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RE: The Hobbit (OT)

 
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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 1/8/2013 8:03:56 PM   
Sardaukar


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Hobbit is good, though Radogast is bit "overdone"

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 1/9/2013 5:02:21 AM   
JeffK


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Reg


To everyone except Hal, Get some time up newbies...

I first read The Hobbit in third grade back in 1971 and was forever captivated by the magic. I have been reading and low profile collecting ever since. I've seen Bakshi (a valiant attempt but just far too ambitious for the technology at the time..), read Bored with the Rings, Silmarillion, Lost Tales etc so with my bookshelf I think I would classify as a fan or at least knowledgeable on the subject. You just gotta admire John Howe's and Alan Lee's works on the topic.

I do like the LOTR movies but though I think they do the novels justice, I cannot say they are a substitute for the books. There is just so much in the written word that just cannot be conveyed in the visual format. Fran and Philippa wrote an excellent screenplay version of the story though it does deviate from the original work in so many key ways (Legolas and the Mûmakil, the role of the Corsairs of Umbra, and whats with the skulls in the extended version, etc etc)

I haven't had a chance to see The Hobbit movie yet (curses to the Boxing day release in Australia ) but I will keep an open mind. My major concern is the amount of material required to fill so many movies so I hope Jackson just fills in the gaps and doesn't get too carried away in his horror film roots (avalanche of skulls anyone??).

Looking forward to it.



I was in Form 1 in 1971 so go a bit further down the queue!

Apart from that I've probably done the same and have the same books in the bookshelf.

Echoing others, I love the books and like the LOTR movies, of course it could have been better and I cant wait for some one else to try.

Saw The Hobbit one night when it was still 30degC when I left the Cinema at midnight.
3D is a waste of time, might be my aging computer ravaged eyes but the only good bit was ducking when they were throwing the pinecones at the wolves.
The movie didnt quite grab me, there were some great bits, but they went on too long, again I could be getting old and easily bored. The leader of the Dwares (Thorin??) needs to be heavily edited, doesnt do much for the movie (but is part of the book)

Have we had the part where they cut Tom Bombadil or is that missing from the next bit??

IMVHO, instead of 3 parts it should have been 2 parts.

Of course things could really amaze at the next 2 parts and we will be clamouring for a fourth!

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 1/9/2013 5:04:31 AM   
JeffK


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

The Hobbit is good, but IMHO Les Miserables is spectacular.  Any of the rest of you seen that yet?  What are your thoughts?

You haven't mentioned Lincoln, yet you've seen The Hobbit twice? Is this because of the subject matter? I think it was Shelby Foote that wryly stated that "We never did much care for Lincoln in my home, growing up."


Saw the trailer, kept waiting for him to turn into a Vampire killer!!

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 1/10/2013 3:38:57 AM   
Blackhorse


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I'm one of those dastardly southerners who loves Lincoln.  Actually, I think many southerners do, so I'm no rarity.

I have not seen Lincoln.  I am very reluctant to go to any historical movies because it drives me nuts when a "historic" movie takes liberties.  (The same thing applies to books - I was not very impressed with O'Reilley's Killing Lincoln.)  I've heard the Lincoln movie was pretty good, but I haven't heard that from folks who know history.  So, what did you think?

P.S.  In 2003, my young family went on our first vacation "up north."  We homeschooled our children and, as part of this trip, we assembled at the cemetery in Gettysburg to read the "Gettysburg Address."  For obvious reasons, this seemed like it would be a momentous - almost sacred - thing to do.  But I'll never forget that morning because the entire family, for some reason, was just flat out of sorts.  A bigger bunch of "ill pills" I had never seen.


I've seen Lincoln. I highly recommend it. The movie does take historical liberties -- but few out-and-out "untruths." There are many gross simplifications of complex issues and motivations, and caricatures of individuals, but for me, at least, these were mostly forgivable simplifications to keep the movie moving at a brisk pace. Just one example: in order to highlight the political tension between pro-emancipation Lincoln and the conservative Republican faction, the movie skips over the warm personal friendship that actually existed between the Blair family (portrayed, accurately but simplisticly as the faction leaders) and Lincoln. The discussion during Lincoln's meeting with the Confederate Commissioners in the movie was, IMHO, the most egregious departure from actual events.

Enjoy it for the acting, if not the historicacy (a new word!). Daniel Day Lewis is superb as Lincoln, and Tommie Lee Jones pretty much takes over the movie as Thaddeus Stevens. And there are plenty of nice historical flourishes thrown in -- such as Secretary of War Stanton running out of the room in frustration as Lincoln starts in to tell yet another story.

