm not trying to lessen the contributions of the good people at Henderson Field any, but let's not get tangled up in pedantics.
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tigercub
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by tigercub »

I not going to claim its the bees knees Hans but Hearts of Iron 3 with The finest Hour mod is a very good MP grand strategic much better than when it first came out!

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dazoline II
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RE: European Version of WiTP

Post by dazoline II »

I'm guessing not many of you have read this: tm.asp?m=3051557

It's 2 by 3s successor to WITE called strangely enough WITW, with plans to expand it to cover the entire theatre eventually. For those that know about WITE the air war and weather are getting major work for WITW but I'm not sure about the naval aspects. I'm wondering if naval will be the major focus once they concentrate on the entire theatre.
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