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The Dark Side

 
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The Dark Side - 9/12/2012 12:15:50 AM   
Jimbo123

 

Posts: 245
Joined: 10/11/2011
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Well I have decided to start chaining supplies. I now see the power of the dark side. After all the reading and reviewing of the rules and AAR's trying to recreate the results of the top players I just couldn't get close to recreating their success. This new game the poor Russian didn't know what hit him. Lenn captured on turn 7 ( no BU's but...... ) Across the Deptner turn 4. I hope my opponent hangs in there because I was so caught off guard by the possibilities that I am not close to taking full advantage. I don't think I have come close to beating him. Chaining is not as easy as it seems althought I know I will get much better at it. To the German players I say use it! You can cause enough damage to make a real game of it. To the Russians I say history is written by the victors!

Jimbo

Post #: 1
RE: The Dark Side - 9/12/2012 12:41:49 AM   
Disgruntled Veteran


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jimbo123

Well I have decided to start chaining supplies. I now see the power of the dark side. After all the reading and reviewing of the rules and AAR's trying to recreate the results of the top players I just couldn't get close to recreating their success. This new game the poor Russian didn't know what hit him. Lenn captured on turn 7 ( no BU's but...... ) Across the Deptner turn 4. I hope my opponent hangs in there because I was so caught off guard by the possibilities that I am not close to taking full advantage. I don't think I have come close to beating him. Chaining is not as easy as it seems althought I know I will get much better at it. To the German players I say use it! You can cause enough damage to make a real game of it. To the Russians I say history is written by the victors!

Jimbo





Yes, but what kind of kills are you getting? Pelton wrote a lot about chaining but I don't see a high kill list in his AAR's

(in reply to Jimbo123)
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RE: The Dark Side - 9/12/2012 12:59:24 AM   
Jimbo123

 

Posts: 245
Joined: 10/11/2011
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This off of memory

T8

1.6m losses
1.1m captured
aprox 50 units in pockets


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RE: The Dark Side - 9/12/2012 2:33:27 AM   
NotOneStepBack


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What exactly is "chaining"?

(in reply to Jimbo123)
Post #: 4
RE: The Dark Side - 9/12/2012 2:48:55 AM   
hfarrish


Posts: 750
Joined: 1/3/2011
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Disgruntled Veteran


Yes, but what kind of kills are you getting? Pelton wrote a lot about chaining but I don't see a high kill list in his AAR's


Some of that is due to the fact that his opponents know he is going to chain (as pretty much a pure Soviet player I don't really know how to do it either, I just know to respect what it can achieve) and adjust their strategies (i.e. don't keep anything you can't lose within pocket distance) as a result.

Michael T seems to have contained it, but we'll see...even then that game may be a case of MT knowing exactly what Pelton was going to do since it had been telegraphed in 7 previous AARs...

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RE: The Dark Side - 9/12/2012 3:15:41 AM   
Jimbo123

 

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I would enter chaining in the search tab of the forum and follow the threads. They go into great detail and rhet are really the experts. I don't believe a German player can be competitive against a solid russian player without it and I have many campaign losses to prove it.

(in reply to Jimbo123)
Post #: 6
RE: The Dark Side - 9/12/2012 4:20:37 AM   
Pelton

 

Posts: 6061
Joined: 4/9/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jimbo123

I would enter chaining in the search tab of the forum and follow the threads. They go into great detail and rhet are really the experts. I don't believe a German player can be competitive against a solid russian player without it and I have many campaign losses to prove it.


It will only work now vs SHC that fight forward as brian did vs me. By December 1st he has lost 4 million men. His OOB is at 4.08 million.

If a SHC runs as in all my other AAR's its not effective at all. Bobo ran then fought forward a little to early, lost 3 million.

Hugh ran and lost 2.5. The 1 SHC game I have going I lost 2.5 million.

Basicly after 1.06.13 vs any SHC player that wants to he can easly have under 3 million dead.

Chaining can still easly crush and SHC that fights forward causing 4 million dead by December.

I beleive I am only GHC player in a posted AAR that has gotten 4+ million dead after 1.06.13.

So getting 4+ million is easly possible, but most SHC players including myself will simply delay and hold Moscow NP. Not really that hard to do now.

The new trick is holding Leningrad which I beleive now is totally possible as Moscow is a given to hold and the south is a complete side show. Evacing the industry is again really about as hard as breathing.

Now that you have that down you will be able to easly crush and newbies or peeps fighting forward you need to get down surviving the blizzard and infantry tactics in 42.

Great job dude post some pictures.



_____________________________

GHC
22 - 4 - 8

15 games ended in 41 (15-0-0)
7 games ended in 42 (5-0-2)
8 games ended in 43 (2-3-3)
4 games ended in 44 (0-1-3)


General Cheesefinder of WitW

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-uyENm3T-0

(in reply to Jimbo123)
Post #: 7
RE: The Dark Side - 9/12/2012 12:17:03 PM   
delatbabel


Posts: 1246
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From: Sydney, Australia
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I can't believe you can suggest Leningrad can be held against chaining (which is the new mules, really). I have opponents here that regularly take Leningrad on turn 4, there's no serious way you can hold it past 17 unless the Germans let you do that to bottle up the units. Similarly, against a player that chains, the Russians have no real alternative other than to Sir Robinovsky unless they want to lose 3-4 million men, and that pretty much dooms Moscow.

Getting the industry out is easy enough, though, and Moscow can usually be retaken in the winter. It's a big manpower hit, though.


_____________________________

--
Del

(in reply to Pelton)
Post #: 8
RE: The Dark Side - 9/13/2012 1:58:18 PM   
Pelton

 

Posts: 6061
Joined: 4/9/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: delatbabel

I can't believe you can suggest Leningrad can be held against chaining (which is the new mules, really). I have opponents here that regularly take Leningrad on turn 4, there's no serious way you can hold it past 17 unless the Germans let you do that to bottle up the units. Similarly, against a player that chains, the Russians have no real alternative other than to Sir Robinovsky unless they want to lose 3-4 million men, and that pretty much dooms Moscow.

Getting the industry out is easy enough, though, and Moscow can usually be retaken in the winter. It's a big manpower hit, though.



After 1.06.13 if your lossing Leningrad on turn 4 you clearly are doing allot wrong. Also I have not seen Moscow lost, many close calls. If your any good Moscow is easyly held during 1941.

Leningrad if you move troops from the south is a hard nut to crack.

Chaining is nothing like muling and you should really not comment on things you have zero idea what your talking about.

Muling before .13 basicly a skilled GHC player could keep 100% of panzer units at plus 35 MP for 17 turns.

Chaining you can only keep 2 Corps at 35 MPs for the summer and not the same one for more then a turn.

You have to rotate 3 Corps. Chianing is very very easly countered in North/Center above Tula. In the south it is effective from turns 1-7 and 11-17

_____________________________

GHC
22 - 4 - 8

15 games ended in 41 (15-0-0)
7 games ended in 42 (5-0-2)
8 games ended in 43 (2-3-3)
4 games ended in 44 (0-1-3)


General Cheesefinder of WitW

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-uyENm3T-0

(in reply to delatbabel)
Post #: 9
RE: The Dark Side - 9/13/2012 3:42:06 PM   
Flaviusx


Posts: 6398
Joined: 9/9/2009
From: Southern California
Status: offline
You have to go all in if you want to hold Leningrad. No half measures.

_____________________________

WitE Alpha Tester

(in reply to Pelton)
Post #: 10
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