< Message edited by Blackhorse -- 1/11/2013 2:38:40 AM >


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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 1/11/2013 1:12:49 AM   
Reg


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffK


quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

The Hobbit is good, but IMHO Les Miserables is spectacular.  Any of the rest of you seen that yet?  What are your thoughts?

You haven't mentioned Lincoln, yet you've seen The Hobbit twice? Is this because of the subject matter? I think it was Shelby Foote that wryly stated that "We never did much care for Lincoln in my home, growing up."


Saw the trailer, kept waiting for him to turn into a Vampire killer!!





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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 1/17/2013 10:17:13 PM   
Chickenboy


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Dan,

Thought of you when I saw this review of Crowe in Les Miserables.

http://www.theonion.com/video/russell-crowe-praised-for-stunning-portrayal-of-ma,30839/

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 1/17/2013 10:23:38 PM   
Canoerebel


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I'm familiar with the Onion's reputation, so when I saw the web address, I knew this would be a spoof.  :)

I loved Les Miserables, which is unusual because I'm not a big fan of musicals.  Well, that's not entirely true.  There are a few I enjoy, particularly Sound of Music and Singing in the Rain.  IMHO, Les Mis is in their class. 

I've seen the movie twice, once accompanied by a professional singer who was equally impressed.  On the other occasion, I attended with my wife and daughter, who also loved it.  In particular, my 20-year-old daughter thought Russell Crowe's performance was stellar.  I know the women in my family have good taste and judgment even if I don't.

Anybody else see Les Mis?  What did you think of it? 

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 1/18/2013 2:02:22 PM   
AW1Steve


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I just saw this last night in IMAX 3-D. VERY well done, they expanded considerably on the book, going into areas that the book lightly mentioned.

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 1/18/2013 5:54:05 PM   
Canoerebel


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I suppose I should surrender my ill-advised effort in asking for impressions about Les Miserables in a thead devoted to The Hobbit

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 1/18/2013 6:06:01 PM   
Chickenboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel
Anybody else see Les Mis?  What did you think of it? 


Saw the play. Twice. Loved it. Cried both times too.

Won't see the movie (even as a rental), as I would like to remember Inspector Javear's wonderful, deep resonant baritone in my mind. He was my favorite character and voice. Hearing Russell Crowe's screeching would ruin this pleasant memory for me and is just unnecessary.

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 1/18/2013 6:06:47 PM   
Chickenboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

I just saw this last night in IMAX 3-D. VERY well done, they expanded considerably on the book, going into areas that the book lightly mentioned.

Enjoyed the 2-D version very much. Did you (or your companions) have any complaints regarding motion sickness on the 3-D version?

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 1/18/2013 7:21:36 PM   
AW1Steve


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I suppose I should surrender my ill-advised effort in asking for impressions about Les Miserables in a thead devoted to The Hobbit


That would be logical. To persist in such behavior might be considered "Thread-jacking".

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 1/18/2013 7:24:23 PM   
AW1Steve


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

I just saw this last night in IMAX 3-D. VERY well done, they expanded considerably on the book, going into areas that the book lightly mentioned.

Enjoyed the 2-D version very much. Did you (or your companions) have any complaints regarding motion sickness on the 3-D version?


Nope , but with the exception of a former USAF guy and a female Army major, everybody was current or former USN. It would have been disgraceful to admit it, even if they were.

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/14/2013 4:28:04 PM   
Olorin


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OK, who else went to see Hobbit 2? I did and it was brilliant!

Faster and with more action than the first one, but deviates from the book in the finale. I didn't mind, the changes were improvements, imo. The movie is too fast initially, but I guess that's intended.

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/14/2013 5:10:52 PM   
obvert


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Olorin

OK, who else went to see Hobbit 2? I did and it was brilliant!

Faster and with more action than the first one, but deviates from the book in the finale. I didn't mind, the changes were improvements, imo. The movie is too fast initially, but I guess that's intended.


Saw it!! Pretty damn good. Very action filled. Jackson struck and interesting balance between the story as told in the book and the big bold action of 3-D film. The Dwarf ride down the river fighting Orcs is a highlight, as is Evangeline Lilly (even though not in the book).

The ending is a bit abrupt. I don't like splitting the story like this. I'm interested to watch all together one day! (I haven't seen the first yet after the reviews and friends told me it sucked).

Loved the part showing Gandalf at Dol Guldur battling Sauron. Fun to see things not actually 'shown' in the book, also. I want more of it.

Silmarilion?

< Message edited by obvert -- 12/14/2013 6:13:02 PM >


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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/14/2013 6:05:35 PM   
Chickenboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

Silmarilion?


