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AMCs - 2/14/2013 10:35:31 PM

Q-Ball

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Quick question: How are AMCs treated for unload rate purposes? Are they the equivalent of navalized AP - AK (as opposed to xAP or xAK?)

While on the subject, how to other use them?

As Allies, I noticed they are the only vessel other than APD that can fast transport troops; have you used that?

As Japan, I usually used them as extra landing ships/escorts; I didn't typically raid with them

Greyjoy did some raiding against me, and had some success, though the main problem with them is the low crew ratings. They get pasted by a warship.

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RE: AMCs - 2/14/2013 11:03:07 PM

Lokasenna

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This is something I've wondered as well...

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RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 1:01:35 AM

Don Bowen

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Yes, AMC are transport ships for purposes of load/unload. They have the same rates as an AP.

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RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 1:36:09 AM

obvert

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I mainly use them as an AP, carrying troops, usually a division or a big unit. They're better if there are shore guns and for an IJN ship, unload quickly. I've occasionally used them in fast transport roles as well.

As raiders I wouldn't find them too useful, especially considering their value elsewhere.

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RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 2:43:46 AM

jeffk3510

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball
As Allies, I noticed they are the only vessel other than APD that can fast transport troops; have you used that?

APDs are great..you don't get enough of them. You can convert all of the Clemson class DDs to them, and they have the best return IMO when you can compare the classes.

Looks like you'll be swimming in DEs by wars end, so converting the Clemsons to APDs vs DEs is a better ROC (Return on Conversion

)

< Message edited by jeffk3510 -- 2/15/2013 2:50:22 AM >

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RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 4:32:09 AM

alanschu

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I struggle with the idea of using APDs. Do they still get used in standard amphibious assaults, just with faster deposit rates? Do people still use them as escorts (the clemsons do get a boost in ASW as an APD). I can imagnie the guns are a small help for landings, but the ASW version just seems so much more useful all around.

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RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 7:37:27 AM

Capt Hornblower

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

...As Allies, I noticed they are the only vessel other than APD that can fast transport troops; have you used that?...

I'm currently playing a solo campaign as the Allies, and I used a Brit AMC to extract the remnants of the Victoria Point (Burma) base unit from the panhandle. (Silly little rescue op.)

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RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 12:12:48 PM

castor troy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

Quick question: How are AMCs treated for unload rate purposes? Are they the equivalent of navalized AP - AK (as opposed to xAP or xAK?)

While on the subject, how to other use them?

As Allies, I noticed they are the only vessel other than APD that can fast transport troops; have you used that?

As Japan, I usually used them as extra landing ships/escorts; I didn't typically raid with them

Greyjoy did some raiding against me, and had some success, though the main problem with them is the low crew ratings. They get pasted by a warship.

I've head QE fight it out with two Japanese AMC in daylight during the first couple of turns and QE outright sunk one of the AMC with her 6 inch guns, damaging the other one. QE having a naval exp that really sucks I thought those AMC really have to suck in a raider role. In no campaign they have caused me any problem not even headache. Wouldn't use them as anything else than a transport.

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Post #: 8

RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 12:23:03 PM

spence

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If history is any guide it ought to be noted that the Japanese ultimately made regular transports out of their AMCs.

It should also be noted that an Indian Navy corvette with one 4" gun (escorting a tanker) sank one IJN AMC and drove off another in late 1942. Not exactly the IJNs finest hour.

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Post #: 9

RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 12:26:12 PM

Itdepends

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The allies do get a couple of CM's that can be used in fast transport - useful after they've run out of VH mines.

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Post #: 10

RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 2:12:46 PM

Jorge_Stanbury

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Playing Japan I used them mostly as xAPs and I haven't seen any significant difference in terms of loading/ unloading compared to xAPs / xAKs ... but notice I still have the early war Japanese bonus

As per raiders: in my opinion they are too "valuable" to risk as raiders. That said, In my current game, playing as Japan, I used the 2 AMCs that starts the war in the south pacific as raiders; close to New Caledonia; results were mixed:
- one found a TK and sunk it
- the other one found a convoy escorted by a cruiser. It was a brief battle, with few shots traded before breaking off: AMC received 2 or 3 deck penetration hits that started a fire that eventually doomed the ship a couple of days later.

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Post #: 11

RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 2:41:50 PM

Gunner98

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I usually use the Brit and Ausi AMCs in convoys as surface escort early on when DDs are in short supply. They tend to take damage or sink before the other ships in the convoy so I suspect they are intervening while the others escape (I don't watch the battles so am not sure).

B

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Post #: 12

RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 3:27:57 PM

Q-Ball

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Good replies, thanks!

I basically use them the same way it seems: As interesting transports. I like them in invasions, as they have a little more heft than a standard transport

Commerce raiding is too risky; as I said, Greyjoy did sink a couple tankers with his, but eventually I tracked down and sank a couple AMCs, he probably felt it wasn't worth it anymore to raid.

