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A Question - 1/16/2013 9:06:56 AM   
tegeland

 

Posts: 3
Joined: 1/16/2013
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Bought game +/- 2 weeks ago. Jumped into full campaign out of box.. couple days later decided to read the instructions..was a bit frustrating as you can imagine trying to play off intuition alone... so now I have read the manual cover to cover a couple times, been through every page of the forums, not necessarilly every post in every thread.. but....

The question...

if altitude is so important to fly cap/escort.. same altitude for cap/escort and bomber...and everyone seems to agree that cap levels set min/max 30/60 then.. why when i finish a coral sea and look at ai bases are the altitudes for cap and bomber never the same.. yet always it has exceptional cap coverage and.... cap levels set at 90-100 and fatigue way lower than me and cap numbers like 33... how do i make precise numbers like 33...... (16*.3=4.8=4(16*.33=5.28=5(16*.4=6.4=6(where is my 5?))))and... how do I consistently get 15 to 25 cap or escort in almost every air engagement (ai manages to rather consistently although oddly i do see a higher #of 12 than any other number but have not written this down to compare yet)..

ok.. it is more than one question but .. I have played a lot of coral seas back to back..50 or more..and all I focus on is air mechanics .. trying to make it do want and find a way to gain the kind of air superiority ai can achieve(it will decimate planes and crater moresby unusable if not kept in check) but to no end.. not to mention that when I do get 25 devastators at 5k' unscathed with escort remaining in the day they drop 1.. (one) 1 and only 1 1k bomb and it misses the entire airbase ..... hmmm ... 8 of its bombers can land up to 13 hits including base runway supplies and parked planes......

am i missing something obvious?

thanks for bothering to read this..more thanks if you know where i am going wrong..aside from playing a numbers game or considering this one floor up on arsenal of democracy
Post #: 1
RE: A Question - 1/16/2013 9:40:21 AM   
Ddog

 

Posts: 206
Joined: 2/17/2005
From: Cincinnati, OH
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You should switch to PBEM   That's where the fun is.  Welcome to the game!

_____________________________

"If you can't take a joke, don't start a war."
Tail gunner, Enola Gay


(in reply to tegeland)
Post #: 2
RE: A Question - 1/16/2013 12:26:39 PM   
Barb


Posts: 1623
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From: Slovakia
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Hi, welcome aboard first :)

Percentages
- adjustments are allowed by 10s only, but scenario builders had probably given percentages as 33 or 25 into editor. Once you put your unit in border values (0%/100% flying) you cannot set it up again in fractions, but just 10s. AI probably do not try to reset these percentages.

Fatigue
- should be accumulating if high percentages of planes/pilots fly as well as with range they fly and altitude settings (below 6000ft e.g.)

Hit probabilities - bomb release altitude, weather, enemy interception, flak, detection level of target, unit leader skill (land), individual pilot skill (ground bombing), plane load (no. of bombs), pilot fatigue, rolls - these all are factored to hit probability in one or other way.

_____________________________


"Hello IT. Have you tried turning it off and on again?"

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Post #: 3
RE: A Question - 1/16/2013 12:49:16 PM   
mike scholl 1

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ddog
You should switch to PBEM   That's where the fun is.  Welcome to the game!



Let him get a firm grasp on the game's mechanics before you try to set him up as a "victim". But then you're right..., the AI is but a pale shadow compared to a human opponant.

(in reply to Ddog)
Post #: 4
RE: A Question - 1/16/2013 5:13:49 PM   
Lokasenna


Posts: 3024
Joined: 3/3/2012
From: Iowan in MD/DC
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I think the AI gets a little "help" coordinating things like CAP and altitude, and fatigue, even on normal difficulty. Can't prove this, however.

Also, welcome! I did the same thing (jump right into a grand campaign :P) about a year ago, it's been great fun.

(in reply to mike scholl 1)
Post #: 5
RE: A Question - 1/17/2013 8:33:13 AM   
DivePac88


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Joined: 10/9/2008
From: Somewhere in the South Pacific.
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Welcome to the world of WitP tegeland, and don't beat you're self-up too much. You are learning to play a very complex game, and every turn you run you will learn something new. I installed AE on the week it was released, and have been playing and editing it all these years, and I'm still learning stuff. I think of this game as layered, and when you learn one layer, you find another one underneath. Just keep at it, maybe start with one of the smaller scenarios (like I did) against the AI.