Dunno. There was a lot of 'begetting' in that one. So and so...son of so and so senior, descendent of such and such of the rock. Married to such and such, distant relative of....

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/15/2013 12:39:19 AM   
pws1225

 

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And back to the OP, any man that reads to their child from day one is a mighty good man indeed, LOTR or otherwise. Hats off to you Sir!

(P.S. - good to see Dan back on the boards. It's good to know you are alive and well)

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/15/2013 2:40:15 AM   
topeverest

 

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Canoerebel

With a name like les miserables, what can you expect! Only so many ways to tell an ironic sad story with a pinge of bitter happiness. That said, it is pretty hard to screw it up.

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/15/2013 11:03:28 AM   
Olorin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

Silmarilion?


Dunno. There was a lot of 'begetting' in that one. So and so...son of so and so senior, descendent of such and such of the rock. Married to such and such, distant relative of....


There are some standalone stories in there worthy of a movie, but they will never sell the copy rights. They expire sometime near 2040, so I expect a Silmarilion movie soon!


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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/15/2013 12:16:03 PM   
obvert


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

Silmarilion?


Dunno. There was a lot of 'begetting' in that one. So and so...son of so and so senior, descendent of such and such of the rock. Married to such and such, distant relative of....


It is a tad mythic, but I'd love to see what happened with the kings in the North, the Ice King of Dagmar and all that. The prequel to the Hobbit when Smaug moves in, and of course the combined armies of dwarves, elves and men taking on Sauron.

I guess all of that is not written as story, just as tales, remembrances and all.

They'll figure some way to do more I'm sure. Trouble is, not so many Hobbits.

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/15/2013 12:27:12 PM   
Speedy

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert


quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

Silmarilion?


Dunno. There was a lot of 'begetting' in that one. So and so...son of so and so senior, descendent of such and such of the rock. Married to such and such, distant relative of....


It is a tad mythic, but I'd love to see what happened with the kings in the North, the Ice King of Dagmar and all that. The prequel to the Hobbit when Smaug moves in, and of course the combined armies of dwarves, elves and men taking on Sauron.

I guess all of that is not written as story, just as tales, remembrances and all.

They'll figure some way to do more I'm sure. Trouble is, not so many Hobbits.


+1

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/15/2013 2:16:56 PM   
Encircled


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quote:

t is a tad mythic, but I'd love to see what happened with the kings in the North, the Ice King of Dagmar and all that.


Its in Unfinished tales. After Angmar destroyed the Kingdom of Carodlan (spelling?), a force from the still powerful realm of Gondor under the king's son landed and destroyed them, forcing the witch king to flee. The North was devastated by then though, so they never re-established the northern kingdoms.

The kings son became king of Gondor, and accepted an offer of single combat with the Witch King (once he was back as head of the Nazgul at Minas Mordor), was betrayed, died childless and the line of the kings of the south ended.

Bit more complicated than that,but you get the gist

< Message edited by Encircled -- 12/15/2013 3:17:40 PM >

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/15/2013 3:49:29 PM   
Chickenboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Encircled
Its in Unfinished tales.

Is that the one that his Tolkein's son published? I haven't read many of Junior's things, but from aficionados of the original stuff, they pale by comparison.

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/15/2013 4:25:17 PM   
obvert


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Encircled

quote:

t is a tad mythic, but I'd love to see what happened with the kings in the North, the Ice King of Dagmar and all that.


Its in Unfinished tales. After Angmar destroyed the Kingdom of Carodlan (spelling?), a force from the still powerful realm of Gondor under the king's son landed and destroyed them, forcing the witch king to flee. The North was devastated by then though, so they never re-established the northern kingdoms.

The kings son became king of Gondor, and accepted an offer of single combat with the Witch King (once he was back as head of the Nazgul at Minas Mordor), was betrayed, died childless and the line of the kings of the south ended.

Bit more complicated than that,but you get the gist


Yes, all of that. Lets have a film series of that. Angmar, not Dagmar.

I used to pore over the Atlas of Middle Earth that had a bunch of this stuff visualized. I haven't read Unfinished Tales though.

Speaking of that, when's the new Game of Thrones book out?


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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/15/2013 7:40:41 PM   
John 3rd


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quote:

ORIGINAL: pws1225

And back to the OP, any man that reads to their child from day one is a mighty good man indeed, LOTR or otherwise. Hats off to you Sir!

(P.S. - good to see Dan back on the boards. It's good to know you are alive and well)



The boys got LOTR from Day One as stated at the beginning of last year's thread. We've just done Sword of Shannara and Elfstones. Looks like Wishsong is next in our household.