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Post #: 13

RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 3:41:44 PM

Lomri

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I saw some folks ask about APD transport and amph landing. You should double check the manual but I am pretty sure that units loaded on APDs accumulate a lot of disruption, or at least gain a lot of disruption in an amph landing. This doesn't really matter when you are picking UP units in FT mode or dropping something off at a friendly base. But if you think packing some Marine Raiders to hit a lightly defended base you might be surprised to find them with 50 disruption even when 100% prepped.

Like I said earlier, I'd double check this in the table that lists disruption accumulation for various types of transport. (For instance I believe barges have a large accumulation rating). In fact I could also be mixing up fatigue and disruption ;)

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RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 4:11:17 PM

Bullwinkle58

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Itdepends

The allies do get a couple of CM's that can be used in fast transport - useful after they've run out of VH mines.

I just tried a couple as an experiment, and while those (Dutch I think they were) can join FT TFs they can't carry any troops. Which ones can?

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Post #: 15

RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 5:39:25 PM

Lokasenna

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58

quote:

ORIGINAL: Itdepends

The allies do get a couple of CM's that can be used in fast transport - useful after they've run out of VH mines.

I just tried a couple as an experiment, and while those (Dutch I think they were) can join FT TFs they can't carry any troops. Which ones can?

The Abdiel is the only Allied CM with any troop capacity (250). It is British.

There are also 2 British AGs that can carry 100 troops each (Kedah and Matang), however they aren't exactly quick at 17 and 14 knots respectively.

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)

Post #: 16

RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 6:53:55 PM

GreyJoy

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Brad, i tried to used them early in the war but you tracked down my plans and easily countered them.

However, in the first stages of the war a good AMC, with torps and a good leader, along with float planes can be damned usefull for the japs. If you find a couple of unescorted convoys you can easily sink some loaded ships in the middle of the ocean and gain enough exp to become very fast another big threat to deal with for the allies.
Against Rader he used that tactic against me and sunk a couple of unescorted convoys which had troops aboard...only using those big torpedo loaded marus....

Those armoured merchants can be used as raiders, imho.

For the allies you can use the PG sosarbaja and PC taney with the same pourpose...those guys have BIG guns!!!!!

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Post #: 17

RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 7:09:03 PM

Kull

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From: El Paso, TX
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jorge_Stanbury

As per raiders: in my opinion they are too "valuable" to risk as raiders. That said, In my current game, playing as Japan, I used the 2 AMCs that starts the war in the south pacific as raiders; close to New Caledonia; results were mixed:
- one found a TK and sunk it
- the other one found a convoy escorted by a cruiser. It was a brief battle, with few shots traded before breaking off: AMC received 2 or 3 deck penetration hits that started a fire that eventually doomed the ship a couple of days later.

Mine "found" CV Lexington & company. The results decidedly weren't mixed.

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Post #: 18

RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 9:14:23 PM

Bullwinkle58

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58

quote:

ORIGINAL: Itdepends

The allies do get a couple of CM's that can be used in fast transport - useful after they've run out of VH mines.

I just tried a couple as an experiment, and while those (Dutch I think they were) can join FT TFs they can't carry any troops. Which ones can?

The Abdiel is the only Allied CM with any troop capacity (250). It is British.

There are also 2 British AGs that can carry 100 troops each (Kedah and Matang), however they aren't exactly quick at 17 and 14 knots respectively.

Thanks.

The things you learn around here . . .

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Post #: 19

RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 9:15:56 PM

Bullwinkle58

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

Brad, i tried to used them early in the war but you tracked down my plans and easily countered them.

However, in the first stages of the war a good AMC, with torps and a good leader, along with float planes can be damned usefull for the japs. If you find a couple of unescorted convoys you can easily sink some loaded ships in the middle of the ocean and gain enough exp to become very fast another big threat to deal with for the allies.
Against Rader he used that tactic against me and sunk a couple of unescorted convoys which had troops aboard...only using those big torpedo loaded marus....

Those armoured merchants can be used as raiders, imho.

For the allies you can use the PG sosarbaja and PC taney with the same pourpose...those guys have BIG guns!!!!!

There are AI commerce raiding scripts that get called sometimes. I've seen AMCs raiding at least as far as Canton Island in the first three months of the war. They can deal with most escorts the USN has at that time.

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Post #: 20

RE: AMCs - 2/15/2013 10:38:05 PM

obvert

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Joined: 1/17/2011
From: London, UK
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58

There are AI commerce raiding scripts that get called sometimes. I've seen AMCs raiding at least as far as Canton Island in the first three months of the war. They can deal with most escorts the USN has at that time.

Two AMCs, Aikoku Maru and the Hokoku Maru I think, start the war SSE of Canton Island, so it's actually hard to not have them raid even if you're trying to get them back to safe territory. I've twice had mine sunk by CVs while sneaking back.

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Post #: 21

RE: AMCs - 2/16/2013 1:36:36 AM

Bullwinkle58

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quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58

There are AI commerce raiding scripts that get called sometimes. I've seen AMCs raiding at least as far as Canton Island in the first three months of the war. They can deal with most escorts the USN has at that time.

Two AMCs, Aikoku Maru and the Hokoku Maru I think, start the war SSE of Canton Island, so it's actually hard to not have them raid even if you're trying to get them back to safe territory. I've twice had mine sunk by CVs while sneaking back.