_____________________________


When you see the Southern Cross, For the first time
You understand now, Why you came this way

(in reply to tegeland)
Post #: 6
RE: A Question - 1/17/2013 8:43:28 AM   
Roger Neilson 3


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From: Bedlington, Northumberland, UK
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Like DivePac I installed this game the day it was released, having come from its predecessor. I should therefore know all there is to know about it.... I play it every day and have three active PBEMs on the go....

Every turn I go 'hey, that's a new one for me to learn'.

One of the reasons why there is no other game like it and why in playtime this has been the cheapest piece of software i have ever bought.

Roger



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Post #: 7
RE: A Question - 1/17/2013 9:47:09 AM   
tocaff


Posts: 4663
Joined: 10/12/2006
From: USA now in Brasil
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Welcome aboard. The learning cliff never ends, but life as you knew it does.

_____________________________

Todd

I never thought that doing an AAR would be so time consuming and difficult.
www.matrixgames.com/forum/tm.asp?m=2080768

(in reply to Roger Neilson 3)
Post #: 8
RE: A Question - 1/18/2013 7:34:28 AM   
ilovestrategy


Posts: 3628
Joined: 6/11/2005
From: San Diego
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna



Also, welcome! I did the same thing (jump right into a grand campaign :P) about a year ago, it's been great fun.



So it's ok if I do this? So far I've been piddling around in the Coral Sea for the last week or so trying to get a grasp on the game.

While i'm here, I'll ask, were you reading the manual while playing?

_____________________________

After 16 years, Civ II still has me in it's clutches LOL!!!
Now CIV IV has me in it's evil clutches!

(in reply to Lokasenna)
Post #: 9
RE: A Question - 1/18/2013 7:35:59 AM   
ilovestrategy


Posts: 3628
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From: San Diego
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Some how I double posted. Sorry!

< Message edited by ilovestrategy -- 1/18/2013 7:37:08 AM >


_____________________________

After 16 years, Civ II still has me in it's clutches LOL!!!
Now CIV IV has me in it's evil clutches!

(in reply to Lokasenna)
Post #: 10
RE: A Question - 1/18/2013 8:37:07 AM   
Roger Neilson 3


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From: Bedlington, Northumberland, UK
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I haven't 'read' the manual yet.... I do very occasionally look up something. Most of my learning comes from my kind opponents who keep teaching me lessons!

And I have not yet touched a little scenario..... to me that's like going to some foreign country and eating your own food..... its the full experience or nothing.

Roger

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Post #: 11
RE: A Question - 1/18/2013 8:50:36 AM   
DivePac88


Posts: 3115
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From: Somewhere in the South Pacific.
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ilovestrategy

Some how I double posted. Sorry!


I haven't come across this one yet, so I'll check the Manual.

_____________________________


When you see the Southern Cross, For the first time
You understand now, Why you came this way

(in reply to ilovestrategy)
Post #: 12
RE: A Question - 1/18/2013 10:21:03 AM   
ilovestrategy


Posts: 3628
Joined: 6/11/2005
From: San Diego
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DivePac88


quote:

ORIGINAL: ilovestrategy

Some how I double posted. Sorry!


I haven't come across this one yet, so I'll check the Manual.



Page 345, paragraph 4, subsection 562.4582

_____________________________

After 16 years, Civ II still has me in it's clutches LOL!!!
Now CIV IV has me in it's evil clutches!

(in reply to DivePac88)
Post #: 13
RE: A Question - 1/18/2013 10:23:45 AM   
ilovestrategy


Posts: 3628
Joined: 6/11/2005
From: San Diego
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Roger Neilson 3

I haven't 'read' the manual yet.... I do very occasionally look up something. Most of my learning comes from my kind opponents who keep teaching me lessons!

And I have not yet touched a little scenario..... to me that's like going to some foreign country and eating your own food..... its the full experience or nothing.

Roger



I'm following your way. It's December 9th and the Nips are still there. I moved the Enterprise near the French Shoals and the Lexington is enroute.

I still have no clue what I'm doing but already I'm constantly thinking about this game.......

_____________________________

After 16 years, Civ II still has me in it's clutches LOL!!!
Now CIV IV has me in it's evil clutches!