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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/15/2013 7:43:04 PM   
John 3rd


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quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert


quote:

ORIGINAL: Encircled

quote:

t is a tad mythic, but I'd love to see what happened with the kings in the North, the Ice King of Dagmar and all that.


Its in Unfinished tales. After Angmar destroyed the Kingdom of Carodlan (spelling?), a force from the still powerful realm of Gondor under the king's son landed and destroyed them, forcing the witch king to flee. The North was devastated by then though, so they never re-established the northern kingdoms.

The kings son became king of Gondor, and accepted an offer of single combat with the Witch King (once he was back as head of the Nazgul at Minas Mordor), was betrayed, died childless and the line of the kings of the south ended.

Bit more complicated than that,but you get the gist


Yes, all of that. Lets have a film series of that. Angmar, not Dagmar.

I used to pore over the Atlas of Middle Earth that had a bunch of this stuff visualized. I haven't read Unfinished Tales though.

Speaking of that, when's the new Game of Thrones book out?



I thought the most recent Game of Thrones book was TERRIBLE. Nothing resolved and it APPEARS he killed off all my remaining favorite characters (ie John Snow).

Not happy with that book.


< Message edited by John 3rd -- 12/15/2013 8:43:49 PM >


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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/15/2013 7:48:21 PM   
geofflambert


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

Looking forward for it!
Loved Lotr books and movies, even if, i have to admit, that g.r.r.Martin wins, in my personal hit, hands down.
The biggest Tolkien's merti is, however, to have invented, completely from scratch, a whole new litteral gender.



I just noticed this thread for the first time. Big fan too. I presume GreyJoy meant literary genre. A literal gender could get him in trouble with the religious right.

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/15/2013 10:20:23 PM   
obvert


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quote:

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert


quote:

ORIGINAL: Encircled

quote:

t is a tad mythic, but I'd love to see what happened with the kings in the North, the Ice King of Dagmar and all that.


Its in Unfinished tales. After Angmar destroyed the Kingdom of Carodlan (spelling?), a force from the still powerful realm of Gondor under the king's son landed and destroyed them, forcing the witch king to flee. The North was devastated by then though, so they never re-established the northern kingdoms.

The kings son became king of Gondor, and accepted an offer of single combat with the Witch King (once he was back as head of the Nazgul at Minas Mordor), was betrayed, died childless and the line of the kings of the south ended.

Bit more complicated than that,but you get the gist


Yes, all of that. Lets have a film series of that. Angmar, not Dagmar.

I used to pore over the Atlas of Middle Earth that had a bunch of this stuff visualized. I haven't read Unfinished Tales though.

Speaking of that, when's the new Game of Thrones book out?



I thought the most recent Game of Thrones book was TERRIBLE. Nothing resolved and it APPEARS he killed off all my remaining favorite characters (ie John Snow).

Not happy with that book.



Nothing is resolved because there are 2-3k more pages of the final books to go through!

So many people get mad when a character dies. I never understand that! Also, if you remember when it seemed Tyrion was dead, Martin found a nifty way to keep him going. Seriously though, one of the things that does bug me about the LOR and Hobbit films is how nearly all of the heroes are seen dodging arrows and sword thrusts that should take them out several times over, and after the battle they look nice and fresh.

Tolkien is beautiful and mythological. Martin is gritty and uncompromising. I love both.

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RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/16/2013 7:24:18 AM   
Encircled


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Unfinished Tales is a collection of Tolkiens notes, tidied up by his son.

I've just grabbed it and it has a collection of stories from all three ages, which the best is probably the story of Turin son of Hurin

Its also got a good chapter on the alliance of Rohan and Gondor, a bit more about the disaster of the Gladden Fields and the battles of the fords of Isen.

Its worth a read

Oh, and according to internet rumours, John Snow is not dead!



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Post #: 119
RE: The Hobbit (OT) - 12/16/2013 11:13:39 AM   
obvert


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Encircled

Unfinished Tales is a collection of Tolkiens notes, tidied up by his son.

I've just grabbed it and it has a collection of stories from all three ages, which the best is probably the story of Turin son of Hurin

Its also got a good chapter on the alliance of Rohan and Gondor, a bit more about the disaster of the Gladden Fields and the battles of the fords of Isen.

Its worth a read

Oh, and according to internet rumours, John Snow is not dead!



I'm pretty positive he will end up doing some big things in the final books. He and Tyrion (who probably will eventually sacrifice himself for some greater cause) and Arya and Daenerys stormborn.

Ill have to get to the Unfinished Tales. Sounds like a good winter read. Feels a bit Middle Earth lately in the UK.

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"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm." - Winston Churchill

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