(in reply to Roger Neilson 3)
Post #: 14
RE: A Question - 1/18/2013 10:46:55 AM   
Chris H

 

Posts: 3680
Joined: 1/17/2002
From: Bexhill-on-Sea, E Sussex
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Roger Neilson 3

Like DivePac I installed this game the day it was released, having come from its predecessor. I should therefore know all there is to know about it.... I play it every day and have three active PBEMs on the go....

Every turn I go 'hey, that's a new one for me to learn'.

One of the reasons why there is no other game like it and why in playtime this has been the cheapest piece of software i have ever bought.

Roger




Me too

(in reply to Roger Neilson 3)
Post #: 15
RE: A Question - 1/18/2013 5:51:31 PM   
Lokasenna


Posts: 3024
Joined: 3/3/2012
From: Iowan in MD/DC
Status: offline
I learn most quickly by doing, so I just started playing and used the manual as a reference. Having two monitors is key... Manual open on one, WITP in window mode on the other. I barely open the manual now against AI (it's been months), but I bet if I were in a PBEM I'd have it open all the time again...

(in reply to Chris H)
Post #: 16
RE: A Question - 1/18/2013 6:18:28 PM   
OldGuard1970

 

Posts: 565
Joined: 7/19/2006
From: Hiawassee, GA
Status: offline
I concur with the positive commetns about this game. It is complex, compelling, demanding, frustrating, and grand fun!

When I first bought the game, I "read" the manual and opened a scenario. I sat frozen at my computer without a clue about how to get started. Finally, I just tried to focus on using air power by making a few air moves and then letting the AI run its turn. After a few turns, I restarted and played with air units and with ships. A few turns later I restarted and began to use all units. The AI had a field day with me and handed me defeat after defeat for weeks. Each time, I learned more.

Finally, I got to the point where I had to be kind to the AI just to keep the gaime alive.

So... I challenged my friend to PBEM, and life changed. The tension is excruciating! What will he do? Will my "trap" work, or will it backfire? How should I shape my long term plans? Have I committed enough? Have I committed too much? Where am I exposed? Does he know? Where is he weak? Can I use his weakness, or is that a trap of his own?

I am always learning new aspects of the mechanics. My opponent and I share our insights. (We enjoy the contest and want to play against the other commander without a special advantage in mechanical knowledge. We know a perfectly level knowledge of the game is not possible, but we are happy to work to level things out when we sense disparity.)

The game demands a special degree of self-discipline in order to deal with the pesky aspects of secondary life, such as job, family, etc. I resolve those matters as quickly as I can to leave more time to deal with my next move.

Welcome!

_____________________________

"Rangers Lead the Way!"

(in reply to Lokasenna)
Post #: 17
RE: A Question - 1/18/2013 6:46:12 PM   
littleike

 

Posts: 105
Joined: 10/3/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: OldGuard1970

I concur with the positive commetns about this game. It is complex, compelling, demanding, frustrating, and grand fun!




I would add also the word "rewarding" to describe this sim.

The more time you expend with it, the more you get.


(in reply to OldGuard1970)
Post #: 18
RE: A Question - 1/19/2013 3:06:58 AM   
ilovestrategy


Posts: 3628
Joined: 6/11/2005
From: San Diego
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: OldGuard1970

I concur with the positive commetns about this game. It is complex, compelling, demanding, frustrating, and grand fun!

When I first bought the game, I "read" the manual and opened a scenario. I sat frozen at my computer without a clue about how to get started. Finally, I just tried to focus on using air power by making a few air moves and then letting the AI run its turn. After a few turns, I restarted and played with air units and with ships. A few turns later I restarted and began to use all units. The AI had a field day with me and handed me defeat after defeat for weeks. Each time, I learned more.




Ok, that makes me feel better. I'm learning step by step. For example, today I figured out in the Grand Campaign how to find the Lexington. The "all Ships" and "all task forces" buttons on the top threw me for a loop. Now i'm working on repairing ships in port.

I never knew pilots get fatigued lol.


_____________________________

After 16 years, Civ II still has me in it's clutches LOL!!!
Now CIV IV has me in it's evil clutches!

(in reply to OldGuard1970)
Post #: 19
RE: A Question - 1/19/2013 3:56:38 AM   
Lecivius


Posts: 1613
Joined: 8/5/2007
From: Denver
Status: offline
Dang, wrong thread

< Message edited by Lecivius -- 1/20/2013 1:09:22 AM >

(in reply to ilovestrategy)
Post #: 20
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